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Editing Images

So we have some exciting conversation to be happening about editing. And we did the shoot yesterday. It was really fun. And I'm sure you want to see some of the pictures that we did. So I'm gonna talk a little bit today about how I show those images to my clients. So I'm gonna just preface this a little bit, and then we're gonna watch the show. So we need a cue sound That'll be good in a minute when I'm showing the pictures to the clients, what I want to do is make sure that there's a wow factor there, that every image they look at their like Oh, my gosh, how to keep that? That's really her expression. Well, so there's all this excitement right in the beginning, when there and this is the first time they're seeing those images. Teoh, I don't let my sister blogged pictures. I need to sleep. I don't need Teoh. She does block them later after they've made their purchase. But I want the impact to be there when we show the first slide show. And that so all the way that I arrange the slide s...

how is put different pictures together, so it makes it more dynamic and fun. And you could. There's lots of different ways you can do slide shows in my ordering session. I use Pro Select because they have a slide show program. But of course you could use Inamoto. There's other programs, so but what What's joy taught me that I didn't used to do as much with weddings is the calling down, and it's more like slashing down. I think we shot around 400 images yesterday, and she's going to show you 44 and like for me, I don't know that one. Why great? So then she was. She would tell me and teach me how, why and we're gonna have a discussion about this soon. But but it's a really interesting thought process. How much do you show how much is too much and and how do you make the decisions about what to show? And I always say they're gonna wonder there in the past, but and it never happens. There always just like great. That's what we've got, you know? So I'm excited for you to see just slide show and then we'll talk about that way, son for you. All I can do for you is wish you the best of everything for you forever. I fly for you and the good life this will bring. So why you? I just said, stand whatever you think we should know your days, whatever ask out for you. So why you I just instead so why you just enjoy from issue. This is an album that we did pre designed for them so they can kind of see what their images would look like if they were laid out in a book. Is you remember in our way had a consultation with Hillary and showed her the album's. And so she said, Oh, well, I never thought about an album so clearly interested you do just a really quick many book for her to kind of get an idea of what may be putting a book of their family together might look like. Like this is actually through Pick Taj. So, and the reason why I show the album in the original slide show like that is because I want to get them excited about that and for them to start to visualize their images in an album and again goes right back to what we were talking about before they buy what they see. And I have a sold more family albums that way because the mother will be like, What can I tell you something really fast? So I know that she's doing this and a lot of time. She will go ahead and design a book, even if someone didn't express interest in one, because so many times when they actually see their own family and how it could be, they fall in love with it. So I know this when I'm shooting so like yesterday, and I think we probably would have done a little more Variety had a head a little more than 75 feet and initially, but But that's why I wanted to get each child of the same open shade and then each child with a little backlighting and do pictures of the dad with his son and mom with the girls, and that all the kids together alone, the whole family together alone and often times I'll do the parents alone as well, and try to do you know just different setups of different variety and try. Here's with flowers here is with the rocks. This is this cool bench and trying to move around the space and get as much variety as possible to do something. Like the pages with the Children where we had 31 had could have a little variety, because, I don't know, I wouldn't want a page that had just three of the almost the exact same image. I don't think that that's as compelling than showing one of my camera wear one image playing with flower whenever interacting Dad, you know, kind of thing where it showed the full or story about that child. But just knowing that you may want to put something like this together will help you during the shoot to say, even when you're thinking like how I pose them, what do I do? Well, that gives you a little bit of a canvas thinking. Okay, well, I need to do, Dad. Maybe you dead with each kid or dad with the girls this time. And mom with her son. And there were a couple of steps that we didn't do. We didn't do one of just a freak. Exactly. Did all three kids. It was the bench. Oh, yeah. right. I did that first on us, but just thinking about things like that, so that you have a lots of variety, and then it's like having you have more to work with. If you If you only shoot one backlit picture of one open shade picture and it's the whole group, then you you can't make it an album out of that. There just isn't enough material there, I wanted to say also, it's can I had a question, but I just wanted to say really quickly that the music was a song by