So they're certain challenges in marketing boudoir it's sexy lots of problems but that right can't share photos clients don't sign model releases um there's very little social media sharing or tagging I'm always so jealous of wedding photographers and children photographers that composed to picture and eight hundred people get tagged and shared and you know their name is everywhere we don't really have that luxury boudoir is a luxury item people don't wake up ago I need a boudoir shoot right people say you know people you need to plant the idea so it's a luxury item we need to sort of convinced people that they need to do it not where you have to hire a photographer for your wedding or you feel the need to hire photographer for your wedding it's not always something people like I have to do this we have to sort of convince them of that on people aren't always open to it or understand it I really get excited by that actually when I say too some video of a boudoir photographer they go wh...
at is that? I'm like you haven't heard that's awesome that means there's a ton of room to grow so I like that one a little bit but it is hard to sell something to people that don't understand what it is there are some questions you need to consider when your marketing who is your ideal client what are you marketing where will you mark it too? When will you mark? It is their time of year that's best for you and how will you find that this is really where the use of those pillar words my pillar words being intimate feminine, fearless but whatever you're fat you're pillar words are these air really where that's going to apply let's talk about it a little bit more in depth what are you marketing? So what is boudoir look like to you? We were having a conversation last night daphne does a little bit more fine art type work is boudoir a little bit more in the glamorous side is boudoir nudes is boudoir bridal what is boudoir so it's not you know boudoir photographer has thrown out there is a very generic term but there are so many different types of war and until you know what type of boudoir you really want to shoot how do you know who to market too? So you really need to think about that? What is your comfort level? Somebody had posted again in the facebook group and if you want to find that it's just generals obama's boudoir group I think it is on facebook right? Something like that um what is your comfort level? Are you comfortable with nudes a comfortable with topless are you comfortable with having her husband come? Are you comfortable with having two women and, you know, do it tio not together but you know, the same day having to friends come and support each other um you know, what is your comfort level? So you really need to know that so to set up those boundaries that you want to set up, you have to first know what they are and what is your style I often see people say I shoot pinna vintage urban outdoor nude fine art, what are you? Which one is it? Because how do you know? How do you attract people if you don't know what you're shooting and they don't know what you're shooting? Jen yes, how how do you go about figuring that out? What is your style? Yeah, well, that goes back, teo, I think the more authentic you are to yourself what you like, what you're drawn teo there's a lot of people like, for example, pinup, I think it's awesome, I love it, but I could never shoot it. It's just not my thing. It's not my my comfort level it's I don't understand the whole vintage it's just not my thing. So for me, I naturally just kind of gravitate and it's also part of tuning everybody else out and shooting what you want to shoot and where your comfort is and that might change you know I don't really shoot a lot of nudes now I used to shoot them before people would ask me for them and I would show them and now I don't really do it that often not against it so do it here and there but I don't market myself that way because that's really not what I enjoy I love lingerie and dressing up and being girly and that's that's part of it for me so it's really about you personally again it's personal right well I don't know what you just said it is a key point in terms of if you don't want teo attract the type of client that's not how you market yourself I can't have you showing it right okay who your ideal client is ties a lot into why you do what you do so I've been pushing with these girls talking to him about why they shoot boudoir and oftentimes people will say well I shoot boudoir because it makes women feel good I shoot boudoir because I like working with women and empowering women we want to get a little bit more specific into why you actually shoot good war and knowing what kind of client you want to attract I shoot boudoir because of my own insecurities because it's a challenge for me to embrace my womanhood as I get older uh shoot boudoir because my client's heal me and I heal them and I want clients that are doing it for themselves. Yes, they might be giving it is a gift but I want them to do it for themselves first I don't necessarily want my ideal client is not necessarily the ten because people always think I want to shoot beautiful women yeah that's easy and that's great and that's wonderful, but I don't want the ten I can't make an impact on the ten I want like six or seven or anything e just want a ted because I want to show a woman who may be thinks like I'm not sexy you know those lies women tell themselves I want to break those lives I want to say to the most that's not true women come in and say I'm not sexy, not pretty enough to do this I need to lose five pounds I'm not tall enough not worthy and I want to say to them you are and I want to show them you are and