Watch Now: chasejarvisLIVE with swissmiss
Hello. Thank you. Whoa! I almost kicked over the table. That way to start the show. Thank you so much. Welcome to in the episode of Chase Travis Live. I am chased, Jarvis, and we're here in San Francisco for Design Week. Can I hear something for Design Week? Shut it out. Right. We have a packed house standing room only, um, I wanted to start the show by thanking handful of folks. I want to thank the A I g a for without this. Without whom this would not be possible. That's the largest chapter. The GS A I g a s f dot org's. Thank you guys. So much. Borrow lenses is where I rent my camera gear and huge shadow to creativelive. Who's making all this possible? Ah, fantastic. We've had a contest that's been going on since we announced the show a week ago, and they were tweeting and Facebook and giving a shout out to the show drive as much traffic as possible to this u r l and the winners. We got two people in there, each winning a $200 gift certificate to creativelive. And those winners are a...
t photo Danno and at in space between thank you guys very much for prop in the show, and it's just send an email to production at chase drivers dot com. We'll get you sorted. Um, as always, questions. We're taking your questions, whether you're in Nebraska or Nairobi or just down the street at hashtag CJ Live. You can put those questions on Twitter on Facebook at the creative live Facebook page or the Chase Jarvis Facebook page. And we will answer your questions right here without further ado my guest today, she is literally the reason that I ever had an Internet presence. I looked at what she did online was super inspired. She was a design force of nature. She moved from Switzerland to New York, had a job, is a designer within 12 hours of landing and has never left since. And that was like 15 years ago. And then she did this really amazing thing. She got really sick of all her clients. So she dropped them all and turned to becoming an entrepreneur where she started not one, not two, not even three but four amazing companies that will learn about today. Uh, you know her. I know her and love her. Tina Roth Eisenberg. A case Smith thing when she left from New York and landed in San Francisco last night. I got it. I knew she was in town because I got a great text when she landed. Said, Yea, California exclamation point. You are in California. I'm so happy to be here Design week. And look at this. Yes, Standing room only. It's totally packed. Thank you, guys, for bring with us. We don't have enough chairs. We didn't expect the last minute steamroll, but, um, this about you. So welcome. Thank you. You're here? Yes. And you're wearing a tie? Yes. Eyes is the first time any Chase service life show everyone. It's I felt inspired. Yeah, thanks very much. Thank you. Actually, I don't want to get a precursor, but you're not done actually touching me. There's gonna be some or more later in the show, which I talked about that in a second. Uh, so I entered the show with the little story about you dropping into New York from Cyst to New York, and 12 hours later, you had a job and you were told you're never gonna leave. Yeah, and Actually, the person that told me that happens to be in the audience. Is Matthew right there? Yeah. Doesn't It wasn't Mike. We're gonna go straight to a mike. I mean, the story from him. Messi was my first boss is your first boss. And can you give us just like a 32nd version of what it was like when you met her for the very first time? Well, she had this amazing energy, and she was very open, and she was also very talented. And I've been to Germany, and I've been to Switzerland and a little bit of a psychic on the pie sees I don't if you believe in astrology, bring it on. I just blurt it out to her. I said she I asked you what? Your plans after school. And she said, Well, I'm here in New York to see if I can find an internship, and I'll go back after six months, three months or three months. She said, all right. And I was like, No, Tina, you're going to stay here. You're never gonna leave New York. This is your home. You're gonna marry a nice Jewish guy on. Um I don't really self edit. So I didn't realize that she was a offended. She really felt that I was being presumptuous. Like you just met me. How can you say something like that? Very Swiss of her to think that she didn't say that. Swiss very quite. And, uh, you know, spend. It's such a pleasure and an honor to watch her career. Like to have someone that works for you. Just surpassed your just blow, right? Right. Yeah, it's someone great. Thank you very much for sharing robbery. Really appreciate it. And so it's true. I was wondering, like, 12 hours. That's pretty. So you landed any in New York the next morning, Had a job interview, and yeah, well, Matthew said I can sit down and start working, and I was OK, you know? Yeah, he really did. And I just graduated from graphic design school and I was literally burned out, and I was hoping that he would take me a few weeks until a finding internships so I can't enjoy New York. No, that didn't happen. So you went right into a design job with him. A few weeks later, they offered me a full time job like you offer me. That's the shortest internship in the history of the world. And I'm internally grateful because I mean, now I'm on the I mean Matthew shoes and I take chances on young people. And I always think of Matthew that you know, that moment where he just I figured, you know, let's try this. Let's give her a chance. So he talks about being psychic for the folks at home and said, It's, ah, the audience here in the live in studio and the folks at around the world tuning in right now, Um, there of the creative class. And if you could give them some advice like when you're looking for someone to take a chance on what's Ah, like, what do you look for? How do you know that this person has the what it takes? Well, psychic, But you have to have some sort of you forgot a few psychic. He's definitely not psychic if you can't remember, if you say you're not. But what about you? You get well, I you know I have I have, like, now, a team of 18 or 19 and a lot of them are in their early twenties, and to me it all comes down to just when you get a sense that somebody is really hungry to just do good work, they really want to make a difference. They want to make a dent if I sense that and they have good personalities again of the day, I don't really care about, you know, their resume. In the end of the day, what I always ask is, So what are you, side project? That's usually what I ask in a job interview, because if somebody has to hustle toe, self initiate and start things on the side, that's the kind of personality I want to work with, right? Well, this is like perfect, because that's the title of the show is like It's really all about that your side hustle that your side gave your side projects are the things that are gonna make the difference in your career are gonna pick you to the next level. And so if I could be super explicit, that's something that you look for when someone's coming. And what if they say I only want to work here and this is the only? This is my whole life is that is that showing commitment? Isn't this a place with the reason why I ask, That is because I'm a very unusual boss in that I give a lot of freedom. And if I have someone that needs a lot of guidance, if someone and there's nothing wrong with that, I just understand there's different types of how you work, and there's people that want a lot of guidance that want to be told all the time, what they need to do. And there's again. There's nothing wrong with that. That's just not how I work. I like to give someone, like, sort of like a like, sort of clear directions on what their roller. But then there's freedom to just explore him and put their own stamp on it and just be sort of a self starter. And that side project question is really an indication that they ourself started cause they got a bunch of interests, got it? Well, speaking of a bunch of interest, there's somebody I know who has a bunch of interests, and I've been the New York twice in last month to spend some time with you, and you're always in a difference so she's got, basically, have the whole floor. This place in Brooklyn? Not almost almost. You have the whole floor. I'll strike that and you're never in one place. Your your bouncing a little place. Do you think that's an asset for Creative? I was told my whole career they had to pick one thing and be