Nancy Falco, and we're using it with permission from Triple Scoop, which is a really great company to get royalty free music so you can use it for your slide shows, especially if you're gonna be putting anything online. You want to make sure you, you know we're concerned about copyright sore musicians and Motor was another great slide show program that has music that you can use. So I just wanted to say that really quickly, and then can that you were gonna say excellent because that answered. One of my questions was about getting the mortar the music come from and then also the copyright issues. Thank you. Actually what? Jules had a song written for her for her wedding clients. Had a a boyfriend that was a musician and wrote this really beautiful song. It was so great that people would ask me, Can I can I use a czar first? Dance song has quite a lot of clients do that or any time we use it Honest light so that it always like that. But it was fun having a song that no other photographers were using anywhere because it was my I mean, I recommend having a song written for you. The easiest thing to find. There's another great partnership, right? Actually told him to go talk to an Emoto. I think he's talking to them now about writing for them. And so the the actual question that I was gonna ask was gay love from Utah says, Do you show your favorites first in the in the sideshow to help with emotional impact? I noticed they weren't always in chronological order. Well, thank you for asking that, because that is exactly what What a great Yes, I dio This is the purse elect program and I'm going to talk about it more in length. But for that question, I'll show you all of the images like this. You can move them around really easily. And what I dio before a slide show is I will look at all the images that I have, and I'll move them around so that there is that emotional impact always makes me crazy, cause I organize them in a really different way, going to give in to our our Well, what? Because I was one. I have, like, everyone together first, then groups, then single. But that's the next thing so but maybe we're going to do this a little bit out of order order. But that's okay. So for the slide show, I like to have the emotional impact where they're looking at different pictures. And there's the one of the three Children the family shot in my favorite so that every so they're already in the mindset of like, well, these pictures are amazing and must have them all. And so but then and I have cold it down to my favorite top images and again going back with that less is more analogy in the whole decision making. I am the expert in this situation, and I want to be telling them, No, this is This is an amazing shot and this is why this is an amazing shot. So I wanted to give us all a chance to sort of do that and talk about how you edit and why you make certain choices that you do well just because she and I argue about it all the time we do. We have editing choice, conflict a lot, So this screen right here is showing you. It says 55 images. There's not actually 55 images. It's more like 44 because I am the last one of the album discounting the album images, and we can talk about that later about the album. But this one we was has 72 images in it. These were our top before I cold it down to the final 44. The's what we decided. What we wanted to do for the sake of this class was to have a discussion with all of you about why we would choose one image over another and go through some of these and maybe for the next half an hour, and then we can break, we can have that conversation, I'll show you. This is similar to what I do with my clients. Once I show them the five show, then I'll go to a different set that where all the images are put together like this, like you can see here we have, you know, the same set up with the five family, although this one is a double cause. This is when you worked up. But so that this way, it's easier for the client to look at them all together and choose what they like better. Of course, I would never show it was a lot of people aren't that familiar with with Pro Select. Yeah, so I would never show a client 45 images of the same set up for a couple of reasons. One is that you diminish your wow factor immediately. Kevin K. Botha, who does who has all kinds of amazing actions and programs, talks about like a Mona Lisa effect where if you see one, you're like, Wow, that's an amazing one. Oh, there's another one. There's another one, and it sort of diminishes the value of that one image. That's sort of like the quintessential This is the shot. So I want to do the same thing. Just have one image that's like, No, this is the shot. And then that becomes the shot for the client, in fact, and then going back to the conversation about Ben Prober, the shoe salesman. Yesterday, two, not three. I prefer to give them two choices, not three choices. Sometimes it's hard even for me to edit it down because I'm like, Oh, there's and with Children sometimes I'll give a little more leeway because parents tend to buy more of their Children anyway. But when you're giving them two choices, you're essentially asking them to pick like this one or this one. So I wanted for the sake of just talking about how we edit and then we'll go back to the client experience, how do you edit? There's different ways you can edit in or it out? Have you? You know what that means. Get in and out, Okay? I go through my images and I just go through them. Once I started like room and I just go one star for all the