I want to make them feel that they are so I recently had a client for example come in who's a little bit of a tomboy I may be a little bit is not the right word she was a time boy, she was extremely masculine. In fact, if you walk past her on the street you might even think she was a guy she was very masculine and she is married. Her husband is a stay home dad she's a very successful career in the sports industry, so she is very emasculated in her life, and she has convinced herself that she is kind of a guy that's her role in life. So I took her on and made her into a woman, and I'm going to show you you are I didn't make prints when she wa sai just brought it out in her. I'm going to show you let's do a little hair let's do a little makeup, I'm gonna pose you. I'm gonna help you pick out your outfits, and it reconfirmed to her that even though she's bringing home the dough and she's working with men and she's had brothers her whole life, she is still very much a woman. And she was really embraced that that's. Why I shoot food war if I have a client that comes in that says hi, I'm getting married in june and I want to do this for my husband. No, thank you. You're only doing it for your husband. If you're only doing it for your boyfriend, really not interested because they're not interested, they're not invested, there's nothing for them to grow and to learn and there's really nothing for them to offer me emotionally I want to emotionally connect with my clients and I can't do that if they're just like all right let's go through the motions let's do this my husband's expecting it that's it I don't want that kind of client so that's just to give you an idea of how my wife ties into my client and how I use that on my marketing material in my words on my web site and how my hands on my client's just sort of weed out the people that I don't want it's not only about getting the people you do it's weeding out the people you don't when you're thinking about your ideal client and you're why some points to consider are definitely age occupation style location reasons why they want to do it the more you know about your ideal client the more you know where to find her how to reach her how to get your point across which other stores to market with so you have to be kind of really specific if you don't want to shoot pinup then don't go to the pinup store and put your cries there that's not gonna work you know if you want to shoot nudes maybe the laundry store is not the best place for you to be cross marketing with because she's not going to be wearing anyone's right just some thought so you need to think about that a little bit as far as your clients your ideal clients after you identify your ideal client where do we find her again? This ties into sort of what I was saying where do you find her cross marketing this was my best promotion this year actually was cross marketing with an organization that does like stare former strippers and they dio strip exercise I guess you would it's not pole dancing but it's maybe lap dances or sexual type movements and you know sort of I guess stripping lessons and sometimes people will look at something like that and say oh well that's not my client but I knew if I could coordinate with them that their client wants to be sexy their client wants to know how to move and had to turn on their partner and had a feel beautiful and feel feminine and that's what I want my clients to feel so I contacted them and what I did was I gave them some vouchers I gave them some hundred dollars vouchers on a five hundred dollar voucher and I said to them I want you to give the hundred dollars vouchers let's say two new people signing up they want you to give the five hundred dollars vouchers to the your best clients they sent me about maybe three or four clients those three or four clients my best sales the entire year with the exception of one other woman my best sales and they all did it for them two of them didn't even have a significant other the old data for themselves one girl but two albums for herself one had she was cold, one girl was one album was in laundry she spent about tried remember maybe close to five thousand dollars on herself that's the kind of client that I want okay, she didn't care about her significant other or anything else it was just for her. So this cross marketing, the more specific you khun get with where you think your clients are the better and I also offer them the opportunity to advertise their business in my studio because my girl is there girl too, so we're both benefiting from it that's the best way you can cross market make sure you're both benefited can I ask you a question done about the cross marketing? Leanna don says, um I am just starting cross marketing with women's self help groups is this a good move? Um I don't know how to answer that question because I don't know anything about her business or her client. Good point. So if she wants to email me, tell me a little bit more about it I'm fine, I'll definitely help her with that, but I don't I can't give you a yes or no, so maybe a better question is then how do you go about figuring out who those best partners are um again it's really about identifying your client and figuring out where that client is going to pay right are you gonna find that client um I also worked with and we'll talk about this a little bit like a personal shopper for example and for me I believe my client's love personal shopping experiences so I send them to the personal shopper and I also believe that my personal shoppers clients would probably do something like this so that's another good example you know when you really get into the mind of your client's where did they