Music Business 101: Networking

Lesson 5 of 13

Identifying your Target

 

Music Business 101: Networking

Lesson 5 of 13

Identifying your Target

 

Lesson Info

Identifying your Target

We're back again ok happy to see you back here you know that we talked about insecurity and fear and all that stuff so you know managers greatest fear show put a show on when I was a consummate you put a show on nobody shows up so I'm happy to see you six year back here how are we doing in the chat room over there doing great cleared it yet everyone's gone whenever you guys got pressures off okay even the wiseguy left even the white all right all right maybe we should call him up get him back here okay I mentioned that I play golf right in and you probably scratching your heads and I'm sure everybody's going great you know but the reason I love golf is because so many of the things that you think about in golf right? The big picture part of it are things that I've thought about in the context of being a manager in navigating the music business I mentioned this friend of mine by the name of dr bob rotella pants off any you folks are out there and you want a great inspiring guy go get a ...

book called golf is not a game of perfect by dr bob rotella but one of the things that he stresses in the context of golf but I think it's particularly true in the context of the music business or in anything is this idea of target right why so many times I've had people call me and they go well I'll ask him what do you want to dio and they go well I'm not really sure where I kind of want to do this right kind of want to do that right and it brings up this whole notion of target you know nathan here was telling me one of the guys in the office approaching trojan man cody rana's he started as an intern for us who's now one of our employees you know I first met him you know, through this music mentor contest that we had on our website and so we got off the phone with all the people andrew jones we spoke to really was one of the guys and I talked talked to him about his career the same way we're going to talk about in this next second I said what do you what do you look into dio right and he said hey well I want to be a producer and I want to make music bubba blah and I also maybe think I want to be a manager and he said what do you think? And I said I think you need to lose one of them right? I think you need to commit one way I need to be a manager or you want to be a business guy or you want to be a musician because it's difficult to do both because both of more full time gigs now you could be a full time musician and have some thoughts about business or you could be a business guy and have some understanding of how music it's made that's me but this whole idea of having a target is critical right? The analogy I use and you see it on the news all too often right? You know the file footage of some skirmish in the middle east and there's some terrorists you know, with the forty seven just popping up going around a corner right he's not even looking at that I think is rattling off like that right and he's making a lot of noise you know he spread and a lot of bullets out there but I'm always thinking on the other end is one of those rangers just waiting for him to run out about boom done point of it is if you're just shooting into the dark and you hit something it's an accident great things happened as a result of intent not just by accident so this idea of getting a target and focusing in on that target is important my buddy doc says I want you to see the target steve is small as you can see it right there was a great golfer by the name of ben hogan who is a terrific golfer, very steely mind there's all these great stories about how he was playing golf in a caddy said I want youto came out of that tree out there out on the fairway mr hogan and mr hogan was smoked on the gulf coast which branch right now it seems stupid but the more you khun tighten down the more likely you are to hit so that's what we're going to talk about in this segment which is your tar so this is one where I want you to talk to me when people the guy asked what's your plan I need contacts to give a plan so I want you guys to ask me some questions about your target and see if I can help you you're a singer in a band you're sitting here we're talking about target how can I help you with that how can I help you go from hit it out of that tree to know I want you to hit the bird that's on that branch um well I and ready to find a manager ok once I guess a big process is how to find the right money job um yeah get me onto great festivals and ok me ask you this if you know where do you think you find managers um just buy a preaching artist that you like that inspire you and have you approaching um no yeah I am uh idea I am starting to ask um they're gonna tell you know yeah maybe okay so what happens if you have a list of twenty managers and you started top? Yeah. First one says now what next you going to the next one okay and it's like they say you get through that whole list twenty managers all big man because you're thinking about successful acts right and they all say no then what you have a business night try and other other ways of the people maybe I'm going to squeeze the major's out if I'm right if you want to do this then the answer is you keep going okay the reality of what you're talking about and I get it all the time people the big managers the successful managers air busy was successful acts right in the idea of shocking as it might be of starting from square one when they've managed to defy all the odds to get a successful artist is not that appealing