ones that are technically okay and not horrible and then I go 70 filter down the ones I go to the when I go through an angle. Which one do I like in those Get two stars. And then when I get through, depending on how many I have, if I've got 40 or then I'll start working on those. Uh, if I've got 100 then I'll go through. It'll do it again and give three stars for the ones that are really cool. The problem that I have is I get caught up and I start Teoh. I wonder if this will look a little bit better once I've started tweaking it. And then all of a sudden, half an hour's gonna at least you got a flow of No. One. And that's something to consider when you're shooting in terms of budgeting, even the more you shoot, not only does it take more time at the shoot, but the more time it's gonna take you a post process in terms of editing, and that's all comes down to your bottom line and amount of time that you're spending. Editing is valuable, but just to that, I think part of the problem we're having yesterday with the tethering was that I was shooting too fast and you gotta shoot slower. But for me, especially with things like rejoicing, I don't want to show four images. There are the same. Why did you cheat so many of this image that a lot of it is because kids are squarely and sometimes they're smiling and sometimes someone's looking at the way. So I want to be able to get maybe multiple frames. So if I if I love the light and I love the pose and there and not one time, is there one frame where everybody's face looks good? I do have the ability to do head swaps. But having said that, a lot of times, if I really feel the images strong rather than showing them both and saying we could swap their heads, I will just do a head swap and then that's what we'll show them, because it's not that difficult to do it. But I don't want to spend tons of time on something and having like, oh, I don't like my hair And then you just wasted all that time, so it's a little bit of a risk. But then I think sometimes it's worth it. I did that on one of the images here where I opened the dad's eyes. I I think I'm gonna show you that it's cause I'm I think it's worthwhile seeing like an easy way to do it. Soas faras the editing in and editing out, or is it called culling? I don't know. I would just call it edit, but when you're editing in, it's kind of like what you said, picking the ones that you want to stay in, obviously, and that's more how I edit. But the way I do it is I'll go through the first pass and look at the images and the ones that really hit me right away. I give him a three like that. That's definitely a shop. Gotta stay, and then the one that I think that those are pretty good. I give him a two and then the window. No being either zero or one, and then I can go back through my threes and twos, and if I have enough threes, I don't even have to look at the twos because I know all the threes of the ones that that really caught my attention Or sometimes I'll just make sure I have enough variety between the twos and threes. So and then editing out is obviously the opposite of that. You know, we're like, No, I don't like that one I don't like That was when I asked one thing here, in terms of doing your own editing or having someone read it for you. I just want to hear a little feedback. Sometimes I like it when Joy does the edit cause I feel like I'm too close to it and I will leave way too much in. And then and then she shows me, I'm like, You're right, That is the best one and I feel like I am right. I'm really thinking about it from a sales perspective, Jules is thinking about it from a statistical perspective, like, but this one has this movement, whatever. Some of those are amazing, but we don't need to show them six of those because then they won't buy any of them whole same. He's hard. And and the other thing, if you make the choices, if you give your client too many choices, then they will sit there and deliberate. And then the longer the ordering session goes, the less money they're going to spend its true because they start to get. I mean, after an hour or two, you're done. You don't want to think about that anymore. I love being a fly on the wall yesterday. And do we like? I love that one? Joins like, No, it's this one. No, no, it's nine. No, it's 12 way late last night, trying to get through all these on enjoying Probably a good discussion. We should bring the creep into this. And so now we are. But we let them answer that. Your question about editing in the now I usually do two or three sweeps, and my first sweep is editing out. I will examine, you know, if I've got idea shooting this in a similar way where I shoot like three or four frames of the same post, just so that I have, you know, more to choose from as far Asli quality goes. But then I'll only leave like one or two. Um, and if there if there's two of this impose, it's usually between color and black and white. Um, so I delete like a bunch, and you know, call it down that way first, and then I'll go through and I'll do the same thing. Like look at my pictures and which ones have a personal impact on me. And I am really, really self critical. So if if if one of my images is having that impact on me, then I know that it's really good. And I know that it's been a self. So I will just put that in my quick collection in light room. I don't even rate I don't use the stars at all. I just quit collection it, Um And then, you know, I'll do that like maybe once more on delete more and then and then all process. So I would be interested. How