shop? Where do their kids go to school? Where do they get their hair done? Where were you know where they buy their cars? I don't care what it is I mean if you could find a hairdresser to talk about you because hairdressers love to talk they know everybody in the neighborhood I had suggested to a guy once I was on a skype call with another boudoir photographer in at last and he's all hold on one second I have a ups liver and he runs to the door and here I'm talking to the u p s delivery person and come back and I said whoa was that a chick that just delivered your ups they said yeah go and why are you telling her what you do is just you know what you do he said no I said that is a big mistake she knows every single person in your town she goes to every single house she knows he's ordering from victoria's secret, and who is ordering from there? You need to connect with her if even I should offer her a free shoot. But even if you don't shoot her, tell her what you do, give her the message and she will certainly deliver it to every house if it resonates with her. So don't hide what you d'oh, you know, let people know what you do cool and liana don says thank you I will email you. Okay, thank you presents now I don't shoot anything besides boudoir, but for those of you who do wedding photographers, children, photographers if you are not offering your client's presence to come in for a boudoir shoot, you're making a big mistake. Um, you already have a built in clientele, so why not take advantage of it? I think especially for people who shoot seniors like when seniors go through these amazing photos and the parents the mom especially watches her daughter get dolled up and take these picture she's pretty jealous. Believe me, I know because of my daughter gets a cool outfit, I'm kind of like, I wish I had that outfit too she's only seven, but I think if you can really? You say to mom, thank you so much for your sale. I had a great time with you. You're awesome. I would love to present you with a gift certificate for a free boudoir session. Why not do that? You have built in clients capitalize on them? Um, referrals, I actually brought some referral cards to show, and I forgot to bring them in here. But I give referral cards to all of my clients because typically a good client has good client friends, so give them a reason to refer. You don't forget people don't talk about boudoir, they're not going toe always run to their friends and say, well, maybe they'll runs their two closest friends, but they're not going to run to their twenty closest friends. Oh my god, you guys! I had the best experience. I got naked and they shot me and it was awesome. They're shy about it. Give him a reason to talk about it. Offered them incentive prince or money or whatever it might be that works for your business. Give them a reason. Bring your friend. I allow a client if they book me. I let them know if you want to bring a friend with you the same day that wants to get shot at a half price session, yes really hesitant to include like a free session or fifty dollars office session as a thank you gift because they don't want the client to get jealous that they paid full price for their session. So in other words, for the original session right for their session. So I'll be the question again because I'm not sure you could I guess I just need clarification on went talking about working with a client that you shot something else the thank you president set you include with, um you're saying that you give them I don't do a boudoir to brood war. What I would do is if you let's say you shoot a four year old and you love the mom and she had a great sale they thank her by sending her a gift certificate to your boudoir business I gotta cause she's already comfortable with you. She trusts you. You already know she's a good client he's easy to work with. You made a good sale with her. Thank her. Yeah, but I would never do food water before. Oh, I had a great experience. Refuse to give your friend a free session. Yeah. That's not good. Um yeah. Adding on to current business kind of ties into all of this as faras you know, if you are shooting other things you already have built in clientele and attract and repel make sure when you use your marketing materials, you're attracting the girls that you want and you're certainly repelling the girls that you don't want. So if you don't want brides don't put a picture of a bride on your marketing material, I think a lot of us make the mistake, but it's such a good picture, how could I not use it for my marketing material? How could I not put it on my website? Don't put it on your website, don't put it on your marketing material if it's not relevant to what you want to be doing, then create creatively so who's an influential in your town like I was talking about the ups driver, right build evangelists build people don't talk about you the now awful on the hair dresser I mean women khun, talk right find the people that talk find the cool kids as I like to say those girls that I found on that board, I started my business had I not found them, I'm not sure I'd be standing here today, but I took a chance on them and instead of me running out and saying, look how great I am everybody I said to them, I'll do this for you if you tell everybody how great I am. People trust them more than they trust me if I went up to and said, hey, tracy, I'm great, you'd be like, all right, whatever. But if daphne said, hey, gens, great, you should check her out. We're going to check her out right to build evangelists who knows a lot of people and what do you have to offer other businesses? So please don't walk into businesses and say, this is what I want you to do for me