Layers and Pages
We're going to open up our layers document and open up our layers panels we can actually look at that when I create a new document let's do that and have the layers panels open yes I have one layer so by default you have one layer in your document always no matter what even if you never open your layers panel you never look at it now layers I don't have a question yesterday from in studio the layers are not like the layers in photo shop and that's where a lot of confusion comes and we have a lot of photographers so layers in design are layers of pages like think of it as if I guess nobody's done mechanical layout anymore yes or no that's not a good example but if I were to create something and put it on the page and then I decide I want something else maybe I'm going to put you know maybe I'm doing an art installation I'm going to some for my wall I put the bottom artwork down and then I decided once something else on top of it that I've drawn so maybe I don't actually draw on the actu...
al thing I want to take it put on a piece of acid tate and put it on top then we do another one I'm going to make these layered sort of pages but so it's still the same layout but they're layered on top of each other and a layer in in design is there may be a reason that you wanted on different layer. So for instance, in this particular sample that I have, I have a layer that says my main layer and that's, the picture and the pocket guide, and I also have one called arm and p, which is recognized national park and that's, the title for rocky mountain national park. But here's the thing and I'm going to turn awful air soon. We probably all know how to turn the eyeball on and off we turn that off, but I also have one called yosemite when I turn it on. Look at that that's the title for the yosemite one so the reason I used layers in this document is because I want to create different covers. I'm going to export to pdf or print or whatever I'm gonna print each one separately, but they have all these common elements, right? So I put that on the main layer, the image and the pocket guide and the name is all the same, but I want to print one. I'm going to create a pdf out of this and say, here's, the yosemite pdf ready to go, then I'll return off yosemite and turn on yellowstone and say here's the yellowstone one ready to go and the reason I did that instead of separate documents is one of the clients is hey I hate that picture of those trees can you switch it on put some snowshoes in there this is the snow shoeing guide we put that in there I don't have to change it in five separate documents I change it here on the main layer change out the picture and re export my pdf sir print or whatever it is I need to do some people put all their text on one layer and all their images on another layer that's how your brain works that's great do it that way there's a lot of different reasons one of the ones like when I'm printing I'm printing business cards or letterheads or something like that maybe have done business cards in color and we've laid it out with printed the color because the color printing that's the expensive part so they'll print what's called shells and you'll print you know, five hundred thousand business cards or whatever on four up you know layouts and then when the new people come in they say, hey, we need business cards for these four people we do allow we just print the black imprint of the name on top of existing printed documents so for me on one layer I would have all the stuff that's already printed or if you're doing a pre printed form or something like that you would have that on a layer and not print that layer you just print the layer that has the stuff on top of it there's a lot of different reasons that you might do that so again I think ahead of time you know what is it I'm trying to accomplish with that? So do I even need layers? I mean I wouldn't just take a file they just had text and images and everything is going to print every time and put him on separate layers that doesn't make any sense to me some things I put on there when I don't want to accidentally grab something and move it then I would put that not only on a layer but I would click this little square that's here and I would lock it so I couldn't accidentally move that with anything I can't move anything on that layer which is great so I would do that as well if there's just something that's there like a big image and I'm trying to click on things and we talked about stacking order and having to drill down through that stacking order that's really difficult to do so I might put that big thing that keeps getting in my way on a layer and leave it by itself and then lock it in and then on each layer you've got these little drill down menus so click on that I could see all the individual items on that particular layer and this was new and c s fivefive I believe that you could actually see all the different items this looks like illustrator for used illustrator this works more like the layers in illustrator than a dozen photoshopped in fact it's very similar now, but I can come in here and say, oh, this word pocket guide I'm going to click the eyeball on that I don't want to see the word pocket guide on there so I can turn off individual layer elements as well, so a lot of different reasons to have layers I have one that's just called annotations I like to have one that's called annotations or notes just to remind myself of things that I need to do to the file and waiting for this logo from a client whatever it is and so I like to have that on there for myself I would never print that layer so it's actually add another layer so let's decide ok, we're going to another one let's turn on talk about national park and I want to create a new one we're going to do a new one I don't know do you have is rainier national park here from people that are from here? I was like trying to a local nobody knows ok, good it is okay good rainier national park it is now if it wasn't before it is now all right so let's create a new one and I'm just going to click the little new simple down at the bottom here and click new layer and I actually want to hold on