So we were talking a little while ago about a conversation you had after our first session we had to go out and do some business so could you tell us a little bit about that and how it we're sure so actually I had um kind of planted ahead of time to have this appointment after our sessions I thought you're smart maybe I wouldn't learn some things that I could apply so the the founder and ceo of a company wanted to meet with me about potentially be his senior product manager on the technology side of things and so, um I went and met with him and I wasn't kind of sure how interaction would go but um it ended up being a very kind of mindful conversation and, you know, like I mentioned earlier, I was just very kind of curious about how his business worked, how he thought about things and kind of where he was at and so I'm just trying to understand that set up opposed to tryingto like sell myself I'm so great I've always filled with a lot um and so then we got like there was that kind of ca...
maraderie and connection things and he started taking notes about things so it worked a lot better than like, say some other approaches I tried in the past that's so great and so glad so you sought to maximize his position right in a sense you were curious you like what is this person need you use good timing by listening right? And you put your agenda down too try to contemplate his agenda yeah, so like one thing I tried to understand is like where he's coming from and also a little bit as much as I could about personality type so I knew okay? He had built a huge sales organizations in the past like what? I don't know the types well enough I'm thinking ok, some kind of leader type that sounds kind of like a warrior you know, because it's like has to build his army or something so he's going to think in a very kind of, um just throw you know, just get the team out there and everything but he's not going maybe think so systematically about like, you know what the you know that in that sense the technology of how you're going to like bomb the other army or something you know? So I'm going to try toe toe understand where his weaknesses are and not and like trying to explain them but just really understand where he needs the help and then kind of pull that apart, you know? And then if I can kind of organize his own thoughts because that's really what he needed in the midst of that interaction then then he's going to like, oh, wow well, this is this what I really need help with, you know, I mean he knows that but to see that you know, I think in action I think is I was very impressed and proud of you thank you you're welcome I'm very proud of you that is exactly the point I would say of this course is how do I go into a conversation around something that's very important to me that I really want and make it successful by using mindfulness and also make it meaningful and to me it sounds like you're really driving to a successful outcome through employing the means that we've been talking about observing your style someone else's style applying mindfulness and so on and it's it's it's really great and I want to ask you also what q's did you look for to try to understand what his style was and I know that this is a new body of information for you but even just after one day what were you like looking for? I gave you a little clues to his style. Um well so when when um I first met his initial thing was just, uh, phrase off its not like what's going on uh but much more casual than I'm like you still usually somebody you know, they have their pay tell me about yourself or something right now so you already know that his a approach is more kind of a friendly style um so so then I tried to become kind of more casual in relational in that inside of incense um which was useful I think I think I actually initially went a little too far they mentioned you at lunch is like I thought he wanted to be kind of very, you know, have the sense okay very casual die like I mean it's a clothing company for kind of casual clubs when I realized okay, this position has to me a strong people is looking for like general soto also convey that at the same time so this is this balance that's very delicate yeah, so your ear awareness was going with the flow it was reading things adjusting your reading, going back, reconsidering things all in the flow of the conversation correct? Yeah to the best I could I was actually kind of fun like my mind was going to explode halfway that's awesome, but I I didn't well, it's like imagine somebody told okay, creative five just had they they hadn't built it yet and they're like, okay, this is my whole idea for how this whole procter is gonna work and they're like kind of downloading until you're like you're trying to take it in and organized at the same time so it's a lot but I think ton having that my own background in meditation helps me kind of keep that space enough so I can organize that a bit that's great, yeah, so in the beginning of our course, I said that, uh, when you are able to, when, you know, this information about personal style, it's sort of gives you an uncanny ability to connect with other people, and what you're describing to me is the seeds of that uncanny ability, the ability to read and sort of step in with the right way of phrasing, things the right way of holding yourself in the right way, meaning the way that moves the conversation along in a way that you would like it to go and it's subtle, and it does actually move things in the way you want them to go in an uncanny way, but it takes a while to master the information, yeah made so my own experience before I just wouldn't I wouldn't hit that, right, you know? And so again, I would maybe try toe, you know, you know, sell myself too soon or, um, whatever it was, it just wouldn't work in this time. You he is well, you're just really intuitive person and, you know, and again, I thinkit's having this understanding of these different types, leaving a little bit helps and I really didn't feel like I really understood him what type? Enough but I knew that there was something and I had to kind of understand that he had a style whatever that wass yeah and then they just moved along is like okay that's cool it's no set about point with the cto, you know, in a couple days so they worked better than, like anything else I've ever tried and I think, you know, also you talked about having that curiosity, you know, yes, I said it just that does work just having just being interested in it was like something I would never do in the past I'm like, okay, well, because he talked about you have interviewed other people who was a product manager, what, you know, what didn't work and you know, you're you should never bring up anything else right now, but it really helped me kind of understand no kind of where he's out what what worked with these other people, what didn't and it almost became more like this consultation rolls like, okay, well, this is what you really would need in this