right but I want to tell you a story here about managers right there's a great manager by name of niki burger right demands is a young band called group love he started being a manager back in college okay because he heard this band he loved the band you got a tape and he just decided I want to be there imagine I had a friend that kind of knew somebody who was one of those things and nikki I think was going to university of pennsylvania to be a lawyer is nice jewish kid from beverly hills court is gonna be a doctor. A lawyer right started managing that banned the reason I bring it up because on paper okay he didn't qualify to be a big manager right but what niki burger has okay and I hope nicky's watching today because it's true he understood ask you get he understood that networking khun getyou to smarter mohr experience people right and so thank you guys yeah they come I love that uh god, you're just warming my heart so he understood that concept of how to find the right answer so the group love folks didn't waste any time or maybe they did ask all the big manager they weren't available now more often than not you'll get in experience manage that really don't have all that experience but because you're a kind of a starting level of of your career it's not necessarily important that they have all the skills that I might have after been doing it for thirty five years dealing with the band in a much different level right and so that what can happen is in its happening with the group love guys he's in an unbelievable job he has the confidence of the band members and he has had a pension for going out and finding the answers and putting people on the team and calling up guys like me and say, hey man, could I you know, we're called a friend so hey, could you call that renny guy? I'd like to go have breakfast with him and we went out and had breakfast so your prop the big managers more likely that they find you because you've been doing other things right okay I I didn't see increments when they were fourteen I went in the freaking garage with him I met him and became their manager after they put out one became official there man jeff they'd put out one record so they were well down the pike here so um so you've got to go out and look for that person constantly but going out and don't wait to go start doing the things that a manager would dio writing music posting it places where people can see it don't wait for the manager because I'll tell you you'll be like that person that it's not perfect so I'm gonna wait till it's perfect till I could steve randy calm and still be a manager and so becomes your excuse does that make sense and see what you got to do if you're serious about this is lose the blue blankie lose the excuses lose perfect it's not perfect that book I'm talking golf not a game of perfect music is in a game of perfect life's not a game of perfect you'll have to find that person but in the meantime learn how to be a manager yourself what website got a hole stick on be a man it doesn t be a manager means understand where you aren't get where you need to go and getting people on your team is part of it right but it's not an excuse to stop everything until you get that the war is going on the bullets are flying you need to get up that freaking hill before you get shot lede asthma ok, we'll take one here from russia quick question state brick works if you've got a wide base of skills and interest within music would it be best to choose the strongest and focus in on that then diversify where possible once that main gig is up and running you got a wide skill set and all of that right and you're trying to figure out where to go there's this idea that I've talked about you know with with our artist this idea of finding your compass right finding what your true north is right and what it's really all about is that everybody has something that they have the potential to do great right? I hear about all these multi taskers and all this stuff and I've been surrounded by multitasking held with the multi tasking I'll take somebody that's great it one thing ok every time because being kind of good at twenty things isn't nearly as good as being great at one all my peers in the business ready why don't you manage more bands? Why did you do this while you do that? Because I understood very clearly early on in my life that I'm one of these guys it's better doing one thing greater attempting to do one thing great I find no value and being a multi tasker that don't know whatever that might work for some of the point I'm making is that you've got to figure out what it is you do great what it is you think that you can succeed at now that's something that's really you I talked about in the context of willie nelson when he started in the country music business it was in the nashville side where was kind of a polished version of cunt country music and there are actually album covers and willie nelson believe it or not with a coat and tie on in a nice little cool cowboy hat you know what he said ten men amy I'm freaking pot smoking hell raising whiskey drinking willie nelson I'm an outlaw right so he hung out with williams alien left those guys and I saw him recently year ago playing at eighty years old he's willie nelson he couldn't give a crap about what everybody thinks about so my point is this to that persons question you've got to figure out what you are don't revel and I do a million different things you know I could do a bunch of different things but I know this stuff that I do great and I try to do more of it I know I'm not a detail person so I hire a guy my friends just her joe lilac who's watching down there who