my option in my old key and I usually do that whenever it created new whatever because it pops open the options right away otherwise it creates whatever it is new layer or create his new paragraph style whatever it is that we're clicking like to do that so I get my options right away choose a color for the layer the reason the colors important is as I select things down below here they will be outlined in that color so it just throws in the next color in the in the list show layer yet we wanted showing I don't want to locked right away I wanted to print we can always turn this off later and it shows guides I could also lock my guides and a lot of people put their guides on a whole separate layer so they never accidentally grab a guide and moving you put on a separate layer and lock those guides so let's call this in here all right that is low kind of local rates in your state ok good I know where I am alright so under a near I have that new and now and I have been a turnoff I'm actually going to copy some stuff out of rocky mountain national park first because I want to make sure that I have this same text frame on the rainier layer and then I can move and make the changes that I need and keep in mind it always puts the layer above the one you were sitting on so I was on the main layer automatically put it right above rainier if I wanted that at the top for some reason I could move that all the way to the top down this case of each one's being printed separately but the order of the layers could be important if you're printing them all at the same time first is this main layer if I move the main layer above rocky mountain national park you noticed that the text got a little thin and that's because this image has opacity applied to it and I just moved it on top of the layer so everything behind it is being stuck behind that picture so make sure that later goes all the way to the bottom all right so let's go back to rainier if I turn off rocky mountain national park I see nothing. What I want to do is I want to copy this so I can either copy it into a paste in place on the proper layer or instead what I did is I selected it when I do, I get this teeny tiny little yellow dot over here and that's a proxy and that just means that I have stuff selected and I could just move that to that other layer click and drag it to any visible later has to be a visible layer, but I wanted I wanted to be copied because I still want to leave the rocky mountain national park one there so I'm gonna hold on the option key or the off key and drag up and let go if you notice he got a little darker and that's because there's actually two versions of the same text sitting on top of each other that's because I've got both players turned on let's turn off rocky mountain national park make sure we're in rainier I've actually selected it so I'm on that layer and we'll just come in here is it mount rainier? It is now we'll call it that so I just have that ready to go all right, so now I have that layer so now I can print that version of the copy, print that version of the cover and be ready to go so make sense for howto move those and add those great so we can either add a layer we can duplicate layers the other thing that we have is paste from members layers this is a really, really cool trick so let's say, I select everything let's, unlock this so I can actually select everything and I've selected everything we see here, I'm going to copy that and I'm going to come over to a new document and that document is also going to be four by five and a half, which is what size were sitting on here let's do that four by five and a half lips, I guess that's not the right one, four by five and a half all right, let's do that, and when I go to paste, if I have paced remembers layers turned on it's going to put everything back on the exact players I had, if I have layers already named main layer and and mount rainier and all that already have that it will put him on that layer, if it doesn't, it will create them. So in this case, I copied him out of there, and I'm saying paste remembers layers and I'm going to say it, I'm going to paste in place so it's going to put it in the same exact spot might be off a little because I might have my measurements wrong, but it will take it and pasted in place from where grabbed it, put it in there, and it also created the layers that I needed. Because I have paced remembers layers remembered what layers so everything still separated into layers, the colors are different because I only had one layer to start with, so of course it does the same colors across the board across each file. But the nice thing is each thing is on its own layer, just as it wass in the other document, you can turn that off if you want cause you may have one to grab everything and dump it all into one layer, but the cool thing is if I grab something from mount rainier, let's changes, we decided we wanted to spell this out, and now I copy that particular text frame and come back over here. It will paste it in exactly the right spot lips and it mean to delete all of that just wanted to leave this here, and if I paste it and not paste in place, but just paste with paste, remembers layers turned on it, put it on the right layer. If I undo that and don't have that turned on it, just pace it on whatever layer I current I last used, which was rainier let's actually say we're on this one and it will paste it on that particular layer so pace remembers layers is a really cool thing to have because it keeps track of everything is slayers makes sense yeah, no question. Yes, well, I have a question when when earlier, when we added the photo and we were doing text rap and you had to say ignore text rap to get the title on there could that title have been treated as a layer and just brought to the front instead of no it doing all that it will interact with the layers it will, it will yes, exactly. Well, it actually this one your options when you create a new one is that you could tell it that suppress you've been suppressed. Text ripp when it's hidden that's the only thing you do is you could turn that off so you could have a hidden layer that's there just for turning