Joe Buissink: The Pitch, Continued
I want to continue a little more in the pitch because it is a big part of what I do and uh the experience is important to me so initially you saw me handling the prince and I'm showing my bride and groom here the prince and we talked about it so the question a lot of people said well, don't you show any slide shows absolutely I do so what I'm a do is I have on my laptop maybe three four slide shows that I will show but the first slice show maybe just of moments and I talk about that so they saw a little bit here but again what I'm trying to do is get them completely involved into the images and that's setting the tone with music the smell of the candles all of that stuff right? So what I'm a do after seeing these prints is have this laptop and I might explain I would be sitting right next to them maybe it's right usually it's the bride you know um but I don't know if you guys can see me from where you are right now but I'll turn a little bit sideways so that you get an idea what I'm a ...
do and this is very subtle okay? You have to kind of read your clients to see if you can get away with this or not if I do this with chinese couples in china I probably won't do this because it's a culture that isn't really familiar with touch so much not from someone they don't or barely know, right? So even with the groom, I will do this, my hands is a way of communicating it's very soft, it's on the elbow, it's on the shoulder, it's it's when I'm talking, I rest my hand on part of their bodies because it's a connection to me and psychologically it's subconscious it's a connection interestingly enough, I just did a pitch for a celebrity client a couple days ago, and when I walked away after she met me, she hugged me and she said, you have great eyes, a wonderful heart and very nice hands. And I have never heard a bride say that I had nice hands that's the first time, and it made me realize how much of this I do even subconscious to me that I actually touched my clients. Sometimes when I'm explaining something, it is a connection. So by the time that I get to the wedding it's joe, you know, it's like cousin joe, you know, and his hugs I get hugged a lot by my clients, and I hugged them right back because we're now very familiar at this point by the time I get to the wedding of someone they know it's no longer the vendor the guy with the camera in the corner somewhere that gets paid it's no longer that person is the person that's invited into their family and I'm really this is very important we all are invited in two people's lives one of the most important next two berths one of these most important days and people's lives and so I always feel for me that I need to treat this as an honor that someone I know I'm being paid I know I'm a pain vendor but it is really important to acknowledge the fact that this was wow thank you so much when I leave the wedding when I leave the wedding you guys every time I seek out my bride and groom and I say thank you so much I have just what a blessing this was for me to be here today I really appreciate you guys having hired me and inviting me into your lives for this day I got a ton of stuff very beautiful emotional stuff I cried a few times e I let them know how important this was for me yeah so what happens afterwards what am I doing? I'm still pitching or not if you think about it I'm still continuing the experience and now the phone call a year later comes joe I'm pregnant I would love for you to photo photograph me pregnant done or joe I want you to shoot the birth I've done that more than once where I actually go into the hospital room and there are rules in california you have to be family member to be in the birthing room, so I'm uncle joe, they tell the doctor I'm bringing uncle joe in he's going to he's got a camera is going to shoot it because if you're not ah family member, you can't be in that birthing room, so I'm usually uncle joe and I come in and I photograph is a matter of fact. Roy and liza from triple scoop music invited me into their lives to shoot their birth of their son incredible just just beautiful to be so it continues, right? So then it's the one year birthday party then maybe the five year birthday I mean it goes on and on and on. Leann rimes, you probably all know, right? I shot their wedding last year in april two thousand eleven I did their renewal vows this year in april in kabul san lucas they set the same vows, it was just the two of them and me just the three of us to go to combo to shoot it all over again, I will go back and shoot her birthday twenty eighth birthday this coming sunday, I stay in their lives, they become family to me I'm family to them, we're friends and that's what it's about it's more than being a paid gig a paid vendor I now continue and create another if you want to think about it business out of it at the one hand it is a business I'm getting paid to do these things to shoot family get togethers instead of doing a family portrait, I do a lifestyle shoot. What that means is that I actually document the family for a day, sometimes three days I pitched the steven spielberg the potential of shooting their family once a month for a year and then creating a