the best at it. And like you, I rejected that premise and I believe, very similar in that regard. Yeah, that's why I wanted you on the show. Makes me feel good. But isn't it true? And don't you find that in design community, you're told that you have to be the best illustrator of the best acts of the best, you know, typeface. And that isn't it. Isn't that sort of limiting? And isn't that area part of a new chapter now? No. I mean, I think there's nothing wrong with that. It's just you need to know what works for you, right? I just know if I'm just the best user interface designer, I wouldn't be happy because that would not be enough for me, right? So what? I want to be the best that is being the most enthusiastic person that motivates teams and maybe comes up with new ideas, right? So that's my goal of being the best at. So I That's what I aspired to write. So in some sense that applies. It's just not on being a graphic designer. Percy. Well, that dovetails nicely with what? The open excitement if he felt that enthusiasm for you. And I think if that's I'm not mistaken, you're well known for asking this question of if you could, you know, what is your superpower? I think we actually have a graphic of you as what is What's the name of your superhero Captain? Enthusiasm, Captain Enthusiasm. I think we've got enough. We got one up on the little Can. I just say that this is the weirdest thing ever. Having to art director and illustrator who have found on deviant art of all places on day I asked her because I found a drawing of this woman, made a drawing off the Justice League, and I asked her if she could draw me as a superhero. She's like, Absolutely, what's your outfit? And I'm like, Wait, what? I mean, so I read your own. I ran down to top me my gym Chinese guys, If I was a super Europe, what do I look like? And that was like one of my favorite 10 minute conversations with my team I've ever had, like one of the things that I think, Karen said, like confetti cannons. Just spend five minutes today thinking about if you had to art direct your superhero outfit what it would look like Caller cape, No cape, you know, boots. No boots like these really important questions. But what it stands for without a doubt is what year strength is in your strength, where you have many strengths and know in this room. Would I doubt that? Because I've been inspired by you on so many different levels. But enthusiasm is huge. Talk about how that, like, permeates through your work. Well, I have been thinking about the superpower thing a lot, and umm I've asked very successful people. What is your secret superpower? And what I've noticed is that suit this, the very successful people could answer it right away. So it seems there is a correlation between really recognizing what you good at and then really putting that to use. Right? So that's something I think about a lot. And and I think that enthusiasm, like grazing enthusiasm on Pete amongst people, is my my biggest asset. Hands down. Um, because I eat, for example, was something like creative mornings. When I started that lecture series, everyone told me You're out of your mind doing a free see breakfast series, Not charging, um, trying to find venues that will host you for free on. And also at 8 30 no New Yorker will show up a day 30. But when I just, like, come in with my ball of enthusiasm, people eventually go like, yeah, maybe she's onto something right? So I just like Stroup him over so that really, I think, is my biggest asset. And so here's an interesting one that I thought about, Um, some people say confidence will do the same thing, and I disagree, because confidence is impressive, right? Enthusiasm is infectious. Confidence is about yourself, and enthusiasm is about something else. I think that might get tweeted a few times. You said that one more time. It's confidence is about yourself. Yourself. Enthusiasm is about something else, so enthusiasm is infectious and confidence is just impressive. But in the end, of the day. Infectious fun stuff wins over brag e about yourself stuff, right that this is a bunch of nuggets in there, for sure. And so that's basically the genesis of career mornings, which I want to postpone that part of the conversation a little bit because I got a few things don't want to get to before then, Um, the this infectious enthusiasm that you carry around with you. That's something I'm guessing you're sniffing when you're hiring designers and other creative photographers. Illustrators, there's Do you seek that enthuses. We just brought talent or is a talent plus this desire to start extra projects? Or like, what's the cocktail that Swiss miss looks for when she hires people? Because that's again, I know that there's a huge population of creatives we're watching, and that's one of the things is how do I get my next job? How do I get better at my craft? I would say my cocktail is I look for self starters. As I said, people that can start started things on their own in the past. Um, no ego, humility, um, excitement around, making something meaningful, Um, and then just hustle, hustle, hustles I think, one of the most underrated qualities. I don't know that it's really unsexy to talk about hustles someone have had on the show. Gary Vaynerchuk got enough. Gary, He's like Mr Hustle. That's one of the only things he talks about. But it's clearly an important factor in all of the people that I know who have gone on to do really exciting, impressive things. So, um oh, file that file that away. So I do like one of the things that you have been widely noted about is ditching your clients. Now most people are hustling to get clients. She's the only person I know that hustled to fire everyone that was hiring her. So what's the story behind that? Because that's very, very different. That's people like, I want to make money by my trade and doing the things that I love. And then if you fire everybody, there's no one to pay you. So paint a picture for us at home here. Well, so I trained as a graphic designer, and ever since I started working as a graphic designer, sort of. My dream was always to have my own design studio, right, so that's sort of what you aspired to, I guess most. And, uh, when I had not respect with my daughter, I realized, Wait a second. I still don't run my own design studio, So I kind of said, Let's start it. So the day my daughter was born, I started my design studio because that was always my dream. So here I was. I had very prestigious clients, more clients that could handle. And I was chugging along and I realized I wasn't really happy. So then I got pregnant with my son three years later, and I think that pregnancy thing induces like a lot of thinking in my head. And I I realized, Wait a second. I have my design studio that I always wanted, but I am really not happy. And then I realized that I am just not made for the service industry. Um, the but disappointing someone like If I literally pour everything into like if somebody wants me to make their website, I will give it all, and I will make the product that I am, that the best product I can make. And if then the client is still not happy. That crushes my soul. So I've realized there's people that are made for the service industry and have a think of skin, and I am not debt. And then I sort of looked at my life when I looked at what makes me happy, and I realized it was decide Project that I've literally just started sort of as a fun thing on the side, and I thought, maybe I can focus on them, or maybe they can turn into businesses, and that's what I did. So when on the one year client sabbatical, when my son was born, it's so ironic. I started my studio. My daughter was born. No one under one your clients about. It seems like you're doing everything backwards. Yeah, I love that you're doing everything. You you have a design studio, and then you take a year off to have your child not use, have a child, and then you start your design studio. That's that's backwards. But I love that that there's a 1,000,000 path these days to whatever it is you want to be. I want to interject, is to second and say, I'm chased. Jarvis, I'm here with Tina Roth Eisenberg, a k a. Swiss Miss. We're here at San Francisco Design Week. If you want to ask a question from anywhere in the world, we're taking questions at hashtag CJ Live, and I forgot to introduce a contest that's happening right now if you are out there in the world and you hear something amazing that Tina says or I say, But let's let's face it, she's gonna