kind of person, you know, that could understand that and then I can kind of frame my stuff is having those particular skills, so you're a very quick study and I appreciate that about you and you were brave. Do you see why I say that? I just say brave because it takes courage to sort of just oak open to the interaction as it's unfolding instead of walking in with you? This is how we start a business meeting and this is how we say when someone says this I should say that I should never bring these things up instead you let that go and you were just there and you were listening and you were president and you were vibing and you were connecting and it just takes courage so I think it's great thank you you're a very good teacher. No, thank you. And do you have a sense of your own style? I think that's what's been kind of difficult for me is that I feel like I have these different parts um and I'm I'm sure there's one of them that's more me, but like I do think in systems like you in that interaction yesterday all I was doing was trying to, you know, mount for him the different systems that would be involved in building this product um but there's also it's like what your intuitive so okay there's that sense um and then I have had this creative site it was all these different parts, so that but there's one of them that has toe dominate that's my sense of this thing is there's one that drives for any person drives that I don't know how to kind of get clarity on which one that isthe kind of he stepped out well takes time and you know, the place to start is of course he said your intuitive and I'm sure you are and we all have intuitive capacity to greater lesser degree but it really look att where is your primary center of intelligence? Is that your intuition and when things don't go your way do you get angry unless you're in the middle type in which where you're numb to your anger that makes it very complicated or are you more of ah mental type when things are when you're scared or worried do you get anxious or are you more a heart type when things don't go well? Do you get depressed or sort of hysterical or your you know overly emotional or numb that's the complexity right there? What do you think? I think I might tend toward the anxiety like me the worst situation like you know it's like I'm not in control somehow right say on airplanes or something like that right? So I get anxious or something that might be there when you have something to accomplish like you wake up in the day you're like I'm gonna get these three things done do you get them done? Yeah if it's like that's what I usually I'll say these were like the two most important things that I want done this day three and my money I make sure I get those done and it might be a list of ten other things and I'm like, if I get those dinner, that would be wonderful, but I'm not that's not my core, so yeah tried to get do you have? Um how are you with trust? Do you trust people or do you first poke them to make sure that they're trustworthy? Initially I think I trust them. Uh, yeah, um and then I feel out how far can trust somebody? I'd say and in what ways? That's martin, and how are you around issues of privacy and alone time? And you know, when someone wants to have a meeting with you, can they just walk in and say, hey, let's, talk about this and stature? Do you prefer that they go let's talk at eleven about this a topic? I think I'd rather we set a time for it so that I can prepare and everything, but I've kind of gotten a lot of the seo's I've worked with they're just very spontaneous a d d they say it's because the work makes them, but anyway they always want to do things spontaneously, so I've kind of gotten more used to that uh to kind of going with the flow er but it probably wouldn't be my preference say well, we should continue this conversation when we're in our next break because I'm getting certain little flavors but I don't you know they're just what it could be totally wrong I'd say eight times out of ten I am wrong but I want I really want to help you figure it out so tio okay well let's let's let's do that in our next break or you know, at our wrap party that sounds good that would be fun and good luck with your your business thank you so much appreciate it if this will help a lot of sure I hope so good. Thank you, sarah if you would please approach you're fabulous outfit you're welcome yesterday you wearing on that was like more coral colored they're both beautiful colors on you. Thank you. You're welcome. Um so we were talking in the break excuse me about interviews and you were saying that you get nervous? Of course. So can you talk a little bit about that? And, um I think it's how I do interviews I don't necessarily view them as a conversation I feel like it's more of an interrogation, right? And so I think that's was nervous of that that's what makes me nervous? Well, it makes total sense you're walking in and you're saying judge me you know that's the job of the interview or to judge your talent your capacity whether you fit or you don't fit and so how do you so it makes sense let's be totally natural to be nervous um how do you are there things that you could do that make you less nervous or have you noticed things that make you more nervous with, um try to avoid them? I got jobs like unconventional ways really so like through relations with people so um yeah interview lee hasn't haven't had so many interviews do you wish that you had more to you do you need to have more and you just sort of avoiding it because they're uncomfortable I think I definitely need more interviews. Um I think it would make me a better interviewer. Okay, so let's talk about a theoretical situation where you have an interview coming up thank you. But before we do that let's spend a couple of minutes talking about your personal stuff while we were talking in the break that you are relating now to the seven position right can you say why? Um I think is because, uh it has different things like creative, spontaneous um it also mentioned that, uh what are the subtypes that I kind of related to it if I would've walked to certain places it's more likely I'll probably knows someone there um so I've always been like a very social person but also very spontaneous adventurous and so yeah but there were also things with the bullet that I related to us well, what would you like to hear? They were also kind of like that reckless like I've bought one way tickets oh are you know, like I've gone somewhere I don't know who I'm going to stay here but I know I'm gonna have a place to stay when I get there it's awesome so those aspects the creativity and this being spontaneous I don't mean to pry so feel free not to answer this but have you struggled with depression in your life or feeling just kind of a darkness around you? Um I will say it's on just um and do you know when things don't go your way? Excuse me? I'm fighting a cold what do you do generally speaking, um I think I keep to myself um