off text trap, which gets used a lot, so when the when the layers hidden, the text rap is totally ignored or I to leave that on, I'm sorry, I don't check that so it doesn't suppress it and you can have something on a hidden layer affecting text trap that doesn't even exist so you could have a shape that has text ripp applied to it and that shape is on that layer that's hidden but it's still affecting the text underneath it if that made sense all right, let's dio let's go ahead with pages because we got pages of master pages to do and I we'll make sure we have enough time for a for questions as well. All right, so hold your layers questions if we have them all right, let's, close these up. Get these guys out of here making a mess here and let's open up actually open up my rocky mountain grocer let's do this. So have lots of pages to work with some updated links, some links or out of date and that's okay, we can live with that. So let's, look at the pages panel the pages panel may or may not look like mind here. I mean, actually make some changes to this. This is not how I would normally set up my panel and that's a good thing to show you sew up under the panel menu the pages panel menu panel options kind of like the link panel options and I want to make sure I want to show that my master pages air on top, which they are, but I also want to show my master's vertically so I want him in a role like they are down below here and I want some nails turned on what can kind of see that I can see what my little pages look like with thumbnails turned on and I'm gonna go ahead and keep the medium icons we could have really big icons if we want jumbo icons as we like to call them and my master's, I'm going to actually do medium on that as well. So when I do that, I now have I can see my master pages on top and my document pages on the bottom and what's a master page let's go in and actually look at first when we look at pages first, then we'll look at the master pages, so down below these air might document pages. This is how I get around my document, so this document I can either sit and scroll like I've been doing I'm gonna pull my pages panel off, I can scroll that way if you have one hundred pages or something that's kind of a pain to do seem I want actually come in here, we could do that jump trick that I taught you the other day command j jumps us to a specific page, or I can find the page and then in the pages panel and double click and move around that way. One of things I keep doing is putting it into the window. I do command zero or control zero to fit on window that's something we need to learn to do a lot because as we're scrolling around suddenly that's not very helpful to us, so I fit that back in the window some other ways I can navigate around down here the very bottom we have some pull down menu or like I like to call it a pull up menu because it goes up so I can jump to the page here individually or I can use the forward and backwards keys on the jump to the beginning jump to the end all that's there's a lot down there we can also use a keyboard shortcuts as well, so I believe shift and narrow down is not going to work for me today. That's ok, so this keyboard shortcuts I don't use because I generally use the jump command I think as it's been around a long time I'm just used to jumping to a specific page that way there's a lot of different ways to work around and navigate through the page we can also add pages, which I showed you just a minute ago. If I have a page here, I want to add a page right behind it or right in front of it. I can tell it from the panel menu insert pages how many pages where it goes before after or the start of a document trend of document and how many pages you want to add so after page one let's go ahead and add eight pages after page one just as all those in there we have a bunch of blank pages but I'm going to do that is to many blank pages we don't need that many right, so that the document pages that's where we're laying everything else out on but the master pages our where we put items that we want to occur occur on all the doctor on many of the document pages so anyone elements that were going to use again and again we put on a master page I'm going to come up here and show you some of the master pages by double click on a master page well, we're going to create some in just a minute as well I have these elements I haven't image I have a title I also have this little section title down here is well when I come to a page that has that applied to it that's the bee master if you can see that b and I called it right full header actually gave it a name I can see what I have be applied to aiken look down here, it's kind of hard to seal zoom in a little bit there so you can see a b e these air the masters that are applied to the document page again will jump in masters a second look at those but I can see that that has be master applied to it all right, so those are things that appear and I can't just come in here and grab those items they're kind of locked in there on those masters pages I want to say one more thing on pages before we get into master pages sorry to jump around a little bit, make sure this is a question people ask me a lot when I had a page and I inserted those pages you know is inserted more pages right in a row vertically well, sometimes you want to see pages side by side you might want to have dr um and item span across two pages and you might want to see those side by side and what indesign assumes is that you have these pages and if you and one you must want to shuffle them all down and have them in the same way out, but sometimes you don't let's say foreign five was your middle spread and you want to put those side by side. I can do that I can either with no page selected come in here and just de select this thing that says allow document pages to shuffle because that's what it's doing by default but what I usually do instead I tend to keep them in single pages like this it's just easier for me to visually see my pages but let's say I want for five to be together I'm going to shift select both those pages glove to that panel menu and shoes allow selected spreads