should always start with this is what I want to do for you. And in turn you could do this for me, too, and we can work together. I work with my lingerie store, which we'll get into that offers discounts to all of my clients, and she also offers personal shopping sessions on I send her a lot of business, so we're both benefiting from the situation, and I give her about just to thank you cards and thank you gift certificates to give to her best clients. So when they come in and I said, you know, if they spend five hundred dollars on laundry, you could give him a free session with me go where others are in and do something different, a pound, the pavement. A lot of the things I am talking to you about today, I realize are obvious, but I don't know each of the towns that you live in, so just think differently. What can yu dio can you go to the p t a can you go to you know, don't be afraid because boudoir is sexy, that you can't talk to people about it, no matter where they are? What is going on in your town? That's super cool that people are talking about is going to attract the client that you're looking for. Pound the pavement. I need to take my own advice on this because sometimes I'm not so good at it. This is really hard to put yourself out there, courtney, you're really good at this pounding the pavement, and you could just talk to girls and say, hey, this and I want to shoot you, right? Yeah, you are not going to if you don't know what to do if you're in your stuff in her, but I don't know where the girls are. I don't know where the stories are pound the pavement, hit the streets, walk around, see what's going on, go into the stores, you know, you could say, I'm working with the salon and it's not working, we'll go is that's all I'm busy go see if they're busy go see what days of the week they're busy maybe if they're busy on a tuesday you could say hey, listen on tuesdays I'd love to come in and show some of my work and maybe we can you know, set something up and I bringing lunch for everybody and you know don't be afraid to make yourself visible don't hide in your office all the time, make yourself visible don't forget photography is about trust and the more you put your name on it and your face on it and you meet people want to one they're going to want to work with you questions I will just say like in terms of having to go out there too I mean it's it's really like it's uncomfortable and it's so hard to just go out and I mean I just walked up to somebody and was like hi here's my card and it's weird but there is no way that you're going toe like they may never know about you unless you put yourself in the middle of something and potentially embarrassed yourself or make someone else uncomfortable even but you know they might go to their friend well, this weird woman came up to me yes, I'm the weird woman but their friend might go oh like what's happening I want to go look at the site and no such thing as bad publicity there isn't really you know, even if people are talking about it and and they're talking about a negatively you know, like they're still talking about it it's but for everybody out there who's nervous to go do it whether you're you know shyer you're kind of left field like I am you know, I e I encourage you to all go do it and just just do it there's no time like the present that's right? And I was going to make a point that just get my mind so lauren, you go on then oh, I was just going to say as a newbie that's really scary to me because maybe I need to define more what boudoir is to me but when I approach people and they asked what is that I get really nervous? Like how do I describe it in a way that's, you know, not going to scare them away. You need to have what we call an elevator speech and jeff actually during the break let me know that each of you guys are gonna be able to get an hour with him not today, but you'll eventually have an hour with him and he'll be able to talk to you about that a little bit and help you to say that this way when somebody says to you, what do you d'oh or can you explain that to me there is no qualms about it because definitely if you're nervous about it and you don't know how to deliver it how do you expect them to stand? They're going to see that right and as faras stepping out of your comfort zone to do something like this I mean don't we ask our clients to do that every single time they walk at the door you know, in our door we say listen, I know it's uncomfortable but it's going to be fine my husband super embarrassed every time I do it but he's always like good job honey I'm gonna be over in the corner right now I remember I have like pictures on my iphone too and I find you know like when people ask sometimes showing is much much more effective well in just one more comment from from the internet is from j j morgan images who was a regular who says it's all about confidence totally totally but confident fake it till you make it I mean if you don't have confidence just pretend like you do and then walk out and go home that was the hardest thing I ever did you know, just pretend because the thing is if you're not confident about it and you're not like this is the best thing ever, why wouldn't you want to do this it's not a matter of do you or don't you why wouldn't you want to do this why wouldn't you want your clients to experience this? Why what do you want to work with me? I was so nervous about the idea of cross marketing because that sounds so daunting, so what I did is I called a lingerie store and I said, hi, my name is daphne chan, I said I had a client come to your store, they received such excellent customer service that I would love to send more clients your way so immediately