drop all the wisdom here. Um, and you give us that quote hashtag CJ live and a link to this broadcast right here, biscuit way to spread the word on the Internet. We will pick one of those quotes at the end of the show and give away that GoPro camera right there. And I love those things. I've that has really transformed a lot of my work will take that Cameron put anywhere so get to quote, tweeting and whatnot out there in the world that I give that challenge My sister to Windows, since what's along? Oh, that's right. Weight on it. Somebody wants Teoh again. Hashtag c July of the quote and a link to this page. So we're taking your questions, and I asked that there was a handful of questions early on in the in the live in studio audience, and I ask people to hold off on tell the broadcast they're going, So I'm gonna go to you in just a second. But I'm going to open with the floor with sort of what I think is a big ish question. How do you do? What you love is I've heard you say it a lot. How do you know that you're doing what you love, what you do or love what you do. So what if you're you didn't love serving clients so love? What you do is that's to me. That's a tough proposition, because me just telling you to love what you do when you're serving clients isn't really that's not much of an opportunity or solution. So if the question is, do what were the The request is to do what you love and you will be happy. The question I get asked all the time and I've asked myself before, is how do you know if you're doing something that you love? Well, if you never have to think about, do I want to do this like I just goingto work getting up in the morning. Like I know it sounds so cheesy. But to me, work and life, I mean to private what? My personal life and my work. It's all a blur. And I think that, to me is a sign that I that I found my sweet spot, right? Yeah, there's so I understand the idea of keeping your life separate from your work. I feel like what you just described totally, Um is the picture that my life is as well My my work, my professional, my personal life is all wound up into one thing. And I think that what a lot of people that I know who are watching today are very much looking for courage to actually put a stake in the ground and saying and saying I'm actually not happy in this job, but I'm doing can just share personal stories through the only reason you're here in San Francisco. Yes. Wait. Do you want to hear a personal story? Okay, right now, the whole Internet. So my personal goal is to have two Children, right for T lawyers for my my daughter ls eight. And my big goal is to raise them in a way that they will not settle for anything else than a job that did thoroughly love, right? So that's really important to me. And so on Mondays, I take my daughter out for dinner. We have a dinner date, and about three or four weeks ago we're sitting there and she's eight, and I sat there in to say hello. Do you actually know what I do at work all day? And she just very nonchalant, said, Yeah, you sit at your computer and you laugh. I thought, Well, that's the best answer ever because it's true. And then I took a second. I said, Well, wait, What do you mean? As in I like what I do. I'm having fun. And she looked at me seriously annoyed. And she goes yet isn't that the whole point? Well, I I did a little dance. Yeah, I think that this parenting thing is working, but that is that's so inspiration to so many of us. And if we go back in history a little bit when you started blogging, I think it was 2005 wasn't it? I was reading your stuff in in 2006. I said, Wow, I'm going to this site every day to get inspiration, and it's so designed centric. Maybe I could start blogging and doing it on my own. And ironically, the other person who was really important to me in that regard was Craig Swanson, who's my co founder here at Creativelive. He said You should talk about photography. And so the two of you guys combined to help me have a presence on the Internet, which is definitively the reason I think we're sitting here today. So that is amazing, isn't it? Yeah, I was learning if you wanted, you did away of it. One of your things, right? You want to do the wave here? Yeah, they should do it at my recent 99 Utah. I have this amazing slight that my studio mate friend and she's an illustrator. Jim Massari made like this animated GIF off says, Yea, gannett. And there's cats and cosmos in the back and and and I just basically made the whole audience. At 99 you stand up and scream. Yea, and it should we do that? We do that. OK, Is it a stand up to huh? Standing. So here's one of the ways standing up When you say is these guys got to stand up because you are directing enormous. Do they stand up on the Internet today? Is it a one motion yet? Okay, so remember, you have people close to your right way. Killed four people today in the studio. And you folks at home in the Internet, can we ask them to do it? Is this is the world is doing it yet? That is doing the largest Internet wave in the history of the Internet. Yeah. I love this. Okay, so you want to count it down? What is it? You're so nervous. 123 Okay. 123 and 88 tonight. Okay. I wanted to be your thing. I won't do it right. E o. All right, All right. Amazing. So be cigarette. So Hey, hey, Internet. That was amazing. You have any questions from the live in our in studio audience that, you know, it's not every day you get Teoh, sit in the room with someone like Tina, So please ask away again. I'm chased. Were sitting here a tina, if you're in the Internet, feel street. Ask a question hashtag CD live through. A quote in there will give you a GoPro camera back to you, my good man. Hi. Yeah, I do have a closer you are to Oh, I'm Daniel. I'm actually a student studying computer science. But just being a creative type, I guess also, with 44 companies and four things that you're working on right now, how do you find the focus too? To focus on, like, one thing and not always be, like, tossed aside by one day waking up. Oh, I have this idea And then like getting Lawson and you know, constantly new ideas. Does that make sense? Because it's a very real question. Well, I I don't allow myself to start anything new right now. So there's a moratorium on new stuff. Yeah. Yeah. So that is not happening Unless I drop something. It's like when I buy a new pair of she was one should pair of shoes. Gotta go. Um, but then again, I mean, it all comes down to having really good teams. And that's why you explained why you hired away or higher is that people need to be very self sufficient. I'm just really that like Ben Chest not give a really wonderful talk Creative Mornings talk. He's the co founder of Male Chimp, and in that it there, he explains. He's like a B that he's a CEO. That sort of floats around the company. It's a really great talking how he runs his creative environment, and that's kind of how I feel right now is like while I'm still very hands on. I'm also kind of like that. Be that just sort of floats around. And that's how I I am able to run these thes several companies, and then some of them are more hands on than in others. But does that answer your question? Yes, kind of. But I'm gonna go one level deeper because I'm saying that's actually sort of a non answer because there's a little bit notice respect, But there's a little bit. It's It's hard toe like it's hard to do four of the things that you have done well, so are you the like polymath supreme? Are you just, like, different than everybody else? Or do you have some sort of a system that you apply to? Is it are there like a bunch of balls in the air. When one gets really low, you reached out and throw it back up in the air. Or do you do Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday, The folks that have a lot of projects out there, They want to know how you do it. Yeah, um, yeah, the ball, the bowl thing, that kinda is it. They're all working until one stops working and then you catch it and throw it back up. No, but, I mean, if you look at the four things I do creative mornings and tapley does are my main focus is so when you say four, I think that's not really true. I would say I run two things because studio mates to Coworking space kind of runs on its own. That's not really something that needs much of my attention. And then to do that to do up I made were a team, and I mean we could work away more into today, but we're not. If we poured more Lawton attention into it, they could blossom even more. But it's not really