is a detail person who is focused on details and I just call stuff off, I say, jug, don't I need this to do this? I need you to do that joke in the office, I said, I like to say, do a and you're supposed to say done so understanding who you are is part of it, that's, part of getting this target and tightening the target down. We're not trying to hit the tree in the distance. We're trying to hit the bird on the freakin branch to the right side of the tree, so I hope that answers his questions. Alright, fantastic drum roll. We don't have what I should have brought the drum roll. All right, okay, I want to talk about something else, and we'll talk to some of your other folks about what you're thinking about. My buddy retell again. Hit this button with me. You know, no matter what career path you take and we can talk about all the different ones you could take. You spotted your target you found that bird on a tree you got all this crap going on your head and fearing what if I fail what if I do this and it doesn't work and all that stuff right going through your head in that moment when it all has to come together right you can't be thinking about all that stuff you need to have a certain level of trust and it's all about committing to the target understanding that you could fail understanding that these things are real and you're not alone in all that right and what may it may seem like oh he's up there he's not nervous I'm nervous I just got to get through it and it's all about this notion of committing to your target right and in the music business that commitment is not something to be taken like that I want to play a clip from a gentleman by the name of bruce floor bruce floor started in the business is a young college d j and so forth became a very successful and are actually started in the promotion department promoting records because he kind of started college radio became an a and r guy was the guy that signed dave matthews band now dave matthews being a huge band today but when he signed them the people gone dave matthews what the heck is this? You know I don't get it they weren't writing big hits but he came on our show and had a comment that I played one hundred times because it's so spot on he's going to talk about musicians. But it holds true for everybody. Ex rock bands, there's, a ten year gestation period, ten years between the time they started making music and the time shits really going off for think about it. I mean, my morning jacket, modest mouth, death cab for cute incubus, incubus, right, ten years, ten years and a lot of people get into it right now. Let's go instant graft because they aren't really willing to die for the craft. They want to be a rock star. They don't want to live a rock star and yeah, and that's, where I see a lot of it is like a lot of it has to be that no matter what happens, this band or this person's making music, regardless of all the things around it, and ultimately they will find a level of success if there's talent there. Gods you're not in your head are zero take your time and and he talked about a ten year gestation period for a band and my experiences you know incoming started when they were fourteen they started having the really big success a twenty for dave matthews bands was around forever the black keys became the biggest thing in the world but they played every crap dive in america the clubs you're trying to figure out how to get into they figured it out somehow day from new orleans oh god you took it off their hope I get it right uh okay I got they figured out because they committed to it and I and I talked to million musicians over the years and I always ask why are you doing this yeah you're freakin mind and they all go because I have to do this right so it's that level of commitment that it takes and when people are asking me about being a singer eva okay or being in a band I ask him yet ten years in you I can see the fear in your eyes right there it's okay the doubt okay I wanted to be a golf pro right it was everything I wanted to be right there's all I dreamed about you know I'm not trying to talk anybody out of it today but in my mind it wasn't going to be a forever endless thing right and for musicians I see I live in l a and if you haven't been the l a if you drive down sunset boulevard it's like one of those bad songs about you know I don't have the old rocks are see some guy with this sprayed on black pants and is you know you know skull and bone cross you know far belt you know and the the hair that's now thinning that is black and I said wow man you know I talked with finn mackenzie use up here in the booth who's a musician who thought that maybe his place was on the side of business right I talked to another guy who is behind the wall over here who's a musician who's taken a break from his music right I say that not to dissuade you from taking the shot but toe underscore the commitment that it takes now is true if you're a business person nathan left a big nice gig making mom and dad happy to go out and make no money for right now so you gotta really freaking belief if you're going to do this right and I'm looking at all of you right now I'm seeing that look in your eye and it's okay because it's tough your your your thank you in pieces and you're just killing me I love it okay you were on that boat it d day and you are the lucky bastards that got to be on the first shift you're not those guys that are coming in at four o'clock you know uh yeah david new orleans what you ve got a guy right you're out there it risk all those things it takes ten years technically teo you know really be able to make it and be like confident in it uh