book saying a slice of time in the lives of the spielbergs what do you think they'll do with that book a whole year? And yeah, there'll be a few post images, but imagine any family ah, whole years worth of documenting or maybe a week it's worth that book is going to be passed down from generation to generation to generation that's how brilliant that will ideas instead of one photo on the wall ah whole book and the lifestyle shoot is just that it is shooting things like I'll be there at six a m when you wake the kids up and I'm going to photograph you waking up the kids, I'm gonna photograph you cooking breakfast, I'll photograph you taking them to school, I'll wait for you to go shopping in the afternoon in the evening we'll come back we'll shoot some dinner stuff you want to watch tv I'll do all of that I'm documenting a family in one day of their lives and that is a book it's not one photo that's a whole book and that's a whole new business because people really in my experience want to purchase a book that has a whole story in it not just one photo of who they are standing up next to each other you know with ruffles the dog and all white on the beach doesn't say a whole lot but what it does say when you shoot it the way that I'm describing is what happened that day and guess what they'll do they'll relive it so when they flip that book open they can relive that entire day all over again so it's beautiful to stay in people's lives it's it's my that that's my payoff right for me that's my payoff okay and I'm getting paid to that's another payoff so if I were sitting next to him I would go into this one slide show called moments one and so right on the coat tails of showing these prints say I just want you to see quickly set the music one little slide show so let's just take a peek at that and here we go just for more from feeling fine honey I wanna be oxygen just form through for me wait I can't wait to be oxygen just for you me what just like the first time wait wait wait teo wait oxygen just for a moment I feel fine left finding me wait wait wait wait I wanna be oxygen just for mom threw me wait I can wait just for a way me just like the first time wait wait wait teo wait oxygen just for a moment I feel a fine left finding me wait wait wait wait I wanna be just for me basically it's moments initially right so this is just to give you a splash of kind of what I was showing you here then I tell a whole story so clients want to see wedding front back how you see it not not not just one of ok these are the best of right if you think about it so then I go into a slide show of you guys are about to see leann and eddie mike my dear friends now um their wedding basically so now I go into a slide show to show front to back my idea eight hundred images narrowed down to about eighty so a tenth of their wedding photos are in here right here so here we go you ready? Wait feeling is in my way wait it's in my soul this way it makes it any easier nice give it a way give it us feelings in my heart wait if it's in my soul way way want breast of you staring into me stand way wait feelings in my way wait it's in my soul this way makes it easy nice give way give it us feelings in my heart wait difference in my so wait wait no wait feelings in my way wait it's in my soul this way makes it easy nice give way give it us feelings in my heart wait tiu way difference in my so wait way rest ofyou staring intothe stand way wait feelings in my you know you gotta show him everything sometimes I even show my clients entire set of proofs so I'll have picked taj make proof books with all seven, eight hundred images in it you know there feel bigger in this, right but their little books the really beautiful and usually one wedding has two books and so I handed you want see the whole wedding I mean this is the edited proofs right here and I handed tomb and they flip so they get a sense from front to back exactly what you mean great to have one great shot it at a wedding so when you just show them one of it doesn't really give decline kind of and here again, what am I doing to separate myself? Most people don't do that giving a whole set of proofs declined to look at or entire story more than one I do two three story you know I'm throughout the whole wedding day nailing shots like this not just one not just two but the entire wedding so again when I show a full wedding like this I'm about to show you one here I preface it with a story like I'm about to show you man don and peter and when down and peter are jewish persian jewish is mandana and in peter's american jewish and you know jewish weddings they they usually have a tuba signing beforehand so that's usually when they see each other for the first time because they have to come into the board room of some hotel and they meet each other and can you imagine you know bright coming in one hour from one door and a group of hi honey hi nice dress love it's not exactly what most brides will want the groom to say first time out a lot of them my bryce want that oh my god and that usually is when she's walking down the aisle right however if there's a tuba signing jewish weddings will have the usual if always before the ceremony I'll set it up so I told