our main focus. So I think in the end of the day I would say I work on two so there are some prioritization. Is that air happening again? I'm trying to give real concrete feedback. There are some privatisations that are going on and even if it's just two things you were massaging their supporting both those in a way that the best you can and when one needs some love. You poor little extra on there. Yes, and having good people around you is key. Yes. So can we talk a little bit more about the good people around you? Actually anywhere. Questions from the insidious. We'll take a look at one of front here owing to a front. All right, we'll try and get through a couple of these real quick and then we'll go to the Internets because they got some questions of their own you that might get 18. I'm Zane. I run a software development agency, Culture, media, and I'm interested. Annoying. What are some of your daily habits and rituals that sort of followed? Keep you creative and make sure that you're getting things that you need to get done. I wish I had a really deep answer. Um, come to work. It's a great question. I come to work and I check in with my teams and I mean, I really don't have a routine. I'm sorry. I wish I had, like, some magic. And so did you guys can, you know, sit down and say like, this is what I'm gonna do. I have coffee, and I check in with my teams. And then whoever yells the loudest and needs my attention gets my attention. Is that yes. What about there? Any productivity tools? Or are things that use, like, what are some of the things that you rely on to help you stay organized and would not Well, my app. Sorry, my own up. Well, I created a I made the list maker. I believe in lists. Eso I created a this app called to do, um and it's like, basic account of you have it as my browser window. It's like whenever I open a new browser when the which is all the time, it sort of hits me over the head. What I need to get done. And the beauty of it is whatever you haven't done today and check off rolls over to the next day so you don't have to write it down again. So it's very simple. If you like lists, you see when you ask the next question. Now you find out there's something under that. So it's to Dio It's tender. Yeah, without to do it be a complete miss Free downloaded on the Internet or 10 bucks, huh? Used to be free. We, unfortunately had to move it to a paid model, so but it's depressing. Nice gets $2 a month to 99 months. Any orders that there's a skeptic and believer mode? I love that. My my partner Cameron, came up with this. Like when you sign up, you can I to be a skeptic and pay monthly. It would be a believer ple cool. So I constantly get people come up to me. I'm a believer. Um, you x t u x d u x today way couldn't find it to do your l. So we just have, like helping a French pronounced this. I'm sorry I don't want to upset any friends, but the beauty of it is, there's a someday section where you can have like in the bottom, where you can have multiple. You can customize two columns, two headers, and I just need to get stuff out of my head sometimes. Like it just There's too much in here. Yes, but by putting it into the Tudor, I feel like I have a handle on things. You put it into the to do that. So there's at least a little structure to the magic that happens. Any follow up questions, you feel like you got every you need. Yeah, I know what a typical day looks like for you. Coffee? Todo answer Ever. You might pass that mike right across the hall there. E u x d u x. Yeah, Thank you. And we'll probably lower thirds going on and tell us who you are. I'm a photographer. Yes, and I'm wondering this is actually a little bit for both of you. What do you guys do? Toe? Stay excited. Fired? Not once. You know I'm happy Answer, cause I, um inspiration is eyes very, very important. And I take at two months. It's like serious inspiration. And then there I have, which is almost looks and smells like research. And then I have, like, a sort of daily inspiration, and that's the way took the daily one first. It's really loving what you do I need to be energized and be excited to get in and come to work every day and been spending a lot of time here. It creativelive since I took over is the CEO and there's so much opportunity, so much pleasure, so much passion, the walls here in San Francisco and the location in Seattle. Just that inspiration that you know, you know you're on the right path if when you wake up in the morning it even if this stuff, the shit is hard, but you actually want to get into it. And if you're doing something that you shouldn't be doing that stuff, that's that's hard is like Oh my God, I can't do this. You might want to think about something different cause I can tell you the people that are on the right path, they wake up that that thing that's hard is there to keep everybody else out, not to keep you out. So I I wake up every day and I make sure I look myself in the mirror. I think Steve Jobs said this a couple times that if you're looking yourself in the mirror and too many days in a row. You're not happy, then you need to be doing something else. I just need to make sure that I'm doing it. So it's a daily inspiration of like, I like my life. And then there's the other stuff. I look at people like Tina, what she's doing. I put myself around great people. I'm Annette extra vert by my not met. No e um, I put myself around amazing people. That's another thing. That why my photography and creative communities been important, that creativelive community getting to work here in Silicon Valley and Seattle around the some of the best and brightest. It's really it's key to inspirations. Putting yourself around other people who love what they do as much as you do. So those are my two, um, check boxes And yours, my lady. Um, so you question was What keeps me inspired? Yeah. What do you do for inspiration? Life? Well, there's the Internet. That's no, I mean, if you were just a somewhat curious person, um, life. It's just so interesting and inspiring. And and it's what you said. Like, for example, the Coworking space I created called studio mates. I am surrounded by some of the most talented creative people I could ever dream off. There's photographers, developers, illustrators, writers, you name it. So it's my daily little tech conference over lunch or just being surrounded by people that really, really passionate and excited what they do about what they do. Um, that's just interesting. Right there. Like every conversation we have end up ends up being like this nugget that day drop, you know, things they work on. So it's like surround yourself of really interesting creative people and just be curious about life. That studio maids thing is a great example. That's one. The reasons that we have a physical audience here. It creativelive a non chase drivers life so that we're all Internet friends, right? Were tweeting and facebooking and all instagramming back and forth. But we get to get together and hang out. We're going to take some pictures. After this, we're gonna have some coffee and mingle. There's this beautiful thing about people actually getting together and then a I G s F design week. You got John Maeda here. You're here and I mean, it's a it's full of amazing people coming together in physical proximity, so I think That's a good dose of inspiration. I hope we got your question. Awesome. Now I'm going to the Internet. You guys pontificate in and around your next question cause I'm not done with you all. Yet the folks out on the Internet one a couple of questions, this one at swell designs, says Brookins. All about the hustle. How much influence has the borough had on your career? Very good question. How much influence has Brooklyn head on my career? Yes. Okay, So I'm the unofficial ambassador of Brooklyn. Wow. So I make everyone moved to Brooklyn that starts working for me. I usually ask, Ready, live. And then, if they don't leave them, broken his tent, collecting votes for the next election. Don't know it. Just like I want to convince everyone to live in Brooklyn. I'm a big fan of Brooklyn. Um, I feel like I had to growth in Switzerland, then to my hat for one year to then discover Brooklyn as my home. I mean broken. I don't know. I don't know if this question it's just There's lots of lots of interesting people in Brooklyn. It's a very dense, very something that would be the largest city in the country if it was its own country. I think it's like, very screwed up 1/5 largest city in the country