I guess the question is when do you know when it's just not gonna happen like you know like you could keep going for all those years but what if it's just what do you know to like be like okay well maybe I should just go live a boring oh here's what I don't think it has to be the boring life the the answer to that question is is that on ly you'll know right I guess I see that because I'm not trying to dissuade anybody but I want them to know if I were deed as a gentleman some of us and coming back because it's really okay I can't hide reality from people right and for me getting the reality out there makes it easier to deal with it gets you that easier that acceptance so the answer to the questions I don't know when it is I know for me my passion something that I wanted is badly as any of you wanted to be a singer at the forum of madison square garden er sitting the entertainment center whatever it might be where you from sydney or melbourne melbourne okay, the rod laver arena right still there ride later labor really okay, that was for me my rock star thing and as I've said in that little video the thought the doubting but not the doubting that it was just the reality off of you're in this that's how long it's gonna take a reality that you can want to compete and have all those things going on and then it might not work for me I say this because people have lived through that because you can always be a musician you can always sing to your kids you can always be playing with your buddies I played with I had dinner last night with this guy tim tim chang works in a big venture capital from he is mom made him play piano he's he's an asian guy had the tiger mommy told me she made him play piano then he learned to love and then he decided to play guitar right because he was going to hey learned how to play guitar and all that stuff and I ask you, why did you put it away tim? And he said because I did the calculation and that I thought that maybe my love for music could find a different form of expression so he's become a very successful guy in business and you know what he does date goes out he plays gigs he plays and where everyone he hires his buddy to play and he doesn't love in any less than I love playing golf and I'm not out there on the tour okay I'm having a blast with you lot here today okay and I'll sure as hell be having a blast tomorrow with my buddy aaron base shook or my buddy harry styles or my buddy neil jacobs and playing golf tomorrow right because I found a different way and the lessons that I learned from going out there and taking a shot okay or the same lessons that I pass on to my friends and ignatz when we've got something to do let's come on she's gonna happen or it's not let's stop the wine let's get on with it and if you don't love the ride if you don't love winning more than you love losing the exits are marked both sally in anybody you want to leave our weight it's okay okay that's ok so I don't get that worry look it's there I'm saying it I'm your freaking I'd be edelman saying it but give it a shot in it at some point you'll know but what I want to tell you is if you did it and you did it with passion and you committed and all that stuff you're gonna feel better about it and it will serve you in your next inches you don't ever have to stop being musicians you don't ever have to stop singing and I hope to hell they picked me up off! The fairway of bel air country club put me in the car and drop the flag and put the sign up theirs as drinks are on steve running today right? Not any time soon but you get my point because you can still do it all right who else got a question by who along the same lines is saying what about success on a smaller scale where you have a following that just provides a comfortable living he's not looking to make it you know not looking to be harry styles that just wants to make a comet's name training training you're winning man you're winning okay it's that's a win if they don't have to be big wins like I say it's okay you have your own dream I'll give you a perfect example you know lots of my buddies in the management doesn't want to have ten clients they want toby moguls right and some of these guys are my great buddies and they're always trying to get me to join the firm or this and that and I told him I said you know what I love the fact that you want to be king of the world right and your world is this I said here's the reality I am the king of my world okay in my world just has to work for me okay, so my world is I met five guys in a band swore I'd never manage another band that five guys whose ambition and talent and humanity and decency matched my own values and they had great talent and we were very lucky and we had success and that allowed me to go and do the things that I wanted to do in my life you know work when I wanted to work play golf when I want to compete when I went allows me to come up here today and sit there and talk about it right so if he's happy with that it's different you know harry styles I asked here he said hey harry what the hell were you doing before you in this band well I was I was working in a bakery for three years he's kids nineteen twenty years old he's working in a bakery but always always love the thought of doing it do you have any idea man I was he's just happy to be there and oh by the way is like hey steve you're up on the tea right you know so if the wind is defined in your world be king of your world don't we're about her world or your world just you gotta live in yours ok hope that answers this question okay so dave you look freaking streamline okay? Okay so along those same lines of you know there's a