Is there uh we're talking about this this idea of committing have have there been instances where like either you as a producer or you as a musician there's there's less time in the studio on dh that like because it happened to you guys well yeah and that's that's based on, you know, like we were talking about that's my original like my whole thing when doing all those victory records and doing a lot of stuff back in that I can come from the indie world where there wasn't huge budgets I mean, I've made records, you know, I've made major labor records with, you know, six figure budgets and that's all fine and good and it's great and you go to a nice studio sometimes and you know, they're cater and it's wonderful, but you know, that's it doesn't make it better and to me, sometimes the immediacy of making all those really fast punk records that I did have, you have five days to make a record, you have seven days to make a record. You know, two weeks was like, oh, my god, it's a luxury at ...
one point it was like that was like, wow, we have two whole weeks how are we gonna what are we going to do for two weeks that's that's too much time, you know, and yeah that you had to commit and you had to not overthink it back then you literally it's like even sometimes with the punches and getting things tights like I listen it's like you don't get so type but it's like it's tight enough and it sounds good what does it make you feel like you know I mean it's again it's about listening it's not about looking and that's I love I love the aspect of tape with that because to have a look and don't listen they look at the screen they go it's not tight it's tight or it's not tell you it's like what does it sound like does it feel like so yeah they're looking at like lining up with the kick germans like no wrong you know and it's like I it forced you to commit when you had no time you had that was it's like it's good yeah good next move on I got good and I imagine it's an important thing for a pretty assertive yeah you know that's part of the job like figuring out all right we need to commit we need to move on I need toe rather spend more time in the mixing you know so yeah I mean, I just I literally just finished uh this punk band they're called high tower from paris that came over from paris to work with me and uh they're much they're very much in like that old school vein of like some of the bands they uh they're very influenced by a lot of the bands that I've produced back like lifetime and kid dynamite back in the nineties and we did that record, we tracked it in sixteen days and they weren't even honestly we could attracted in ten nine because they were very it was almost like lacks daze because they were not saying that you're all european, they're very european about their approach they're not little one working twelve hour day they want to work up to six hour day nothing honestly and I mean offense to anybody watching from europe. It's but it's definitely more flossing in a way it's good because sometimes the more time you have, the more time you use, you know and you you contend over thinking I've done and I've been guilty of it we've all been guilty of it. You overthink things sometimes and in the immediacy of having no time forces you to just go ok, good next and not think about it too much. So I guess the second part of my question then would be been for you are there any things like on the first couple of dillinger records or those gps that you would have changed like you, you here that maybe and, you know I want to go back and I wish I could have gone back and, you know, did something different on calculating incident a year that's a really good question, you know, uh, when I listen to him now, they think it's so sloppy, I can't believe like we let that stuff go, I'm like, oh, my god, like the two guitars don't even sound like the video a time we were doing it, it sounded we were like, wow, that's so tight, so it was super tell you, and everyone else did too, you know, criticized for being too tight, you know? And but I remember at the time, I just wanted it to sound like the record I loved and being disappointed that we didn't have spent enough time in the base tone doesn't sound like pantera or I didn't sell you no r and at the end of the day, so many people reference that record as the one the one with the least time that has its own sound like it sounds like calculate face sounds like alchemy of sounds like that's what I talk about, like, you know, it's not important there's no right or wrong way like he says, you're trying to make it sound like somebody else it's just is it good doesn't work? Is it right as a whole and so but I think closer to listening to the record when I when we first did it, I probably a million things I want to change, but looking back, I see the value in the fact that it is its thing, and it has it this thing, and it is a piece of time and in its special, so, um, I think obviously I would like, you know, things that messed up or something I would like to see better, but and, uh, dance your question, I guess, overall, I think as more time goes by, I see the value in having its own thing, and it is good the way it is, yeah, I mean, I go through even, like, sometimes because I used to always, like, check things on my ipod so, like, when I'm not like the gym, whatever, like I have, like, a lot of records and mixes have done like we'll put on random shuffle play in the mix will come on that I did, like, you know, ten years ago, whatever, and it's, not like I'm like, oh, I'm so until like, my meat, my music, I produce that I'm listening to it, but it'll come on, then I'll just be like, only listen to it, and then I'll be like oh, man, I should have done this I should have you know, like I could have gotten a better guitar sound I could have done the middleman that mix doesn't sound good you know, like you always you know, maybe I'm never