to shuffle I'm going to choose and that's going to be selected and now it puts little brackets around him and I congratulate page and put it up side by side so just drag until you get that little bracket on the side and now they're side by side and from the view window I can also choose to fit spread in window because what I've just created is a spread so I put two pages side by side now there in the window together so I can see them and kind of make sure especially in this case I would make sure they match and look the same does that make sense? I rearrange where those sit I mean actually undo that so get back to my single pages I have eight single pages in there and let's actually look at master pages so again I have some items that are here that I want to apply to a specific page so it's come down to this page here and it says I have master page a applied to it master p j looks like that that means there's nothing special about it haven't done anything to it and by default when you create a new document you have to master pages master page a and a master page of none and none is just kind of use that as a clearinghouse when I put too much stuff on and I've changed, it changed different masters sometimes I realized oh, now I've got to master boxes, one got left behind and and so I just take none and kind of clear out everything with that, but I can apply a master page to a document page by dragging it on top so if I want a master page applied to this, maybe I want that header I could come up here and look at master page b looks good, I'm going to grab this and his drag it on top and now I have those master page items that air there. I can't touch those right away, which is good again that's what we want, we don't want to be ableto accidentally drag our master page items that's the whole point of it. So that's what we apply a master page to him, I'm going to step out, create a new documents, we have a totally clean document and coming here to the master page and what I do is I generally have master pages based on other master pages, so any time you could do anything cascading and design is a good thing because you make a change toe one and those changes rippled down through everything else. So what I do let's say I'm going to do a book and I've got my right hand pages in my left hand pages on my master page, I'm going to come in here and I'm going to create everything I think I might need from my book on this master page a but then I'm going to have other master pages based on that and those are the ones I'm going apply to the document pages. All right, so let's, just show you what happens with that. I'm just gonna put big, ugly square on here and we're going to give it a color and we need we need some new colors in here. Let's grab some and add them to our swatches and I'm just gonna work with rgb that's fine and let's have that to the swatches and we need a nice blue gotta have a blue in there let's add that to the swatches as well. So he's now in our swatches we have something else to work with so let's make that we'll take this nice bright blue frame and on the master page a there I have that item and because this first doc, this document page by default always has a applied to it just by default whether or not you do anything with it, I now have that item sitting on that master page. If I try and select that item on this document page, I can't because it belongs to the master page and that's the whole point of it, you don't want to be able to make any changes to it necessarily without having to put a little effort into it so if I want to select us maybe I don't like where it sits on this page so maybe I'm going to have let's let's insert another page we'll just do one page and it has that same master applied to it so maybe on the first page I decided it's kind of in my way I need to move it down a little bit or do something to it so I need to go out of my way and hold on the command key in the shift key or the control and shift on a pc and click on that item so it's still connected to the master page but now I can do stuff to it right so I can move it down just because on this document page for whatever reason it's in my way it's my title page I want to put a title up here or something it's just in my way so now each page looks a little different but they still have master page a applied to it embraced it with me okay so when I come over to master page am double clicking on that and I selected I can change the color of this let's change it to the yellow and if I look at my thumbnails I can see that both of those updated and that's because on this page a master and document page one the only thing I did to that item was changed where it sat all the other information is still attached to that master page I change the color I changed the shape it's going to update with me but I changed where it sat on there, so I haven't severed it from the master page I've done what's called an override, so I've done a local override at any time I can select this item on document page one and I can tell it to get rid of that that local override that's there is becoming the master pages and remove my selected local override it will pop it right back up where it was on the master pain and again, I can't select it does that make sense? Because ok, wait, we're good all right thinking we're studying hard on this, right? We're looking at it ok, so I just undid that and brought it back. So anyway, I just want to show you that you can have master page items and they're kind of they're attached so that you don't accidentally move him, but you could go out your way and actually move them because sometimes you just need to make that extra change if you had a page number sitting on those you might have, you know, put something in front of it like a photo and on that one page it's just kind of weird or the page numbers sitting in the wrong place you can move in, tweak it on that page by doing this local override but it's still connected and that's a good thing what you don't want to do is you don't want to come in here and tell it to detach all objects from master because if you do that you've permanently severed it from the master page so