if it were its own city. When you're just like every time I go to the playground and with my kids and I start talking with the kids. He qualified that with the camp, not just myself. I end up like meeting super interesting, creative people that you know, do really cool stuff. So go Brooklyn. Go Brooklyn. I think that's a very astute, like, you know, shout out to swell, designed for recognizing that the place that you live actually has some bear on the mindset and it's not required. But, um, certainly on my background here in San Francisco and specifically Seattle music, all that stuff have been hugely influenced, influential for me. And I, like you have a big fan of Brooklyn at Sky 8 20 wants to know how to differentiate between a super power and an interest. What is the tipping point that transforms your interest into the superpower? Well, if you're really interested in something and you spend a lot of time thinking about that and doing that, you probably going to get good at it. And then it turns into a superpower that can you have multiple superpowers? Yeah. Wow. Nothing so nice. That's good to know. I'm aspiring to multiple. Super. Um, if you're just tuning and I'm chase, I'm here with Tina Roth Eisenberg, a k Swiss mess were at Design Week s f with a I g s f big thanks to those guys. If you here in stuff that she's saying that you, like, throw that quote in a tweet or a Facebook post with hashtag CJ live and a link to this year show right now and we will be given away a GoPro camera and I'm gonna go back to the phones shortly. But in the meantime, I want to get into the meat of the matter on your actual cos we've been dancing around a little bit. We've referenced them. I kicked off this big fancy intro that said you had four. And then halfway through the show, you told me on the head too. So we're gonna say I only have two. I'm focusing more focusing on two. So the two that you decided not to focus on that actually better way of putting it run themselves is studio mates, so give us a debrief on that guy. What studio mates Studio mates is a co working space. I started, uh, seven years ago, I think, in Dumbo in Brooklyn, in Dumbo, Brooklyn, which started out with one room for people. And we've been continuously breaking down walls. And now we're 60. Insane, awesome. And generally speaking, that's just a coworking space where what you rent is a desk and what you get that's more than a desk is. It's sort of a one plus one equals three, right? You get this community of like minded people when Ugo, what makes new me is really special, because I mean now, every I think the new thing is to run a co working space. That's really I feel like everyone is running one right now, and that's cool because I believe in people you know. There's so many more freelancers now. I believe in getting together in a room with other like minded people. That's important. What I see, though, is that a lot of co working spaces day just he rent a desk and then you got to just come in and sit wherever you want. To me, it's always been super important that you you have your domain, you have your desk that is your area and that people are really dare like. I always say when people interested in a desk like you have to be part of this committee, you have to be here. And if people don't show up, like for a month to I mean sometimes, of course you have a gig and you might travel better. If you're generally not around, we will kick you out because we really want you to be part of the community and, you know, be there contributing like you want to actually do something like You can't just take you need to be able to get so that I think that's what makes studio mates really amazing. To be honest, I wouldn't have started these these companies if it wasn't forward. A tremendous support and respect I got from my studio mates. What was that was the suit with studio mates. The first thing that you started, Yeah, I mean, I I ran my design studio. Basically, it started out in studio mates. Got it. So Studio mates design studio, served a bunch of clients, talk about getting sick of him and wanted to do something else. Because I think there's a lot of folks there's a love hate double in sort, if you will. Folks that clients for the people who have created careers, were freelancers that you just mentioned. They are the lifeblood for us because they pay our bills. They we do work for them and they write us a check. And then we put that check in the bank. You don't have any clients anymore. So tell the people that their clients is just having clients is one option and paint a picture for the rest of us. What other options look like? I feel like clients get a really bag rep. Right now, I feel like that's not that's not want the picture picture one paint. I just realized self aware that I am not made for the service industry. I am not the person to have clients, For example, a Michael Beirut partner, a pentagram, given amazing talk on how he looks at the client service model and how he looked. I mean, if you have clients, look up the creative mornings talk with Michael Beirut. It's the best thing ever. And when I heard that I was like Michael, you are made for service in the street. Me, I'm not right. So let's not have give the club's about recall. But what about folks that burn out like we'll use myself as an example? The used to try and have a lot of clients because it meant it was a rough aggregate of success for me because going from self top photographer to not have any clients to having someone to help me, to give me work, to pay my bills. That was a sign of something. And then, over time, sort of paralleled building an audience, I started to be able to rely a little bit less on them. Is it fair to have a balancers at all? Or none thing it's all clans or no clients. No, I always advise. People try to have, like a, um, sort of a passive income. I I think the secret to a creative life. So did magic sauce. If you can build up a passive income and some sorts like if you can sort of maybe sustained yourself with its a 80% client project and maybe 20% you can spend on building an app or a service or whatever it is. That's sort of the former Google model. I really believe that that's what I would aspire to if I would. I mean, I was very lucky that I had my block that sort of created passive income very slowly, and that's that's why I was able to go on that one, your client sabbatical. So I would advise anyone who wants to potentially get out of it, try to, like, build up something that could start generating, you know, a product, a service, whatever that is. And it's passive income. You did you read my cheat sheet because passive incomes and bowled over there was gonna get that you taught me not to look over there. So I think that's fantastic advice. So it let me go linearly Studio mates, co working That would offset the office costs in the studio cost. Then you had a design firm that you grew and were working for clients. Got tired of that started, creates a passive income with your blawg, and then you I had a couple of other projects that started, creates and passive income. When did to do come along relative to tat Lee? A. Really very early after I started the studio mates Coworking space because it came out of a lunch conversation with my studio, made Cameron coz on where I walked over to lunch area and a sewing work on the to do up that I really don't like. And I said, Can you tell me like, What do you like about this up? So we went into this epic lunch conversation around to do ups, and I was sitting there very passionately, like sketching out like This is what I need, But ever you everything is about too many bells and whistles. Next thing you know, he says, he's a Tina. You designed it. I'll build it. And, like literally 48 hours, we had a working prototype. So today came out of studio mates. Wow. So again, that's just a great I think example. Tamale. You put yourself around inspiring creative people who are getting after it, and you have an idea. They latched on your idea. You guys built something, and actually, there's the part of actually making it, too, is not just pontificating and hand waving and smiling about it. There's actually an application if I'm gonna do this shit and doing it in 48 hours later today. But, hey, but that is that. And that shows that that simple you uploaded to the the Yeah. I mean, we know, actually, we didn't make the app it we made it was bars of based, because I believed in where we all live in the browser. And I needed