I put myself into a position of what I could offer them, and they invited me down to the store in gave me a tour, and now I have a relationship with luxury store, and it was so much easier than I thought it would be, so to everyone out there, just try it, and if you're too nervous to walk into the store, just call them first and get an appointment and again what's the worse they're going to say, we're not interested, you know, it's very simple, that kind of address what I was have a question about, but I also often don't know what I have to offer other businesses. So, like, if I come with no clients, what do I say to the business that I could give them like? Well, I like a discount for my clients, but I can't give you anything well, you can always like kind of flip that around, so even if you don't have clients if you said to a lingerie store um listen, I want to work with you and I'm gonna send clients to you and what I'll do is and we're gonna talk about this little bit later, I'll create mood boards for my clients and suggest outfits to them all come from your store so if you send me the client, I'm going to make sure they come back to you. You don't have to have clients to cross market just have to find a way to send them business and they'll be happy same with hair salons, makeup artist you know I'll send you all the girls if you promote me I just wanted to say really quick my husband is a personal trainer and that is a great resource to hit up personal trainers because he has a long list of clients who are newly fit and he talks all day long, so yeah, and the thing is, if he if I gave him a gift voucher and I said this is a gift from what's your husband's name steven cem, stephen personal trainer and he was like listening valentine's day I'm giving my best clients a gift they feel obligated to use that gift, but if you were like here I have a coupon they're going to just toss it in the garbage, so make sure you presented as a gift like when I give give batteries, I wrapped them up really pretty and like a nice envelope of the bo it's, not like here's a coupon for jen rosenbaum, no here's a gift voucher, and I make it look like they paid for it, even though they didn't pay for it. Thank you guys for sharing all of your ideas, there's more ideas being shared also in the live tab in the chat rooms. Awesome! Thank you, let's talk about social media really fast because this is definitely an issue and it definitely important. This is one of the things we were talking about last night is using facebook as marketing. If facebook is your only marketing plan, you need a new marketing plan. Facebook is in addition, teo everything that you're doing it's a bonus, it's the cherry on top of the sundae, but let's not put all of our seeds in the facebook basket because tomorrow it can be different tomorrow they could charge by post tomorrow they can say, well, only six percent of your clients they're going to see, um, you know, you might have ten thousand likes on your facebook page, but you know who those ten thousand people are if they're not your ideal client, then it doesn't matter what your posting on facebook but there are challenges when you do it so we're going to talk about those a little bit obviously there's there's a huge problem with people in the boudoir industry I wish they would all stop doing this to each other but can you please stop reporting other people's images so by post name agent somebody else's jealous or upset or somebody thinks it's too sexy they're going to report it to facebook and they're going to take down the page so you'll actually very rarely see me post pictures on my facebook page even though I have pictures to share very, very rarely put it on facebook uh facebook will shut you down if you shown you today and they even think that pushes are illegal um clients often don't want to be found out they're giving it is a gift or they don't want anybody to know they did it so they won't send a model release again or they say at least don't put it on facebook so you might not even have images to share if you wanted teo and sometimes you have to wait like they'll say oh how can you not post the photos till next february? Now I'm not gonna remember that, so I'm not gonna bother eso these air challenges that we're working with what we're talking about social media creative ways to get around that stylized shoots which we're going to do some of on the third day we're gonna talk about that a little bit showing your clients what you want them to see more modest photo something like this this is a very sexy little dress she had with a zipper down the middle and we did some fun playful things but certainly very modest enough for facebook before and afters I think I do that next year before and after, so sometimes I'll put the before of the girl on facebook because that's just a regular picture hey you want to see how we spiced up miss j come check out our blogged today now I'm directing people to my website in my block where I have more control over what they see and what they dio I'm getting them on facebook, which is good private group on facebook kind of like how you guys have created for yourselves I do create a I do have a client lounge for all my clients and what's nice is they can share ideas with each other hey, I saw pink outfit on you know this picture does anybody know where you you know you get that um they start talking to each other and it's private so they don't have to worry about people seeing what they're talking about it also makes your future clients feel a little bit more relieved well, there's, other people, it didn't survived anonymous images, of course, are always a good one. I love to ask questions and like