my dad you know what I can sense that this is really important for you what if I set this up in the hallway of where were you guys getting married that's great that's great that's great so I put peter in the hallway I told both of them look, I'm gonna put you in the hallway she's going to come from behind I'm gonna take some shots and peter and then I'm gonna ask you to turn around see for the first time okay? He says ok, what I didn't tell him that in front of peter is his family who were gonna what see her before he does so he's going to be looking at his family and they're going to go peter and he's going to say junk in it to sit tight for a second what am I doing? I'm lining a little fire under peter see, I know what's there I want access to it so I need to build it up a little bit what they also don't know behind him is her family so who sees her coming down a staircase first her family so first you he hears oh my god one donna and then the persian jewish people little little little do they're saying which I can't do sorry, sorry god, I want to do that so bad and they see it come down so peter's already like that he's like anxious joking it around I'm standing right in front of him face the things that have not yet and then she comes down he sees his family, his father, his mother, his sisters and uncle all going my god, pierre and he's flipping out right now and I'm gonna hang on, hang on. We're almost there, man and then I go, huh? Peter? Oh, my god! So I'm adding a little more fuel to fire joe joe, I got it around. Not yet. Not yet. Yes. So, peter, I do this whole explanation thing. First, I'm gonna take a photo of you she's out of focus in background. Second one is a photo of her. You're out of focus in the foreground together in the book. Really cool. Peter, what am I doing? I'm sliding because he just wants to turn around really badly, right? So I'm gonna say I'm gonna go behind her now I'm gonna shoot over his shoulder and peter and when I say turn, turn to your left cause I've already got this frame I want her as part of the picture and then him some I'm explaining this to you why I'm pitching you did you understand? I'm putting you in the story already you haven't even seen it yet? I want you by the time you see that part to go oh god that's so beautiful and in part it is however I'm already I'm pitching you, I'm putting you in the show before the show's even aired you know so I've set up your mind to expect those photos and when those photos show up I've already told you what I was doing and why I was doing it so then my question is going to be so this is a really photo journalistic but when you see peter's face I want you to tell me if that's truth if that is a real moment and how he feels because it absolutely is so I continue forth with the explanation is look is not pj I staged that I set it up I had a hand in and it's not photojournalism okay but is that what's in here did I get access to that are you seeing what he's really feeling in that moment and that's where I leave it yes you can you can ask a question just do you not encourage first looks you encourage first okay I thought that you had sounded like you oh no this wasn't the norm no I encourage it for a couple of reasons if I can get the first look happening right now that this is all dependent on the climate's well if that bright insists the first time is me walking down and it absolutely whatever you want but I explained for the photographer I'm gonna tell you why this is easy for me we do the first look right behind it the parents are their families their bridal parties in the wings we do all the photos of everybody before ceremony then from ceremony to reception I don't break you up for anything I do the portrait shots of you guys before ceremony so we have nothing but pj the rest of the way because the worst thing is when everybody goes to cocktails and you tell the bride and groom stay you tell the parents stay bridal party state you guys don't get to go everybody else's whooping it up having their glasses of wine you guys gotta do photo shoot now a real drag what I want from ceremony a reception because they've just seen they're best friends and family members get married they want to hug them smooch on him cry with them I want to shoot that if I tell them stay you guys go on our later they come back they've had two glasses of one there is the bride and groom that's what I get it's not the same is oh my god honey that's what I want to shoot so for me and of course up to you because if you want the look on his face when he sees you for the first time absolutely but I can create it right so for me this is easier I'd say ninety percent of the time dude I want your way I absolutely want that because for them this is a you know what? This is not a photo shoot right, I'm trying to not make the wedding a photoshoot. I want it to be fun, a party love all of that documented, and yet we do a little photo shoot but beforehand, and it doesn't end up being his long, drawn out thing that that's what's important to me and declines that hiring because one of my pitching just that right by virtue of the slide, show my explanations that's what I'm pitching, so don't you think that by the time someone