maney images do you show? Or do you think you should show in a portrait ordering session? What do you think? Somebody who haven't talked? I usually do for 40 to 60 somewhere around there on the lower, probably 40. But I was taught very strictly at a at a company that was very had all their, you know, stuff in a row, and they knew and you handed your card to somebody and they took it And then the people came back half an hour to see the picture. So you were not allowed to, you know, it was like a or B click air B e. I was joking about making this anxiety E o depending on the shoe. I 25 to 35. I never 40. Wow. And I don't shoot as much either. I really kind of I have a friend whose snap some sense that it, like you dio and I run into problems when I you know, it does fire back sometimes, but it really stream streamlines my editing and I, um I x x x x x tilly to even just get out. And then I t Sometimes if it's like, What are you editing a bridge? Or like Like my room? And there's also aperture. There's a lot of editing tools. I'm super old school I to seize bridge, but I found that if I if I edited out, I would end up with a lot Maurin images. So I started editing in because then, like joy, it's more about yes, yes, rather than saying that knows, cause you're like Maybe it's good, so bad, you know, and then you don't delete, and then you end up with a lot more than you should have. But I like her way where and it's and the thing. Reason. I think it's good to have joy do. The first pass for me is that she does have she does have a less biased I. She wasn't the one looking through the lens, so she hadn't seen them before. So when she's like, that's her and it makes it impact like that that I know. Plus, I'm usually having that consultation with them ahead of time. And so I know Oh, she's gonna love this one because he's horsing around with her. A lot of times I will overlay all that information back to Jules. But since I feel like I've had those conversations and I, I'll pick the one that I think will resonate the most with my clients, and it also depends on what you're doing with those images as to how money you're gonna show. I mean, if you're putting together an album, you are gonna show some more. Then if you're just getting like, you know, a few for portrait or one family wall portrait or doing a holiday shooting. You're getting a card or something like that. So I wanted to actually curious. How do you guys alluded to you come to an impasse at times. How do you solve that? Because my wife is my sales person and we re butt heads Constant. How do you solve that? I didn't want to go into the O Way Do we've actually got to a point where we thumb wrestle, but sometimes sad to say it is. It's just about a matter of preference, and they're both great images. You just have to pick one. And I always think about it this way. It's my job as a photographer. I'm providing the service. Show that client that they don't have to have that pain because, honestly, they don't want to see 100 mean they think they do, but they don't because their child is so, so cute. They're going to look at those pictures all day long, but it's going to be painful for them to have to pick one and so painful that I can't choose. I can't choose. I'm gonna have to. Can I pick it later? Can we do this later? Can I make a decision later, you know, So sometimes it's a matter of like, OK, yeah, done that. Just weaken rochambeau for way. Do the rochambeau because the truth is a lot of time. Rochambeau. It's like boxes. Truth is, a lot of times when you look at it on its own, one image may not be any better than the other one. And if you never saw the other image would be like, it's good. That is exactly the case that you would never they never they don't know. It's not painful for them because they don't know they never I never let them see that image. And sometimes once in a while I've had clients, a other, any other pictures of this or that. And often I will say, these are the ones. These are the good one, no other picture treat and those are all the ones in the sideshow. Yes, I think this class this is just for the sake of looking at the ones we didn't pick that didn't make sure I wasn't going to show you 400. So we just picked, you know, But final pass, not the final final pass. So you do in the situation room clients is. But I heard you for that shutter like, 400 times. God is gonna be one more just you blinked every time. I usually say, Yeah, it was just because you only get one great shot, but usually rare that people say that because I think they understand what they're doing. And oftentimes they're laughing and moving, so they know that every frame isn't exactly the same. So and they probably figured somebody's hair was in the face or someone was blinking or somebody wasn't looking so and they know that my job is to pick the one out of those five that was like the killer shot, or you tell them that, like, you know what I got. This is the good shot. This is the best one. And I mean and I also have a policy never to say no to a client. So I will generally try to say, there aren't anymore because these were the best ones. I can't say I've never, never gone back. Maybe once or twice have done that. I'll concede that I've done that, but its so rare because then you just opened up a huge can of worms there and again You don't want to do so. I wouldn't look at thes. Let's look at these four in particular because I called it down to two. And, um, we would take out Yeah, I wanted to move this guy when I move that one