if someone said to you excuse me, we're going to do a new program tomorrow about cats I need ten ideas for how to approach that would you be able to come up with those ideas and would that be an enjoyable thing for ur owner saying yes, I actually I'm fascinated with ideas coming up with ideas and and brainstorm miss something I enjoy although I don't care for cast wait now, I think this conversation's gone off the rails. I'm a cat lover. Cool. So, um, what do you love about ideas? Um, I guess just the possibility of being creative, uh, timmy, creativity is problem solving. So, um, just thinking of new new ways to do things. Well, what if you approach your next interview as a creative problem to solve as something that was like, like, say, was almost like a piece of art that you were going to get to shape, and you weren't quite sure it was going to be given to you at the last minute and someone's going to say, ok, make something out of this, you know, if you could, you bring that kind of mind to it like I'm just going to show up, let it be there trust myself when it happens to just start working with it and making something enjoyable out of it or something beautiful without you know, I hope I get the job, of course, but let me make that my second concern. Let me make my first concern. How can I enter this situation with a sense of creative joy? Is that a question that you can imagine asking yourself, oh, yeah, and I think that approached will be allowed. More valuable because I think I go into the situation when I did have interviews going in there thinking of the end result sure you know like making sure or always thinking, oh, I have tohave that best answer first of just being a natural conversation with lee made you with this you know, just being very really that's that's it so of course you have an agenda you want the job otherwise you don't go to the interview and you can't forget about that so you should learn everything you can about the company and about the person is interviewing you and where they're headed and what their problems are do your homework one hundred ten percent but when you walk in try to let all that go it's all in there you can trust it and just I say to myself say to yourself I am a person that takes joy in creativity and this is my art project right now and let's see what happens how do you think that would feel? I think I'll get the job well being riel and they can genuine connection I think is a very helpful part and a tte least making a good impression on the person is interviewing you so I see what you're saying about seven or four and you know, do you have a sense of your subtype self preservation social or into it? Um well, I was I was thinking may be social but it's not the one that they kind of threw me off because it's not like I think about we're not going to groups and my going to fit in because I feel like in any group I can I can fit in it so I'm not so worried about what people will accept me um so that kind of threw me off but you like to hang out but I don't do like to have fun I like to be around people get energy from people that's great um so let's say we're gonna start with social seven so just google any a gram social seven and just read everything that comes up and see because different writers write about in different ways and I would be happy to suggest some books that I found particularly valuable and uh just let that be your first option and until you rule it out and read what everybody has to say about it and see if that's you and and it was called friends wasn't it what it was called sacrifice elia that social seven was called sacrifice which is someone who puts the work that needs to be done first and their own enjoyment second but you I think so I think I do have a problem with killing people know and and it's not I think two is like sometimes I get so excited about other people's ideas like I want help everybody like I feel like I can help here I can help there and so you know I'm helping everyone and then you know when it comes to my own things it kind of goes on the back burner I see I see so you put them first so yeah look att social seven and if I had a job I would hire you by the way I mean so nice that you think about what do you need what you need and you get pleasure out of thinking what that could be and then presumably offering it so that's very generous thank you good luck uh and if you would if you have it after you have your next interview if you wouldn't mind just shooting the little message how it went I would be so interested to hear ella thank you wade talked a lot about interviews and how you approach that now you don't want me going back to yesterday you did say that the beginning of the course did you hear perhaps alone about romantic communication yes I'm just wanting it as this course helped you with that at all have you have you hopefully have your your gold sold by being with us I think oh yeah. Yesterday I mentioned that expressing my emotions in romantic relationships to something that's difficult for me um and I think that that was kind of part of the social seven to is the that fear of pain um and I think sometimes I tryto I guess not shut it emotion too just kind of be more close is more of a law there just to kind of protect myself with that right but I think that I could be more open yeah it's gonna take some time somewhere is that what you're saying that instead of expressing how you really feel you sort of hold it because it's it's like a risk and you might not be heard or accepted or cherished in the way that you it's very vulnerable very vulnerable so you have to be very smart but the first part of intelligence is awareness of what you actually do feel when you know what you feel because I don't know about you but I am the same way and instead of associate I like six months later I figured out what I felt six months previously and it's really been a lifetime of effort for me to cultivate the ability to know on the spot would I feel so I would suggest to you that that is a good skill for you to cultivate too and be very patient with yourself cultivating the ability to know what you feel as you're feeling it is a really direct fruit of mindfulness so then you have choices but when you don't know until when it six months later like that the other person's gone you don't have a lot of choices something I've thought about to like, okay, well, maybe I didn't like it so much. It was so good, easy to get over him, but then it's, like when I like it, when I like somebody like I really like somebody, yeah, that's, nice look, good luck, comets coming. A few sierra green, eleven, is saying, I'm having in our heart moment here, I said, I wasn't sure about my type, but I was leaning too old, seven, with my family and friends, with nuances of the poet reckless, too. So they're really identifying with you. They're feeding them very like sierra, but corinne goes on to say, unfortunately, though, I'm a huge cat lover e like you, thank you so much.