lot of hungry managers out there uh other than just, you know, pick up the phone and calling people what is the best approach to take? Two to put yourself out there to these people, do it to a manager. Yeah, I'll make believe, it's me, and I'm going to say, you know, upfront, okay, that I've been through the war. I've made it up that hill a d day. I've watched a bunch of my buddies lying on that freaking beach, wondering why him, not me, ok, and I got there. Now. You say, steve, come back down on the beach and get me. 00:24:24.836 --> 00:24:28. Some up there thinking all right yeah this is that's 00:24:28.91 --> 00:24:34. a big ask right? So for me I'm honest with most people 00:24:34.49 --> 00:24:37. not necessarily interested but I know there are people 00:24:37.93 --> 00:24:40. out now you live in new orleans you left san francisco 00:24:40.95 --> 00:24:43. I got news for you I don't know who they are but I 00:24:43.18 --> 00:24:46. guarantee there's some great manager in this town 00:24:47.23 --> 00:24:50. okay that I don't know and you don't know okay and 00:24:50.41 --> 00:24:53. that's more your problem than mine right now. Okay, 00:24:53.12 --> 00:24:56. I will tell you this if you were out playing clubs 00:24:56.51 --> 00:24:59. right and you were putting people around the block 00:25:00.58 --> 00:25:02. right? Because the performances were so great the 00:25:02.72 --> 00:25:05. songs were so great that the managers that want to 00:25:05.88 --> 00:25:08. be the next nikki burger that want to be the next 00:25:08.21 --> 00:25:11. jeff kwatinetz or pick your big manager or steve ready 00:25:11.22 --> 00:25:13. whoever it might be okay 00:25:14.48 --> 00:25:16. are out there and you've got to keep going and playing 00:25:16.98 --> 00:25:18. where those guys be those air people that are on the 00:25:18.94 --> 00:25:21. hunt you know, niki burger found this band through 00:25:21.36 --> 00:25:24. a friend so there's no tried and true path together 00:25:24.1 --> 00:25:28. but for bands I'm telling it more likely that manager 00:25:28.49 --> 00:25:30. finds you then you find 00:25:31.48 --> 00:25:35. the manager okay that's how it goes approaching you 00:25:35.98 --> 00:25:38. to be to want to be managed to manage you but how 00:25:38.71 --> 00:25:44. do you know how to trust them okay, okay, okay 00:25:45.68 --> 00:25:47. you don't know if you trust somebody until you've 00:25:47.65 --> 00:25:51. been in the battle with him, okay and it's called 00:25:51.5 --> 00:25:55. track record okay but I've learned over the years 00:25:55.53 --> 00:25:59. to size people up pretty quick I got a pretty fine 00:25:59.18 --> 00:26:02. tuned radar for shysters you know but I'm experienced 00:26:02.54 --> 00:26:05. because I've been burned or almost burned and so I 00:26:05.24 --> 00:26:10. have a radar for it trust is the glue to great manager 00:26:10.0 --> 00:26:13. artist relationships the managers that have been with 00:26:13.35 --> 00:26:15. artists would like me turning backwards artist if 00:26:15.93 --> 00:26:18. you looked at all the ours they have twenty twenty 00:26:18.12 --> 00:26:20. five year real careers that tom patties and some of 00:26:20.99 --> 00:26:22. the old bands you don't care about because they've 00:26:22.58 --> 00:26:25. been around long enough that you've heard him they're 00:26:25.2 --> 00:26:28. still doing but you'll find a large percentage of those bands have a manager that's been with him a very long time in campus would be a good sample you two would be a good example rush would be a good example pearl jam would be a neil young tom petty you know chardonnay and freaking roger davies you know because they trust you you got to ask questions so what do you think how you see this playing out you know how do you you know you tell me what you're doing you don't have to make it look like an inquisition hey so what are you working on that now so kind me and you must be out meeting people all the time who do you know so you're looking for a manager right? Okay. So your target is a manager in the short term, because we'll talk about targets only later. How they change, you know, the trust thing, you've got to ask questions, and ultimately I have this for managers. Say, I want to get a contract with an artist, what's your deal with him. I didn't have a contract with income is for till I've already proved myself okay on dso that's, the way it typically goes so that's, you know, the trusting, you gotta work through it. You've got to put yourself at risk, and you don't need to get married right out of the box. And so I tell you the same thing. I tell young manager, if you guys believe in each other, do some stuff that starts to move down the field and see if you have some trust there.

Class Description

While the landscape of the music business is constantly changing, one thing remains the same: a lot depends on who you know. Networking is the key to a successful music career.

Learn how instructor Steve Rennie went from booking shows in Hollywood to managing platinum-selling rock band Incubus. Steve's legendary networking skills vaulted him from concert promoter to record label exec, manager, and all-around industry pioneer.

Using tactics gleaned from 35 years in the music business, Steve will show you how to identify and connect with the right people, grow your circle of influence, and build a targeted plan for making it big.

Reviews

a Creativelive Student
 

Unbelievable course. Steve easy to listen to. He's funny, easy going but incredibly smart. I'm not a musician but have worked with many in photography and this man knows his stuff. Any creative should take this course and take notes.