something as my landing page that constantly hits me over the head when I open a browser window, What actually should get done? So we have decided as a browser, a site, and, uh, we just used it internally. We never expected it to open it up to the public. What people that kept walking in because we all had It has a landing pages they like, What is DePodesta? So we were hand coating people in and eventually come on, Cameron, just make it simple marketing site and they just give it away. So that was in December of 2000 10 of belief, and we launched it. I wrote about it on Swiss Miss. Aside here, here's what to do up that we build for ourselves, you can use it. And then I remember like an hour later, I look over to Cameron and he's like, pale and I see him looking at stats and he just looked me goes like Oh my God, the Internet was imploding on us And then I did some research, and, um, all the big people picked it up and shared it. And it's so funny. We launched in December of 2010. We just made the cut for being the best to do up of 2000 and 10 because a fast company wrote a block post about two hours later. Best to do up to 2010 like you expect success quite that fast. Just two hours is a little bit narrow for the rest of us. But congratulations. And what's really adorable is that for some reason, the church world has picked it up. I think priests and nuns are really into lists themed thing that two adorable. So we made this app for itself, right and then actually rebuilt Shortly after we build an actual I phone up and again, we never looked that this is a business This was a tool that we build for ourselves. So we had very silly alerts. For example, his Cameron is hilarious, like even his videos are just so funny. And, for example, one of the alerts when you had no WiFi knowing on the connection was like danger, danger, high voltage. It was just a funny. So we got this adorable m of from a nun saying, I just got this IPod touch and it needs to last for a long time. And I'm really worried whenever I get this message. Is it going to affect my I like, Oh, God, Oh God, this is what happens when you make a product that people you is You need to be kind of think of everything, even nuns that are afraid of electricity. Yeah, actually, you brought up something that I think resonated deeply with me, and I've had some success in thinking this way, and that's scratching your own itch, for the folks out there are thinking about doing something entrepreneurial. Um, I created an IPhone app called Best Camera, which is the first IPhone app that shared images to social networks ended up being that whole thing kind of caught on, get noticed or not, But, um, the idea was I was using, like, 10 aps a created This is the back pre IPhone or IPhone. One take a picture, and then you have to use the Facebook app Twitter at the blogger app, the WordPress app that just to get a photo out there and in doing so, I was like, That is just a pain in the ass. How could we do it? So you just touch one button and it goes all the services and the thing that I learned more than the trajectory of the AP and the success there was that scratching your own edge that if you have a problem in the same way that Tina had a list problems like autumn, this problem, like thing to do list, that was something that she needed that wasn't out there. If you build it, the chances are that there are tens or hundreds or millions of people that have that same issue. So when you're thinking about what entrepreneurial projects to pick up living proof that you can break the Internet with your to do list by scratching your own itch? Yep. All right, So check that is to dio. Yep. And now I want to move on to the thing that's next in line. We're gonna touch you. Yes, this is used for has please touch me. So we're talking about tat Lee and waiting for this moment. So tell us about tally Eso tapley is a temporary to to company designing at the table. But no one in the world knows what we're doing. We're pointing were pointing the table because there are tat tats. Yeah, So tat Liza designing temperature to company that started in 2000 and 10. Um, and it started l a started when my daughter once again came home from a birthday party. And for those of you that kids, you know, birthday parties I mean, kids come home with goody Becks, and there were these really hideous and knowing temporary tattoos in them that she asked me to apply in her, and they were such an insult to my Swiss aesthetic. And I have this personal rule that if I keep repeatedly complaining about something, I need to either do something about it, let it go, and I realize that Come on, T need to stop complaining about this. And then I thought for a second. So wait a second. You can't be that hard to produce temperature twos. I can make websites. I have lots of illustrative friends. Let's just make a cool sight with cool tattoos. And then I fix this problem, right? And two months later, fast forward, we launched Hatley for the horrible 16 designs with just friends of mine that made some designs and just friends like Stefan Sag maester he just he just came on a few weeks ago. Okay, But I'm again. I just have to turn around in my coworking space like it was that easy for me when you're surrounded by creative people, right? And so two months later, I launched it and he was again the yea. And in that moment where you know, I blogged about it and then literally few minutes later, we're standing there next to the printer and there's thes orders coming in through Internet thing Is magic on orders from around the world, Not just like down just, you know, it's just Wow, I'm in business. So we started shipping two twos and then the next day I gotta go from very prestigious museum store in London. I will never forget this moment in my life and I pick up and they said hello. Can we have a wholesale cat look, just like absolutely. I took their info hung up and I remember I turned around like, Hey, guys, what is a wholesale catalog? So I call it my friends who make products. And they got me up to speed. It was like, Tina, you need packaging and you need to you know? So I made a whole sack. I look and now we're in stores around the world. And I must say, my personal highlight was when? Last year we got into the MOMA store and I admit I went to the moments during Spring Street and I creeping Lee stood there for about an hour, just going. I have a product that was never set up store. Yeah, and actually, my first post, Matthew he was He has his product in there, too. So I could totally relate to to, you know, that feeling I was like, Wow, I was never set out to make a product that's going to be in a store, but you scratch your own itch. You saw hideous tattoos that misaligned with just what's aesthetic and you made your own. You followed your second rule, which is You can't complain. You have to fix it. And and the beautiful thing about tattling is. And again, I think there's beauty and starting something as a side project and not looking at it as a business, because when you start something on the premise of the show notes right now, when you start something out on the premise of a side project, you sort of have a different set of rules. You are more willing to experiment you. Are you not as afraid of failing because there's nothing to fail at because you're just trying something right and you don't make decisions around money to me? What I've learned is I've never put making money first with any of these projects. It was really just a pure, like What do I want to fix? What is it? What is the problem that I want to solve? And sometimes it's just pure passion for something. It's not the money component, but interesting enough, I think the universe, since you had not when they think you need to continue working on that because money and some sense then comes on its own. I have the same experience, the app, creative live like I wanted to solve that problem because when I turned, there was no creative education. When you're in her education, you look around. It's really hard to go back to school. And in the end of the day, I believe when you do something from a very pure inauthentic place where again you don't set out to just this will make me tons of money. There's a different there's a different energy around it, and people responded it And I feel like a disdain age at all times. You being pitched something. There's always a catch when there is not, people actually go like Whoa, that's kind of refreshing. So there's no catch. Speaking