there. Okay, Because that's this one. That's when you worked up these four. How can we see this? We'll look at this like this, and then I'll go through them bigger so you can see the Senate is the same. They're very minimal changes here in each picture. Right? So why would you show your client? They're all great. They're all beautiful shots here. I'm gonna go through them like this. You could seem a little bit better. So there's one There's too. There's three. There's four. Think about that. Also in a slide show like that's gonna start to get boring like, Hey, there's me, There's me. Let me again. So that's another reason why in the sideshow, I I'll break it up. So in these pictures, you don't want to have the client making the decision of which of these four does she want because they're so incrementally different But there's reason why you would pick one over another. So I'm gonna see if I can doom on this. If you for example, can you see their eyes in this one? They are all looking away in this shop. There is a way too soon, I think. Can you get yet? It might be better for the for the worldwide. The worldwide touting the for their natural. There you go. Awesome. Okay, so there you can see their eyes a little more, which I thought was kind of cute, but it is cute. There's something cute about that. What do you guys think? I'm gonna hear? What dynamic does it look like? They're not paying attention. What do you think about this shot? Wait. Honed in right for the pose. It's you feel like they should have been like they're gonna joy. It's cute suit. It's super cute. It's a cute shot, but it's not like it's not one of our final choices. It just didn't make the cut. Another portrait, in my opinion. Okay, so here's the next one. It's control money. Hillary's next craned a little bit. You think Hillary? That's a little bit crane there. Look at Maddox, He looks. He's all tucked into his mom. The other thing is, when you're helping clients make decisions when you're going back and forth, I like to talk out loud reasons why I like this picture. It sort of educate them, and then they start to fall in love with it. For those reasons like, Oh, yeah, I mean, look at this. How he's tucked into you and look at there's this motion that you're so happy right here. It's clear that your you know you love how he's holding her hand. And there's something about Scott's facial expression. It makes me feel like he's not really totally comfortable yet. And that is why I didn't choose this one either, because this is awkward looking away. He's the only one when so is Lizzie here. They're they're looking at something else. So I didn't like that. Not that I didn't like it. Just okay, so here, super cute. That was her favorite because they seem thing I love about this is that here? Everybody's happy. They're enjoying the moment, and there's this little cute, intimate moment happening right here. There you got It was sitting on the story within a story thing, too. Yeah, and so the immortal yet more to look at. And it's a better story in my in my mind that there's something happening here. He's just really and even she's looking kind of cute, tongue sticking out compositionally. The heads are closer together than in the 1st 2 so you feel more so. It was a really nice triangle there. And the other two, there's a separation train. That's a good thing like this. Good point. Good point. I like that in this connection. Yeah, see that it's more of the the connection. Yeah, like the triangle of love. No one here. Last two with a two that I chose. And this is another one looking with looks happy. I If I really like this until, like everybody looking, I might take Lizzie's face for no one before and and swap it in there so we would have one more. Well, picture where Know where everybody for everybody's looking. So the way that I do it with my clients is I will give them two choices like this, and we'll talk about it, you know? What do you think about this? What do you like this little moment with Scott here because I know that they want a wall portrait of the family. So this once they finally chosen down their favorite, and we'll all study how we do that like they're helping me at it. I added it down to the final 44 then they will edit with me. So this process say you're in my clients, we're gonna go down and you see up here at the top right here there's these smiley faces, smiley and medium face and not so happy face. And it's really funny. I always just say yes. No, Maybe. But some people do not like the negative. No. So you'll feel like love it or like it. Maybe later. Whatever you know, euphemism you want to use to help to have your clients helped put them in those different piles. Then we will just work with our yes, love it pile to go to the final products, which I'll show you later. So they wanted to take a break scenes. So whatever you feel is a good breaking. Please. I think if we how about if we do you want to do one more like this. I like this. Doesn't I like? I like listening toe. OK, one or two more. She said 10. 