books you based on what I'm showing you in this pitch that we're on the same page we are, she was exactly what I want. So how easy is it for me as a photographer to go to this gig to go? I just gotta please joke, I don't have to worry about pleasing mom, they get what I do, this is why they hired me, so I don't go to wedding thinking about that. What am I going to do for the bright on mom? She wanted something completely different, they don't, I don't. I just worry about how my going to make joe happy, and joe is seeing eye candy, feeling eye candy it's about not just seeing the images is about feeling them and as I said to you before, isn't a photograph when you look at it, when I say this it's really it really resonates with me because it's for me so much who I am the truth it's not just about the feeling in the photo it's how I feel about that photo that's also in there, you know? I mean it's not just about that moment that I captured it's how I felt about that moment that's in there as well, right? Because again that click of the shutter is that for me was the moment that I was feeling so I am not just documenting blank from me from my perspective, it's just what's happening out there, it's a reflection of how I feel about it and who I am that I also impart and you do the same thing most people don't know this, you impart yourself into these images that's what I want you to connect to all of you, all of you feel this way, all of you cry at weddings, there isn't one person that I haven't seen that haven't felt passionate about weddings, so why not access that function from that place and give that client exactly how you feel? Not just what happened, how you feel about it when you go to a gallery and you look at a piece of art on the wall, don't you think it's a kind of ah triangle if you think about it, it's about the image it's about the person looking at the image and it's about the person that created the image it's a three way connection if you think about it it's about the image what's in it, the content it's about the person that's viewing it, how they feel about that, and then it's also a reflection of the person that took it. Why can you say after a while having known andrea karate, a person or robert do wanna know and look at in him as you go that's the person? How do you know what if you didn't see the signature but someone who knows percent can say that's a person and it's different from that so liebowitz that's, that's that's a dune up guano because they've imparted themselves what we call style is in imparting of yourself into the photographs of recognizable years down there long said, hey that's a sean sean did that shot. How do you know? I know shaun's work? How do you know that? I know sean is a shawn's in that photo. Get what I'm saying. It really works that way. Okay, so, peter, I just explained to you mondano and peter's thing, right? So then I go right into showing that slide show are you guys ready back there he is ahead of me so pay really particular attention and by the way and notice that I'm still explaining things I'm telling stories along the way you're gonna see some black and whites right of her father coming into getting ready room and he hasn't got his eyes open five frames or so on his eyes are no it's not a mistake he came in saying I don't want to see her I just want to hug her I want to see her for the first time when she goes out they're coming down the stairs so he comes in with his eyes closed he hugs her he kneels in front of her and takes her hand and places her hands on his shoulder then he backs out of the room crying without once looking at her that was so powerful do you understand my story that I just told you do you know how powerful that is so that when you see these images you tell me how you feel about him okay I ask you some very nicely and if you say so on't hesitate flying tio gus and jar away challenges ever meet us there and flying teo even in time contradict thing you say you get me my ground thank you yes no so very nice name I know that things get out of it bring us down way just take my hand but not so many god get going because you know running so I ask you I just love I ask you some very nicely and if you say you don't hesitate flying tio just giant okay and you're aware of the challenges that will meet us there and flying in teo even in time contradict thing you say you get me my ground thank you no I asked so very nicely I know that things get out and bring us down way just take my hand but not so many oh god I asked so very nicely I know that things can get out bring us down way just special get going because you made money so I ask you I asked john wait ah love I ask you some very nicely and if you say you don't hesitate client tio gus giant to kay and jar away challenges beverly as then and while flying teo even in time contradict thing you say you get me my ground thank you yes you asked so nicely I know that things get out of way bring us down way just tell him I am not some many oh god I get it because you made money so I ask you ask john love I ask you some very nicely and if you say you don't hesitate flying tio gus giant to kay and you're aware of the challenges beverly us then and flying