let's go back and I'm going to actually take this master page override right back off so it's all exactly right where it was before I can't touch any of those, but like I said the master page a is one I probably don't use I'm going toe base a master page b and c on a okay we're going to work master do these cascading things so I'm gonna apply b and c throughout my document but the reason I have it all cascading back to master page a is so that if I change something let's say I changed a font that's on there I only have to change it a master page, eh? All the other master pages based on it will also change and all the document pages with those master pages will changes to having because sometimes I'll have thirty different masters in one document because I've got my title page about my ending page but they have a lot of similar elements so what I'm going to do really quick is I'm going to put in some page numbers and I'm gonna throw them really high on the page that could be well designed or anything like that, but just so we can see them and usually what I do, what I'm doing page numbers and we're gonna automatic we're going to automatic page numbering with this is I'll try and find the biggest, fattest number I think is going to be in my book because I want to make sure my frame is big enough and I don't get that over set text that little red plus, so I just draw them in the right now I'm just putting in numbers and I'm going to say, ok, good, I like that style, I like that size, whatever else let's make these twenty two points is well on putting these all a master page, eh? And then I haven't, right justified left justified and that's great animals going maybe put the title to my book, my awesome book, we'll just call it my awesome book today, and we'll make that a little bit bigger as well. All right, so that's, what my master page looks like if I come down here to master page or to document page one and two, it also looks like that we're going to really quickly create a master page I'm going to create a new master and it's going to be I can change the prefix if I want and I'll call this right hand I usually call this right and then I put odd so I remember that's where my odd pages go around my right hand side and I base it on master page a all right? So I'm just going to that one page everything looks the same and I'm gonna do the same thing I'm gonna create one more master page they want to make some changes to that you say this is my left hand and I will make that even I don't base that also a master page, eh? So now all my master pages look exactly the same except that a master page b and c I can't select anything because all those items belonged to master page a I could do the same keyboard shortcut and override those if I want, which is exactly what I'm going to do on master page b it's my right hand page so I don't need this left hand page number command shifter control shift on that deleted same thing on master page see command control shift delete that so now I have my right hand page on my left hand page, but my documents still have cm master page assigned all that so what I want to do is tell it let's assign the right hand page a and the left hand page to the second one so I have my right hand page my left hand page it's looking more like a book now, yeah, but we still these eighty eight's let's get rid of those I'm going to come back here and like I said, the reason I base all these other masters on one master at the top or one above it let's say we come back and he said the name of my book is just called my cool book we decided awesome wasn't the word we wanted. I only need to assign it here and it ripples down through all these master pages and all the document pages as well are we changed the font or whatever it is we've changed and come back here and we need to make these automatic page numbers so we select the page number here, come up under the tight menu insert special character. We were kind of down here earlier today and I'm going to come in here to markers and say current page number it's going to say a because that's the page number we're sitting on his master page a or if I come in here it's master page be right because this is the b template that's here but when it comes down to page one it's page one just like I needed to be come back up here to master page eh and do the same thing over here on the left hand side type insert special character markers current page number so now we have uh master page see and page to also has that assigned that makes sense to everybody ok every still what's wrong with me okay good. So the last thing I want to do on the master pages is coming out here and do a section header and here I'm just going to type I'm gonna type out the word chapter one whatever I just wanted to see what it looks like again I'm just styling it putting in the font I want doing whatever I want to it but I want this to be automatic I want the sections to show up automatically so I'm going to come up under the type menu insert special character markers and do a section marker right and that's a section that that's great I come here that's a section that's a section but it doesn't say anything on the pages and that's because the pages I haven't told it what the name of the section is and I have to for it to automatically appear by default you have one section in your new documents this little teeny tiny black triangle here that says that section one so but it doesn't have a name to it or anything, it just to say that's, the first section, you always have one section, so what I need to do is tell it that section one or chapter one or whatever I want to call it, starts here on this page summer double, click on the document page, go up to the pages panel menu and come down to numbering and section options, and I'm going to give it a name here's that section marker, I'm going to call this chapter one when I do that now that appears on the page, chapter one, chapter one, so it's going to continue until I start a new section, so what I'm going to do is I'm going to create a couple more pages, I'm going to create page three and page four, and I'm just dragging down the master page, so I get