30. And until we think someone thought it was simple. So let's see, How about these? These a really fun for me, That was the better discussion with Scott and and Liz, because there's so many of those. Okay, and those I think are different enough That Okay, so here we have these pictures of Scott and Lizzie, and they're all essentially the same thing is happening, but they're a little bit different. So I'm never gonna show a client all five of these, because, hell, is she gonna pick between 5 30 So I need to go through and choose which to. And it's painful for me. Which two of these am I gonna pick to show the client? So we're gonna start? I'm gonna call through them big, and then we can talk about them. Okay, So here's the 1st 1 Of course. The first thing I see is like, Oh, he's got sun hitting it, you know, But sometimes because I would just be like the expression, right. So I will concede that because if you notice I turned my body and the other images. He doesn't have that because I saw it when I shot it, but they didn't have that same moment again. So the client will never notice that. Is there anything you can do? Impose two? You could, actually, but I almost think it looks real. That is really what you know. That was a real highlight that was really there. And it matches the highlights in his face. It isn't technically the perfect thing, but I love his smile there and how she's looking right in his eyes. I would keep it because of that. And and I was sad that that moment didn't repeat itself when I had, you know, position myself. But if you remember, he picked her up with Joyce and I could get that, and I ran over there and it started happening. So when sometimes you have to just, you know, go with the flow and then I Then, as it was happening, I shifted my body and it was in a better position. You'll see that the other pictures, he doesn't have that same blown out piece on his cheek. But at the end of the day, still doesn't really bother me. Okay, so what do you think about this one? In comparison? They're still having a fun moment. His mind, who he's not, doesn't look like a genuine smile. He's like many mid Werder's She looks to you, but I think he might think you with that. Men are not as picky as women, and his wife loved picture. He would get it. But But if you have something that's also good that were they both look good. There's no reason. And that is actually a really good point. If you're trying to choose between like, say those four family shots and you're down to four, pick the one where the where the mom looks the best. But she's gonna be the most critical of herself. And so the dad won't. You won't mind us much, you know. Something of the season were a manner like, you know what? Come on. I just don't look good there. But hopefully that's not any image that we're trying to hit something way wouldn't show. It really looked on attractive. I would not want to show that. So Okay, so I like. I think she looks kind of boy and again his smile of truly genuine here to me. And now I like it much better because, of course, I moved myself so there is no big market his cheek anymore. So then when Joyce making her that's good, that's really good. But I will concede when the emotion. I think it's more important to shoes based on emotion than on technical perfection, because that's why they will buy it, not because it's a technically perfect picture, because it resonates with them on. I also like just the composition of this one more. There's a little of that negative space and the rule of thirds that you were talking about. So it's aesthetically pleasing where they're in this corner and there's this kind of little action happening with them. So any other thoughts three and four are my favorite. That one. Okay, do you think about this? You had edited this one out, even though they're both. They're both camera, where they're both smiling, that both she's not quite looking with winds, but after seeing the other ones is really not telling. It's really easy. Oh, this isn't there's no brainer here, turned out. So I the other images have a story being told. You can imagine all kinds of things, and this is almost like a nothing. But it almost looks like it's kind of shot. Is that the last one of those? You know? Here's one more and then when it actually not as bad because he's looking at her and she's kind of looking off, so I don't mind it. But if we had no camera where images I would have asked, joined leave it in because what we talked about yesterday is actually mom. If that were, say that with her only daughter, that's her youngest. You know, she wants a picture of them both looking at her. So maybe where we think like it doesn't have the same, you know, compelling. This is the other one. She might see it differently, and it's, I know we have a lot of other images. What we did catch people looking in the lens, so I was okay dumping that one. But I think those are all things to think about, you know, And I know we're going on and on about this. I think the more you do it, the warrant sort of. Naturally it comes what I like these kinds of discussions because, Joy said, we're supposed to be the expert. So how can you be an expert if you don't talk about it with your peers or if you don't practice it? If you don't have genuine reasons why you've made decisions for people? Sometimes it's interesting. People are conditioned to think that a good picture is like this, and that's it. And where, Ah, lot of times the pictures that are my favorites are the ones that have a lot of motion in them that are moving. Or let me see what's one like these where they're walking, right? You might hear Let's look at those for a second where they're walking and there's all this movement they might think like, Well, I look weird and we're moving And you think, Yeah, I like to educate the client if they there's so much dynamic, dynamic energy energy happening here and to show them and oftentimes I'll sell them on. Not that I want to push anyone on an image, but to show them like this is actually