teo even in time contradict thing you say you get me my ground thank you. No I ask you a very nice man I know that things get out of way bring us down way just my not some money oh god I asked so very nicely I know that things get out bring us down way just smash get a ring because you made money so I ask you ask john wait I asking some very nicely and if you say you don't hesitate flying tio tell gus trying to king and jarl cool so when you think of peter's reaction right now wasn't pj but dad how he felt did everybody else feel that way to his father her sister they all wept that to me is what it's about okay so if I have to have a hand in it look I don't believe in being like this one hundred percent pj guy I'm thiss guy that guy I'm a bag of tricks whatever it takes for me to have access to who they are and document that if that means having a hand in it but I call it what it is right it's not photojournalism because photojournalism you can't touch it you can't even move this that no longer becomes pj now right? You can't touch it so and that's my background spend a couple of years working for a newspaper so you're not supposed to alter anything in the scene so I do this constantly you know I can't help it but we're I'm not shooting for a newspaper I'm shooting for my client so it doesn't matter to me so that's pretty much where I met with this typically will end up with another slide show about moments but you see how this worked about putting you in there it's I pitched everyone that saw this just now was pitched by me simply with a story I placed you in it and I pitched you that's what this is that's how strong the pitches I want you to think about that the pitch it's crucial it is absolutely crucial and that's how you separate yourself from everybody else that just slaps on this and talks about prices it says nothing about who he is or who she is the pitch you get an opportunity to show them who you are and that's what you're selling okay, so that's pretty much where I am with this if you you know what there's gonna be some online questions we can end with questions that would be awesome and then we'll grab lunch and then we'll go into ah camera equipment and how I utilize it and into a little bit of shoot for the afternoon that sound good you guys ready to shoot a little? All right, awesome. Okay, what do we have? We have questions tens of questions where you d'oh or are there any questions from the students? My question is probably were more about like how shocked you mentioned how you have a humane shooter? Yeah but these images these are online your images. So you said how it was shot the last few frames just so that we can get teo, which he may not be able to get to right now. Hang on a second. Those that I have here at the back end, the very last few are my main shooters. Images the formals in this particular case were mine, and I mixed it in with some other. Now he did as well shoot formals, but the last few party frames where there dancing with that low light, and the cake cutting, and then the panel's being thrown that the very last frame that's my second shooter, rich he did that. I call him my second shooter, but the clients know him to be the primary shooter, right? So he shoots that I'm done by then I'm getting older. E I need to be out of there can do ten hours. Why can ten hours? I could twelve hours. I've done those before in mexico, but what I try and do this, you get me for seven hours here in the packages. I'll jump ahead will cover it. Mohr you know closely day three, but my typical pack is me seven hours rich or don or one of my second shooter's, eight outs, no overlapping because I don't want someone to hire me for the first seven hours and then rich comes on my end and he goes for another eight hours now covers fifteen hours there's no overlapping, he starts the same time as I do. I am with the bride, I never leave her side, he is with the groom and then he does the formals. I grabbed all the shots around him like, I don't know if you saw that one formal they're looking at him while I'm shooting over his father's hands and where he was seated and in the background there's a formal shot going on, so in the book it will be his formal and then one of joe's little detail moment kind of things next to it or underneath it or somehow it's incorporated and that's what? Where it becomes a really nice fix. One of the things I'm really crews show it's really crucial for me to do I'm kind of anal about is timing the cameras so before we go to a gig time my cameras to his cameras so that when we all stick, stick it together. My client does not know who shot what she's clearly aware of when I was with her, so all the images of her getting ready, joe was there for that, so that was joe, but then she sees the groom getting rid that she knows that's my main shooter but during the rest of it she doesn't know who's who's and it doesn't matter us we know who shot what but at the point where the clients he's eight hundred images it doesn't matter who shot it right so it's just the seamless little corporation of both of us if you ask me so I noticed that you are not afraid to get up close and personal during the ceremony what are your standards do you