right and left hand pages, and here on page three is where I want chapter two to start, so I'm just going to make sure I'm on that page go up to the the panel menu numbering in section options, and I'll call this chapter two, and that automatically gets filled in because we created that section marker on there, so that's, that's some of the things you could do with master pagers, obviously a ton that weaken dio we could automate a lot of the stuff that's on here. We could have more than one page on a master page. You can have two pages side by, sorry sight. Even if you're not using facing pages, if you are using facing pages, you put two on there and then you drag it down. Is a set onto your facing pages set as well. But again, this is another reason. Like, why like this? The only drawback to this when I'm not working with facing pages and doing it this way is if I suddenly add one page after this, find out a page and now have a right hand page followed by right hand page fell by left hand page, so I have to fix this and say, this is the left hand page, and this is the right hand page. So that's one drawback to doing that, but for the most part, I do this last anyway, so I'm I'm usually pretty much ok, but anyway, that's a quick way to do master page items so anything that you want to appear all the time so I might have pages based on pages. Francis I might have a left page and create a new one, a new master based on that master page, see that's left but the other thing is it's left and maybe it's no color bar or whatever or maybe I have a lot of new stuff that's in there so I'm here I'm coming to this page it looks exactly like my left camp age but this one doesn't have that color bar so again but because I I assigned it are based it on this item which is based on this item all I need to do is come back here and make the change and all the changes rippled down throughout my book that makes sense excellent cool only sure got master pages we do paid his layers good so do we have any questions on any of those everybody's head is just about to explode I could feel it simmering under the surface all right let's see what the internet has reality what's that can we rewind rewind reality no not today I do not have it tomorrow though yes you could do it again tomorrow what is the internet have for me anything there there was a lot of questions and there's more coming and everyone was kind of hanging on your every word right there they were like what what did you just wait rewind rewind they already lining the real logic exactly so I think we have time for about two questions okay great these ones are a bit levy so ok start with this one this is from case and they say, I get confused when doing a booklet slash pamphlet on multiple on multiple pages if I know I want it printed on eight, eight, eight and a half by fourteen to a front and back or on a custom size, should I create pages of the custom size or create the parent page size and divided up for printing? Most likely you will want if I were doing, let me take my eight half by eleven, if I was doing in half by eleven printed book, they're probably turned it on eleven seventeen. I'm going to lay out each of my pages at let a half by eleven when a layout like pages as my page size this way, not the whole piece, how they're going to print it, because I don't know how they're going to print it, and most printers probably don't want you to do it and the whole layout, they wantto take these pages because, like I said, I work in single pages. I would do these ane af eleven set him off to my printer, he's going to run it, if through his magic printing software for a copier and it's going to take those pages and he's going to hit the magic, paginated or booklet button, it's going to take a page one in eight and put a magically on eleven seventeen, because unfortunately a lot of designers do is they'll put page one and two together on the same page page one and two together don't print on the same page if you're doing saddle stitch books so my recognitions always do the final trim size so say enough by eleven doesn't matter that they're going to run it bigger and to up or four up and trim it down do it on the final page dies and if all else fails talked to your printer before you do anything and asked them how they want it so great all right the next question is from el mcguire and I bring up his question because we've been following all day yesterday he's been here the whole time and he was he's making that your book student page on I think this is applicability to a a lot of photographers and designers out there they're doing similar things but eso using a yearbook student page layout I've created tables under each student's name I am able to just tab over and fill each other each name but when I go to the next row of students text I have to move my cursor is there a way to link those text tables together so that all I need to do is just tab over one to the next student's name so he has a separate separate table for each row it sounds like a thing he could do it as create along you know how many rows you need always asked more at more but have each one and do the linked table like we did before so you could do you could do that step during each one individually just create one the table and let's insert a table and let's say, we know we're going to have thirty rose or something like that and unfortunately it's going to do here is going to be really small, but I can create it so that I only see one and then I can make that one bigger we'll make this frame later I can actually make that bigger, but I can work with that and say ok, that's the size that I need of that particular road clothes of all those other rose and then link that so link each one, so make it the size that we need, but we can make each one in the next row so that's kind of how we did it before, we'll just make sure that it was only wide enough to show one row of names that we need, and obviously I wouldn't have four columns. I would have one column instead, but you could just link them together and then that way as he's typing along and gets in his tab, it will go to the next row, which is in a separate text frame