trivia, so we used to do like you're bored in the office of rick let's ask a question and we'll give away like a hundred dollar gift certificate, and we'd ask stupid questions like, does anybody know the name of the street that gen grew up on are like stupid random stuff and we could like hundreds of responses. It was always nice to know people are out there and don't forget every time they respond pops up in somebody's newsfeed, you know daphne chan just posted on generations comment or whatever it is so it's good to get yourself out there. One of the best post ever. My husband and I were having a little battle about where you put tomatoes, do you put them on the counter in the fridge? And I asked on my facebook page, I swear I got more comments on that that I've ever gotten on a picture. Anything else people are very adamant about where they keep their tomatoes, so get personal I know it's ridiculous get personal, be yourself, post ili things don't be afraid to be vulnerable, let them get to know you, I'm sorry, but I have teal over my nose get let them get to know you as a person not just as a photographer it's not just always shot this one today I shot that wouldn't talk about things hey guys you like my new shoes they're so awesome oh my god look at this piece of hangar where you know our curtain we hung up in our studio today talk about your children your cats your dogs whatever you want to talk about you know get a little personal it's okay to be vulnerable you're asking your fines to do it to they like that stuff and give love get love this is very important for photographers to give other photographers love okay why do we hate each other so much? I don't understand it so ridiculous we're all in this together if I'm going to go in your picture and I'm going to say hey tracy you had a great shoot today I love it it doesn't make me less of a boudoir photographer it doesn't make all my fines go whoa let's see who she's checking out I'm going to go to that person too give each other love and trust me it'll start you'll start getting love back and what will happen is give it generally don't just give it because you want it back give it genuinely but when it starts coming back to you you'll see you have more activity on your facebook page you're coming up more on people's feet you're all doing each other a favor by supporting each other well, I just wanted teo to make a comment on that because we mentioned earlier but I want to mention again that there is a facebook group yes for this workshop and there are a lot of people who are actually interacting in there as well today and giving your feedback and comments and so the group is just search for jen rosenbaum's boudoir group very clear general hans read or group and you guys can join in the conversation as well and what's cool about that is that it keeps going and that's the accountability place and that but the sharing of knowledge just like we're doing here yeah and there's all different levels of knowledge and there there's newer photographers there's more experienced photographers my only rule of thumb there is it it's about love and I'm certainly not saying that you can't have constructive criticism or different opinions, but if I see haters, I really just don't like that we are all in this together this is to make everything better for all of us. So that's my only one rule all right fantastic here's an example before and after this is really what she looks like I didn't make this up, I swear she was awesome and it might have been one of the only times a client walked in and I went oh, what am I going to do today? I don't really know what to do with her but we worked it out so here put this on my facebook page hey, you want to see the amazing transformation of mississippi? I mean, do you guys want to see it the current you like? I can totally see what she did people click on your block and then you show this picture thank god for hair and makeup but she's beautiful you know what? She was beautiful and she is awesome because she was going through a terrible divorce and breast cancer and her husband's a real jerk and she took all these pictures really hot pictures with her middle finger up and she sent him on I love that I just love that and she is hot stuff I really love her so that's the chronicle and I want to be honest so get attention with outpost posting questionable photos you could totally work around the system instagram so um thank you so much. Um instagram, I like to use instagram um I don't use it that often, but sometimes if I can't post something like a picture on instagram, I'll post the laundry right hey, I can't wait to work with so and so today look at all the amazing things she brought what's nice is that also shows your client's things that you like so we were talking about last night about like props and things we don't like so if you start showing the things that you do like people are going to be attracted to the things that you do like so I show a lot of laundry uh maybe a little teaser shot of what's going on like a foot or something like hey look at the sexiness happening today and you can also tie it into your facebook and twitter so you can just post it there and it will show up somewhere else which is really cool because it's like half the amount of work um pinterest talks so much about pinterest it's like my new obsession on pinterest obsessed uh I do custom mood boards on pinterest which we're going to talk about I think maybe after lunch and I have actually booked clients from pinterest I saw you on pinterest I love your style I saw the boards you made for other women and I need to meet you I need to do this in fact I made my own mood board from my own session