walk in front of the guests between to get in the couple yeah do you notice that when she walks down the aisle I like walking behind her right now tell you why during that time my primary shooters in the first row pew whatever you wanna call it on his knees in the aisle because he wants the document her from the front what I'm after is his expression so I will peek over her shoulder I will duck down so when I come in behind the bride low so that he doesn't see me I don't want him to see me as she's coming down the aisle when he sees me pop up he moves out of the way so I get a scene over the shoulder because I want to use dad and her as the framing for his face now what if that was the first time he saw her? Awesome! I got so many of those but even if we set it up beforehand, it still may not be new but he's still going to smile any season so that's what I want and so that one get and dad does this I'm still right here but I'm kind of low I'm shooting up right click click click that whole thing and as soon as they move on to the alter or onto where they're getting married I'm out of the way a lot of the stuff over the shoulder that you saw seventy two, two hundred racked into two hundred I mean I shoot from a distance but I get close um capra he has no this photographer capra he did what were two stuff he said if the shots not good, you weren't close enough and he meant it two different ways you weren't close enough teo what was going on but more importantly you didn't zoom in on this thing right? And that that's me so a lot of my stuff my favorite lenses a seventy two hundred it's just for outside that's everything mean that lens and we'll talk about lenses later on when we go into the shoot but I use prime's a lot to the eighty five one point two fifty one point two twenty four one four those are really dropped gorgeously but that is also when I use flash on camera bouncing light and I need only one point eight of life because then my flash khun do it right I can bounce it and I can do it all day long yeah so we'll talk about that minute but go ahead do we have questions from online? Absolutely oh did you want to ask a question you want one yeah so in today's day and age the internet is where people probably find you first how do you take the people off the internet and bring him into the studio? The pitch is very something you could easily do but how do you get them? They're well actually I get a lot of work from coordinators I get a lot of work I'd say probably seventy eighty percent is coordinator driven you know what's interesting sometimes when I go to a wedding and a client friend or brother sees me shooting they'll come up to me and we'll go kind of love the way you move I love the way you work this thing can I have a business card? I don't I don't have one I'm sorry I don't use business cards and I want you to know the psychology behind that high end clients I don't want to be told to see someone don't want to be handed a card they want to find you so if I see that this guy's squirming you don't have a business card no no um get a napkin I'll give you my name I love this you understand? They write down my name that they call me later, or I tell him, better yet, ask the bride what my name is. She'll give you my website, there's something about the high end client, their leaders, they're not followers, so if you hand them stuff or if you leave cards on the table, it works for middle america, the people they're blue collar workers, and I'm not dying trying to globalize this thing. It's just a mentality, okay? I have noticed in the seventeen years that the high end clients that I kind of a track, I don't like to be handed a card, they simply don't like it. So I tell them even their friends I don't, I don't have anybody and I don't. I don't have any business cards. So how do I get business that way at the wedding? When I say take down my name and they jot down my name on a piece of napkin or the coordinator ok, the coordinator, because again, the high incline wants to find me. They don't want me to spy super blasted out there in the ethers they they don't find me that way. You think hyeon client goes on the online and spends hours look, searching from photographers, they hire coordinator and they say who's the best what are you looking for? The coordinator and what kind of style are you looking for? And then she'll give a choice. I'm not the only one they recommend, but there might be three four of us that they get to look at. So I depend on my coordinator so that's how they come in to me? My coordinates air you veil for x, y or z that's my business model that's how that works so that's kind of how I do that, joe, will we have a ton of questions, but we're gonna ask just one question before we go to break, okay? There was a lot of confusion in the chat room terror of the photo had asked, how do you separate photo responsibility between you and your assistant during a ceremony? And I think because you're talking about your second shooter being a primary shooter, if you could just kind of explain that again, what? What you're saying that they're getting this safe shots and you're doing more of an artistic thing? Is that what you're well, yeah, there they're