more compelling than just the camera, where I mean that the shot in the beginning was beautiful of all of them in that cute little. But that's why I tried you else. I try to do both. So we have that we can show. No, they I think they look at the joy on her face. So cute. So not there. Not a lot of times people say, Well, I'm not looking at the camera, but that's not always the point. In one of our early portrait sessions, we we weren't doing consultations prior to the session on, so we didn't pick up on the fact that for the mom, it was really important to have camera where pictures and that her experience from her wedding photos was She didn't have any camera where photos. And so she hated her wedding photos. And so we shot all these images of them, and we did have some camera where, but I have some favorite images which were absolutely wonderful. They weren't camera where she hated them. She didn't even want. She didn't even want, like a four by six sister to remember it or anything. And where is it? Wow, we missed the boat on that. I think something like that's really important to note that it's not. Photography means different things for different people. And for some people, that is like it's more about documenting your faith and then that having someone looking in the lens at you and like like it's, you know, like they call in the group in Grumman's at weddings and some people want you to go around and just go to the guest. Hey, can we get a shot of the two of you? And then because then they'll say, like, Look, it's you know, Sam and Marguerite and they came and and having it there is some value to that in people. And I think what Joyce saying is that And you are saying that you missed the consultation and maybe eight. Maybe you could have educated her as to why images like that really will resonate with her down the road when her Children have changed and the interests are different and like whatever they were playing at the time, they're not even interested in any more. And so it brings back so many more memories than just smiling at the camera, and you would have learned to that she was more interested. So maybe you're in your thoughts imposing and the types of images that you capture for her, you would have gone a little more that direction, or it would have allowed you to realize that we're not the right fit for each other. And maybe this session wouldn't have happened at all. And then you wouldn't have had that negative experience and she would have found somebody better suited for her. Perhaps you could have been available that data sheets. Somebody who was more did want to buy those pictures because that I think ultimately, if she's that way, maybe her friends were that way. So the referrals that you maybe you wouldn't get referrals from RBC like, Oh, he wasn't very good When that's not the case. You just weren't right for her, you know, and her perception of it, whether he was very good, which isn't correct, you know. So that's a good reason to even even just on the phone. Even I think questions question them like, you know. So why do you want to get your family photograph today if they say things like, Oh, well, we always got a picture taking every year when I was a kid would like Teoh or face a low. Johnny's growing up so much of them. I just love the way they interact with each other. Even the language that they used in the telephone conversation could be helpful. We're going to do one more thing where we're gonna talk through why you would choose one over another. You want to do this one with the with the moms we headed? Yeah, that's fine with thumbs. I this when I was so I can kind of tell you I was It was hard for me where I was tethered at this moment. I am. I couldn't get quite where I wanted to be. Do remember saying like the background was was much brighter than them. So I tried to get down and have that be sort of similar in exposure to their faces. So I really love all of them. But I also feel like, um, I think I would have shot them a little differently, although I e okay, so again, here's here now, five images that I like that I'm not gonna show her all five. And the set up is too similar. And I'm not gonna put her through the pain of having to decide. So how would you decide? Ok, I'm gonna go through them once first, and then we can talk about what you like. You not like about them. So there's one. I love that. Well, they're still working this one up. No, the last one. That's funny, because I am. I'd like that one to accept that. I felt like Lizzie looked a little bit in shock. Yeah. Okay, so let me get back. She looks so too, though maybe dump the color. Okay, so let's start with this one. What do we think I really like that one? Because I thought on the expressions were very genuine, because sometimes with kids you get a lot of like on, then it doesn't feel real. It feels forest. Where was this when I felt like everybody looked? And I love that their heads in that little order, you know, kind of like what you were saying about the invisible notes and that they're very feel like, very unified in cozy in this picture. Triangulation, triangulation. That beautiful. Okay, how about this one? I actually really like that. Well, I like that, even see their shoes. And I like how Hillary is laughing, you know, and it looks like magnets trying not to laugh. But she's like suppressing a giggle, and Lizzie has acute expression on her face. T get acute expression like a real one because I hear something. Is she looking at the camera or not looking away at