of tats, three. Put one on. Would you guys like it if she put one on my body? So we're discussing this earlier if wear on my body and the traditional place would be here, but where neither of us are very traditional, and I like the prison thug nectar eso, she said, wouldn't be awkward to find like and ask me That's kind of what we're going forward. Okay? For the record hat coming my way. And it's a very manly next hat, like a bird. Okay, let me to see I want to have this department, but for birth. Flight up. Always up. Yes. Okay. All right. What's mine is gonna hurt. Is this gonna hurt? It? Feels good, actually. Can Ugo have these all over my body? Okay. He promised me he didn't moisturize there this morning, because if he did, it's not going to stick. So, uh, how long is this gonna stand? Three weeks. Four weeks between two and five days. As long as you don't moisturize, it can shower. And soap is all good. Just No, no moisturizing moist raising. And I got a bird on my neck now. Thank you very much. All right. Can I have this hustle one, too? Yes. I love this team. Do this here. I think about the end of the show and have a big okay. Have a good story around that. Okay. So whenever we go to when we have trade shows, I learned my job is because I can't close a sale for the life of me I'm just not a sales person, but everything. But I can get them into the booth and I can get them so fired up that they're going to place an order with someone of my Tetley people. Right? So I I learned that the more sleeved up I am standing outside of the booth, the more likely people gonna notice. So I always entree Joe mornings of standing to kitchen on a puzzle piece my arm together literally sleeved up and hear. My daughter a year ago came in and watch me in the kitchen. She goes money. What are you doing? I'm getting ready for work. And she's like, I want your job. So anyway, the first day at a traitor where sleeps up like that, I walk home and I go into the subway and there's a big guy sitting there and he had a real sleeps and I walk in and I could see that he just caught me a little bit. So he looks up and he gives me the thing that I think it started computing. You have carrots and lollipops, and then he looks at me and I was like, damn it for like a split second. I was part of his tribe, but I don't know if you zoom in on that. That's awesome. Well, thank you very much and tell us a little bit more about first of all T A t t l y dot com. Right? That's what they go on about it. So we get these packs you get. Individual thing is, I don't know so that the beautiful thing about tapley and what I am very proud off it's like, obviously I will not save the world of temporary tattoos, right? So But there's a few things I can do to make the world a little better by running this business and, for example, they're made in us. I will. I don't understand why just to make more profits, we need to move stuff overseas. I just don't get it. There's people that he jobs here. There's really capable manufacturers, so I will not let go of that. Um, they're artists get a really, really generous cup cut of every single sale, which goes into my my belief that you need to have a passive income. So I get a lot of exclamation point emails every three months when we pay out Artist Commission, which is really cool. Um, can I maybe do one with you? Like some sort of photography way? Do a lot of custom. Cool. We work of really cool brands now to do custom stuff and, um, and did the other thing as well is, uh, there's little things like I want to make something I love for people that love it, right. So there's needs to be a lot of love so, so suitable right there when I look when I started it and looked into fulfillment houses that would do to fulfilling is usually the biggest pain, right. But the problem is, when you use the fulfillment house, they usually wouldn't. It doesn't make sense to use them if it's below $ like you order. But it's really important to me that we have a $5 order. You can order one design, you get two of them for $5 it shipped. The shipping is included in the US It's really important to me that people that don't have big budgets can place an order for $5 then we put ah so the reason was that we had to keep it in house. That was the reason I was like, Okay, I can't go to Fulfillment House. But then I realized, If you really care about something in your company, you need to keep it in house. That's something I've learned, and now we we very much to some of my toe to toe. This may have something that, sadly, team members I just insist on using real steps, so we put, like, really cool designing like Roberts times on it. But then we use real stamps from email them out, and what happens is people receive their orders and it looks like a friendship. Do something. It's not just his pre printed label. While with other people might not pay attention to this. There's a lot of people that do, and it appreciated on instagram about it, and it feels like a friend sent you something like, there's a riel human touch and I feel there's not enough of that these days, so there's little things like that that make me really happy. That's one of my favorite things about the world of design that actually matters that the care and everything actually matters. Um, so you have you referenced your Swiss roots, which made me want I thought about something my parents said, Oh, my parents were also fans, and I got a fat acute. Yes, I got a FedEx this morning, Um, from my mother and father who are certainly watching Steve enjoy. And they sent me something. Could you toss that up here? And this is to wish this is this hat. So So But toe whereby toe wish the, um, the World Cup team. Good luck. So temporarily Where? Well Oh, I got all the people would be so proud of. So hopefully I've been pressing your you say was you're watching your mother's watching my family, I think is watching. And so look of Swiss. I actually I taught in my Swiss German word. I'm told you gonna put him on the spot right now. Who he? There's like, entire Switzerland is cheering. And let me tell you what, Don't tell them what it means. It's like if you ask any Smith chairman to teach you a Swiss German word, they will teach you this one because he has another lot of the sound. Oh, yeah, I noticed. It means kitchen covered on Interesting enough. My husband is a kitchen designer. That was pretty funny. So there you go as my Swiss German lesson for the day, a hisley talking freshly. I'll continue to represent Switzerland as best I can. The Internet's going nuts again. I got to go ask you a few more questions from those folks at Culinary Fool. Hi, Brenda. I know Culinary pool. How do you structure your partnerships with these quick little startups? Like, what is it? What's the business arrangement there? Eso Here's lesson learned. Uh, I'm very lucky that, for example, to Dio Cameron and his teams, Like when we started it again, it was never set out to be a company. So it was just very loosey goosey. Kind of like that. Just built this fast forward. Now, I would not do that again. Even if you start something as a side project, I would say Sit down and just say Hey, in case this catches on, let's just be very clear, like we're founders, right? Like, here's who assume any rights, and I don't say you have to go crazy and have a lawyer, but maybe just ride it down so that There's no misunderstandings afterwards, but we have to Do we just have equal partnership? And then Tat Lee's my own and creative morning. It's just just be aware of when you start something with someone that you may be disgusted. Briefly. Great advice, Great advice at Lori's World. Passive Income, Ari. Passive Income How did you create that passive income around your blawg? Because that, you know, that's a big I think people don't really know how to monitor is that again? It happened extremely organically and almost eerily the timing. Um, I just kept the blawg up for myself, sort of a visual archive. This was pre Apprentice P. Tumbler. I realized pretty quickly that people are reading it and and then when I was set out to when I had my daughter and I couldn't work from home anymore because in any was at home with the baby, I started looking at renting a desk. Um, this is before I had the idea for a studio mates, and I remember walking around, you know, I just had to get used to the cost of having a nanny, which is huge. Um, and then I was on, and I have to know also have a desk rental. You know, um, and I was a bit worried, so