getting the perfunctory needed shots. Typically you get the bridal party walking down the aisle, so yes, I do relegate that to him or her, I have both women and men as primary shooters, but having said that, what I mean is two views so the rule for us when we go to jobs if you see me or I see you are in the wrong place I don't want him or her photographing the same thing I'm photographing and the minute I walk in and he's shooting something I walk out because they were just doing double duty right? So the other rule is if he's doing the formals which is the rules the rule is I don't I don't touch formals I don't do table shots I don't do any of that I love my job um in part it was selfish for me to look at it that way but that's how after seventeen years I stay fresh and wanting to shoot weddings because if you think about seventeen years in and out doing the same old same old, same old after a while you become a little complacent you like don't care anymore oh my god if I have to see one more cake cutting or one more bridal party shot with them jumping in the air with or without sunglasses so I decided I hire someone to do that because the couple still want that mom still wants that and they're entitled to it but if I want to stay in those moments I need to separate me from another shooter and make that shooter's responsibility all the stuff I don't want to do and so that's pretty much how I've done here the rules if I see you you don't see you see me we're in the wrong place be your shooting all the foremost table shots anything mom wants and direct you and grabs you to go do that's your gig I on the other hand will stay with the bride and groom I will stay in the moment that's my job so if someone says can you grab our table I will point to rich and say rich go get the table and you know what's really great if you think about at the reception and harriet and uncle henry who has seen rich do the formals right? Okay, now comes reception time and here's the dance first dance is happening and now it's everybody's joining the dance floor but aunt harriet after a glass of wine and uncle henry now she says the henry henry get the photographer to take our photo so henry starts walking towards me only because I was closer she screams across the dance world henry no, the other one the real one! Yes! Go to the real one. It's brilliant! The fact that I've managed to grab someone more than one and we alternate who's available to do the primary shooting forming that mom wants everybody seen this guy do all the formals he must be the real deal and leave me alone to my moments the better my work has gotten and it's not so much that my work actually has gotten better. I get more of it because I'm not pulled here and then here to do the very state, and I miss that moment. So that's, the whole reason for me to have hired people that were, quote unquote, primary shooters who think I answered that right, it's amazing! I'm gonna sneak one more question actually eso seventeen years and all of this experience and how you have maintained creativity and also a positive spirit throughout the whole process and continue to be giving and invested in the emotional experience. And andy from malaysia is wondering, have you ever had a bad day prior to the wedding or just before the wedding? And how do you deal with it? How do you how do you get yourself back and into that moment? Yeah, great question and awesome. Yeah, I'm just like everybody else. I have bad days what I've realised and because again, it's who I am and who you are that you bring to the photography if you come with a bag of stuff from the night before because she got into a fight with your wife, girlfriend, whatever it's going to affect the way you see, because there was a time years ago where I came to a wedding I photographed it and I had some kind of like uh miscommunication with the wife whatever it was and I was a little annoyed and someone commented on my work after that saying boy, you have some serious visual commentary on this wedding, didn't you? I did I shot it like any other way, but I focused a little heavy handedly on some of the not so nice moments because I was a little pissy okay? And I was carrying that with me so what I realized was that I need to leave everything at home when I leave for a gig and so what I do know I have this habit of going into a bit of a half an hour meditation if you will it's just quiet time for joe and I try and let go of stuff so that I come tabula rasa blank slate when I get to the wedding so that the baggage I have is not affecting my gig and that takes I'm still doing it. A lot of these things I'm telling you all about now is I'm a work in progress and I'm still practicing every single day I will never perfect it and if god help me if if I ever say I've got done it I'm perfect now slap me because then I'm over as an artist that my life is done as an artist so it's an ongoing process by letting go of stuff that, you know, I check in with myself in the morning of the wedding. How my feeling. Is there anything that I'm hanging on to right now? What's my thought process, and I figure out a way by letting go of it through a little bit of relaxation and meditation before I go to the wedding.