satisfied you know but but then as a whole stepping back from it it's like oh yeah that's pretty cool yeah I mean, I think for most people are into this stuff like I think any artist done when you run out of money you know that's it you know that that's your answer yeah, yeah no, but yeah, I think you know a cz any type of, you know, artists or any creative thing you know, you're always gonna you know, because you're always you're constantly you're fine you don't want to rest on your laurels and you don't wantto it's become too comfortable because that's the death or creativity so it's like you know you're always gonna think about things that you want change and do and, you know, maybe try for the next time you know? So yeah, you mentioned you've been working together for eighteen years I think ben was there any period in that time where the band started working with other producers and kind of had this moment of realization that we should really go back to steve was there like a, um a story of trying the grass on the other side and then coming it almost didn't want was triggered was it? Uh, penny, you mix a pattern, right? The canopy I didn't record, I only missed that's the only thing besides recovery p that you you did on your own that that was the only thing that yeah, we hadn't worked together on, you know, sometimes it's just it's, you know, it's it's just a matter of means, like way it was a scheduling thing, I we moved to california, so we did it locally, and then we still brought him in to put its touch on it because we consider him his part of our sound. But, um, again, like, I don't know, man, at this point, I've learned so much from working with him that I know there's certain things that I want out of our records that he brings to the table, and I know there's certain things that sometimes doing little gps or whatever like I we just put out a seven inch just a tour only single that we put out that I just recorded at home and sounds different, you know, it's a different thing, but, um it's it's a combination of just, uh, a lot of things of like, just if it ain't broke, don't fix it I think one of our big concerns for us is that we've had somebody member changes in our vans almost every records had somebody missing or some change or you know we've had three different drummers and I we've probably about fourteen member changes in our band I'm the only original member in the band that was on those early records so it's almost like well steve knows what dillinger is is and should be more than almost anybody so it's nice to have another constant or someone who gets it in the mix it when we're going through all these changes trying different styles experimenting but you got to have that checks and balances you know it's and yen and well it's also like you know people ask me a lot of times a lot of bands asked me about working with dillinger and the how do you you know how do you even follow the music how do you understand it's like because you know their music is like a language all its own almost and I was there from the genesis of the language I was there when the language was being made basically so I speak the language failures yeah and when we have new members we have to teach them the language and once they speak the language they can contribute right different way but but there's also the challenge you know that have been working so long and not being too comfortable I'm always trying to like the last record but we did together it really took a lot out of me yes it was challenging I love throwing things at him that he's like because then everybody usually looks at our music like it's just a bunch of garbage can seeing a wall except him but when I can make him to be like wait let me figure wait wait I got figures that way you know like no no you know what you think so yeah he's still the challenges of working this long together is is still finding ways to really take out of our comfort zone take us at yet not getting too comfortable because I could very easily fall back onto the same we could fall back to the same guitar ahead that we use we could fall back the same oh, I have mike settings from the last from the last record is like no but again which goes to what I'm talking about you can have that same thing but even on different days the same exact its heart set up to bam set up microphones set up because of literally changes in humidity it'll sound different and you have to adjust so there's you can't just you know everybody looks for the magic formula there is no magic formula yeah but there's a comfort level so I think once you want you trust someone um and you're comfortable it someone then you really can get unsafe and that's what everything I was talk about that with music business stuff too like when you want people to believe what you people believe, what you d'oh and they care about what you're doing they think they know that you're coming from the heart then they trust you and then they feel comfortable to you and then you could take it out of the safety you could live weaken stamp on people's heads and they leave with a black guy smiling asked me to sign it you know? I mean because they trust us, you know, I have been and that's the same with when we trust each other and we're working together and I know he's got my back and he knows I'm going to push him at this point a cz faras he needs to go and even farther so that the next band comes in and be like, what did you do with that dillinger record differently? You know, then we can get get really playful and that's where creativity comes when you're not afraid to take risks. So I guess that kind of report we have and that relationship we've built enables us to take more risks and feel comfortable with it exactly so what happens? I'm curious what happens when you have diametrically opposed ideas about like what you want the south winds right yeah way fight but you know it's it's