I looked at a few desks in Dumbo. And then remember, I went to Starbucks around the corner. I sat down. Can I do this? Can I not? And, boom, I get an email from Jim Caudal off the deck network. Um, any goes Haiti. Now, we would like to take you on into the deck network, and this is how much we can pay you. And he was exactly the amount that I needed for a desk rental. And he was like to universe, sending me telling me like you get that Dex cried s own. That happened very organically and again. It's just somehow some automatic. I think when you're really doing something with all your heart or you're putting it out in the world, the world can smell it. They can feel it. No question about it. Last question from the Internet for the time being, the underscore Castillo. Have you noticed any of the single creative mornings themes that infect the community the most? I wanna involve the conversation to creative mornings here, So let's just before we go right in there. Career mornings is pretty Mornings is a breakfast lecture syriza's for free that I started in New York City out of the sheer eso a need for the creative community to get together on a regular basis for free in the morning. Um, and it has caught on and we're now in 84 cities and growing around the world. How many countries is that? It's over 30 I think. Thea under store Castillo Castillo wants to know what you each one of those air monthly themes. So you put a team up and then all of the chapters around the world explore that theme and they have a guest speaker. I have been lucky enough. Do you want just talk t to be a creative mornings speaker up in Seattle on did that? That was super fun. But talkto de Castillo tell him what? So that seems, by the way, are not picked by headquarter. It's picked by seniority of window hosts, came on, which is really interesting. Sits bottom up. Um, which theme has caught on the most? I don't know. Is it sex? Yeah, actually, that's an interesting one. So one chapter picked six. Actually, no. They were like birds and bees or six. And then we sort of as. And this is so interesting when you run a multicultural organization. Um, we sort of asked, Hey, guys, should we call the birds and bees and so many comebacks like, What do you mean? What is that? It's like, Oh, it doesn't translate. You know, certain cultures birds and bees doesn't translate. Realize we just have to flat out like six and Wasps. Sex must have most controversial, I would say, and but also the most interesting and how the hosts interpreted the theme and pick their speakers around creativity. So I'm not sure this was a great and so, but I got. But I love the alignment of creative live that anyone the world can come and get free creative education from the world's best standing on this stage and under stages and how it aligns with creative mornings. And you could go for free to attend a breakfast lecture from some of the greatest creative minds. But I love the alignment there, and what you've built is is game changing, and the fact that it's based on largely volunteer effort can you talk about how you built it, Give us a little, um, backstory because that's a That's remarkable bug again. It never is. I never intended it to be beyond New York City, but that I had a friend asked me in Zurich if they can start a chapter. I was like, That's, you know, im brand name Switzerland was like, Yeah, sure. And then a month later, yeah, there we go. A month later on my friends to John, who moved to L. A. I was like, Come on, let me Ronnie, too. And the next thing you know is like, I get increase from around the world. And it was an interesting moment because I am a za user interface designer. I was, like, obsessed with every pixel being perfect, and that also kind of translated into, like, when I was asked, Can cannot run this in my city, there was a lot of letting go that I had to work on. Um do Yeah. Yeah. So but the beauty of it is, um, that in the end of the day, when you trust people trust us the biggest compliment of all right. So when you talk to these hosts potential hosts and they win you over. You get a sense there they can. They can do this and they can do a great job. And once you let go and you trust him with your baby, they will over deliver. They will, they will, and that's what happened. I mean, uh, I feel like created mornings is an example of how trust breeds magic. This is is way beyond me at this point. This isn't that I've never imagined it to be what it is today. And it all came down to us headquarters trusting these hosts and Derek's to kicking our butt like we have to step up our game in New York. Damn, we call it flare. Every month we see the photos come in and we call the flare. That's just the love they pour. These hosts poured into into these events and that, you know, just like logo's on cupcakes created mornings. Locals on cupcakes. I was like, Damn guys, we got to step it up. Or these guys in Barcelona make this enormous creative mornings logo sign and walked around with it in the city, thinking telegraphic from Berlin of just a completely packed house and blamed. So you've already referenced Berlin in Barcelona, New York? And is it competitive between? No, that's the beauty of it. It's not. And I'm super excited that we're actually for the first time ever, getting all of the hosts into one room. So we're organizing the first summit. I mean, the the reason why I have started creative mornings is because I believe that real connections are made in person and not behind a screen. So the magic of meeting up and now we're creating that with our hosts. And I am already preparing to be a total basket case because these air really extraordinary people that run creative mornings, and it's a very respectful and loving. I mean, creative morning is all heart for sure, it really is. You can feel it, um, with the coordinates you get at Creative mornings. Created mornings dot com is actually a creative morning because it's just one letter too long for Twitter. Isn't it annoying? But that's brilliant. I asked Twitter, actually, if they could change that rule, they were just like, But I love that you have no way That's way request. I want to put into the Twitter Twitter people better and bowling. So at creative morning to do already spilled that a couple times. You're at Swiss Miss with Dash Ms The Swiss dash ms dot com is the euro. Yes, but oh, you talking, talking all over the place. And I'm not confusing people because it Zack Creative Morning on tour with her talk to do No, it's accurate. A morning on Twitter, but its creative mornings dot com got it. Yeah. And then, uh, us aside from ms dot com, but Swiss miss on Twitter without a hyphen, An instagram post. Mr. Also got it. I'm chased. Jarvis is my name, and you can find me on the Internet before we break again. I want to say a huge thank we've had some contests have been going on. We've had people tweeting like mad. I'm looking at the Twitter feed up here in my magic screen. Um, the winner of this contest, who has been quoting Tina like crazy, is at Orange Photo. Who wins that GoPro right there. Send an email to production at chase Jarvis dot com, and we will put that thing in the mail and send it to you at Orange Photo. Um, again, we're here on the CREATIVELIVE. Network. If this dose of inspiration has made you want to take some classes, you could do that right here. It creativelive dot com. Um huge set out to borrow lenses to the folks at critical Ivan A I g. I'd love another round of applause quickly for the G s design. Really Got it going on. What's that? People should stay in. We can put on some tea. If you guys all stick around at the show, we will have a tattoo party. I don't know what that sounds like if you're in the Internet, but we're gonna we're gonna have this room. Is is going to be attack fest. Um gosh. And then right now live on other channels right here in San Francisco and up in Seattle, where there's creative composition with Susan Stripling painting Photoshopped with Jack Davis Adobe Creative App Starter Kit, Metal song. Writing is going on right now and creative lives Whoa! I love me on handmade business with Carrie shaping and 25 ways to jump start your business with very moles is right next door. So for folks in the Internet are inspired. You can go learn some stuff and I cannot thank you for the tattoos. And and I'm a huge, huge fan and it's always indebted to you. Thank you for teaching me Swiss German inspiring psycho Internet loves you. Oh, thank you so much, Theo. Way, way.