the camera? I think that matter so much. I mean, the younger kids always looking all over the place. Yeah, it's kind of I think, that actually adds a little touch of her score. Leanness right. As the 2.5 year old, the moms holding onto her big sister is, is trying not to laugh. And she's like, squirrely. I think that's really I love. I love the story in this one. Okay, this is similar, but But see, if I remember you kept this one and dump the other one. I didn't I But I think it's interesting. Once you start to look at them more like this, you can tell like Okay, I think it's sort of obvious that the other one is has more, more life to this definitely feels more posed. Thanks to focus lost focus less compelled, and I think that true knowing the types of images like Joy was saying When she does my edit. She has already talked to the clients, so she knows what might make more sense for a certain client or not. So if maybe somebody was very into the whole camera, where thing then? As many of the images where people are looking into the lens as possible, she would have chosen, as opposed to, you know, because I'm interested in this one. I think that is. It looks really keep with their mouth open, like again. That little girly thing is just so cute. Jules thinks you don't like this. I know it wasn't that I didn't like it. And if it was the only image I would say, definitely keep it in that I felt that the other one was better. And if amount was like a little less open, maybe, but it just seems so different than the rest of them every day. That's what I like about it. Maggie's not completely should have mid midsentence. Yeah, and Hillary's stunning, Really. She was a kid. Well, in this particular one, I chose black and white because I was really struggling with the color weird angle that I was in. I just ended kind of being murky. So I I thought, you know what? Rather than fight this, I'm gonna make him all black and white really punch up the contrast. It's all about this particular picture of all. What? Their emotions, anyway. And then if they if they loved when there Because we see that one in color, then I would go to the effort tonight, show everyone that you worked. Yeah, yeah, but even this one you could cut, you can see it's like I added some texture to it and I punched the color way up cause I wanted to go the opposite route and see who had it felt like. But I kind of think I like them better in black and white, that last one. I don't know why. It just It's very happy. The last one. I like that. I think I'm not crazy about Lizzie's expression, and it's the only things that this is a perfect example of why I like to shoot multi frame, because I think it's the only one I shot from this particular angle. And that's what I like is the full composition I think my I would probably play with this one and probably take Lizzie's face from the previous. But that would be that would be a really, really tough one because it's a different angle one. And there's another good point, like I know that you struggle with that like, Oh, it could look so much better if I could take this cute face and put it on this. So the question there is, how much work are you going to do on an image before they've seen it before? They maybe Hillary goes. Oh, I look terrible in that shot and doesn't want it. And you just spent an hour and 1/2 switching the baby's face and the mom distance I don't want. That's why with the head swaps and things that Onley will do them if they're. If it's a one image that I can assure you that I swapped that we did because there was two oranges that I like, the both one. He was grimacing and when he was smiling and so we just took the like the eyes from the non smile and put on a smile, and I think it made the picture wears if she was going to just pick one, because you're not gonna show them both there to similar. Then what do you pick? The one word Isa clothes and one worries grimacing. And so, too, are neither right or neither. But in that case, just to be able to show an image. I like to do that and but not labour over it, because it's not worth putting lots of time and effort into that kind of thing. If, like, Joyce said, they don't like it now, a lot of times, if you do that, then they suddenly would like it, whereas maybe before they wouldn't have liked it. So it's trying to do to too many images. And that is why I like to shoot multi frames because usually one of them will be great and you won't have that issue. Or if you do have the issue, you'll have heads. They're of the same angle, same size that the swap really is so easy that you might as well do it. But if you're I mean, I have tried to do that before, where you take ahead from a slightly different angle and you're like playing with that is a nightmare and it can happen. But then, sometimes you're like, Does it look rial? I don't know. And then you don't ever want. You never tell them that you changed because once you say you swapped it like I knew it, even if they didn't know it'd, so he won't. But if it's if it's kids like this work, she shows three, because they really are, are compelling elements. All three. But she's like I wish Lizzie's place on this one was in this one. Then we could say, You know what? That's something we can dio and then, right, exactly, and then you can charge are hard for those things. So it's not bad. Teoh tohave a couple choices. You know there's three choices, and then one head is better not to pre do those things, but but if it's like a one image that you're gonna show sometimes I will