never a bad thing but honestly it's always as a prison my philosophy will I will make suggestions and go I feel strongly about this but ultimately no matter what it's not my record it's his record it's the band's record and it's like they couldn't just tell me you know screw you like because yeah no because it's true but I will you know maybe I get more personal with the dillinger stuff because we've been doing it so long recently we talked about but you know it's still ultimately you know his vision his his music I'm trying to serve what he does just says that I make the guitar player service on I'm trying to serve the record as a whole because you just get older emotional you know, I think we all just get better having emotional intelligence right? And like it's just maturity and so like putting an artist studio creating so it's like once you get confident in yourself and what you bring to the table and then what you're not good at what you do need to have someone just tell you once you start to learn that after years and years of doing this not getting hell not getting a bruised ego and when somebody tells you you're wrong yeah you know it's a big thing because it's hard it's hard especially on my side of things because I'm so used to like telling the van now not do it again do it again do again no no no no it's like when they tell me do it again like when he tells me about like the mix is like no wrong what do you mean wrong but you know then I step back and go wait a minute I tell him wrong all the time it doesn't matter you know like it's what what's the goal what's the end what's the end goal here what are we trying todo yeah we have that luck street I mean I have the luxury of having you know he was the best man in my wedding you know and so like most people when they go to a producer of steve's level are very you know just like what you say I'm glad you know I'm a fan of you you know and I tell him like no tell me you know so it's telling me to go screw I don't care that's another thing I learned that's another thing I learned working with patton who doesn't care about anybody except the end product like he doesn't care about anyone's feelings right it has to be right you know you know that thing you know like the producers working for you at the end of the day they're working for you you know it has to be you have to leave happy you have to leave happy but I find that the you know like like I said some some guys who are very in that world of you know they only have a set way of doing things and they say oh well use you know this guitar amp or use this am summary needs whatever and it's like there I feel like they're making it about themselves as opposed to really listening to the artist and what does the artist need you know because and it's a part of that I think is derived from fear and you know the producer not getting out of their comfort zone you know oh I have these you know these things that I know work so let's be safe and let's stick with that it's like don't do that like you know don't be afraid to be wrong yeah I love that that idea that that comfort is a death of creativity yeah it's but it's true right it's very true great you know, I've had records where you know it's like uh very very teo perfect example it's like you know I don't want to name the band but you know like I did one record there's and it was very influential record and then the next record we had a bigger budget and we spent twice as long on the record and I feel like I can feel that comfort in the record honestly I can really feel it I feel like there's not that that that thing that you get from that I love that I always that I'm always situation the dragon you're always chasing that thing you know fear also you know fear also can ruin creativity too because absolutely to meet creativity is just the building to be playful like a kid you know, we leaves that as we start to like you get start to get fans when you don't have fans when we first started we had no fans so we have nothing to lose and then as people start to have expectations what it's supposed to be like how it just sound then you start to get scared and you start to be careful and then you lose right nobody because like a kid we'll just throw paint everywhere fbi cool a little shape in there you know and to me like that's what we do a lot of it's about that's for something like that well but but based on that like exactly like to me like a big a big hurdle on my side of things psychologically is like how are we going to top that last record how we're gonna do it you know, like and you know, thinking about like all the fans and thinking about people who are looking up and looking forward to this release is like, wow, this is going to be, you know, great and I got just the theon same thing like the the record. I just finished with the the metal band suicide silence. Uh, we did their last regulars pretty pretty successful. And then we made the new one there unfortunately, this thing or passed away. And then we made the new one with the new singer on its zx going to come out a couple of months. Andi, I think it's amazing, I think it's better than the previous record and there's no disrespect to the old singer, you know, they're both they were both they're both great singers, but, you know, the cycle, the psychology of it for me, of, like, trying to like, you know, not let people down and not let you know, like, oh, man, that's all you knowing all the weight of all the expectation that's on there, um and, you know, getting past that and just getting back to, like, like ben said, that almost like, childlike instinct of just like this is cool and throwing it out to the world and going, this is great. I think this is all so we think this is awesome and that's how again, that philosophy filters down into getting the guitar sound it's like, just that awesome, that sounds great, don't be scared, don't be scared.