bonus less work for me to dio but uh it's great and it's and please don't be embarrassed opinion on photos I'm giving everybody permission now pin your own photos call it something like my favorite work or my awesome girls or you know my fearlessly feminine women whatever you want to call it I don't care I'm fearlessly famine of women is taken, so don't call it that now but call it whatever you want to call it and put your work out there. Make sure it's watermarked and put in there your website, your phone number, whatever you want to put and if you're too nervous about pending your own work, then have a group of friends who maybe shoot other things and pin each other's work get it on pinterest if you're not doing it it's a huge mistake pinterest this hot, you know it's like love painter if you start following me on pinterest, I'm sorry for my five thousand pins, but I'm like a collector it's like the perfect place for me, I don't even have to pay for it, so yeah it's really okay, so final marketing thoughts and I know we're going through this pass, but next we're gonna get into pricing and I know there's gonna be a thousand questions. There is some kind of blowing through this that we can do that people trust people before they trust companies logo's or taglines people trust people if you are going to go home and start working on your logo, start working on your tag why'd I need to have my branding down just stop not saying it's not important to some level put your face out there ali, if you don't put your picture on your rest, I mean, you're the curious thing ever. I didn't see your name or your picture on your website anywhere, and it broke my heart because I think you're so adorable and people want to connect with you, they want you don't want your work, they don't want your outdoor shoots or your new studio, whatever they want. You okay? Make sure you make yourself visible in all of the marketing that you're doing don't be ashamed about who you are or what your message is own it put it out there if you could do it, so can your clients, right? If I'm a booth if I want to hire boudoir photographer and I'm like, I don't even know what this woman looks like, you know, that's not good. They want to know what they want to know like oh, you know what? She looks normal. I could be in her room with her all day. My underwear. She doesn't look scary. Put yourself out there questions? No, um, marketing your business is hard guys, I struggle with it. Everybody struggles with it because your business is always changing. There is no finish line, try to make it fun and easy for yourself. It's fun. It might be fun to pound the pavement. Maybe you'll find a new cool boutique that you never found before. And you, khun, get some new clothes. You know, maybe you reward yourself at the end of the day, okay? If I hit five boutiques, I'm gonna reward myself with the new paris shoes so that you know, make it fine. Make it a game. Make it easy for yourself. Um, don't be afraid to step out of your comfort zone and experiment. Don't forget there is no failure. If a marketing promotion doesn't work, try something else. Find out why it didn't work. Make adjustments, make it work that's what I feel about it once the clients are calling. How do you handle them? What is the initial contact? Like? What is the experience for them? Like and what is your pricing like? And I am gonna talk a little bit faster. First contact. How do you want women to contact you by phone or e mail? And how will you present the experience to them and the pricing to them? So one of the points of jeff made when I first met him that made the seas part was that I'm summarizing, but that my clients were not making it about pricing I was making it about pricing. So when my client we all get these emails hi, how much is your boudoir session? And we all roll our eyes they're so annoying I don't understand it's all about price I look at it a different way I look at it as it's, not about price, they just want to know how much they need to pay to be with me because they've already decided they like me. They just wanna know how much it costs so I can do one of two things I can either say well, it cost five hundred dollars or I can say, well, let me tell you about what it's like to work with me. I know you've already decided you like me, but let me convince you that you really like me. So I choose not to put pricing on my website and I choose not to send it out over e mail because what's happening is you're basically making it about price you're making about price what you say to them this is how much across or even worse you're sending out an e mail that's five pages long that's like hears about the experience and here's how much it is and it and they're not reading that make it simple customers want you to know them before they make an effort to know you you want somebody to say she's the perfect photographer for me well, how do you know that you're perfect for them? How could you say to them? I'm perfect for you if you don't even know what perfect means to them. If somebody wants pin up, you are not the perfect photographer for them. So if you're right back to when you say thank you so much for increasing the perfect photographer for you, how do you know that you don't even know her connect with your clients from first contact? Okay, don't read this is really long and verbose, but the point is this is what I sent my client and basically what it is is, I'm so glad that you contacted me blah, blah, blah. I'm a fearless, you know, intimate photographer for the furiously feminine do you want to break out those lies that you're telling yourself, do you want to forget about those stereotypes? But on the girl for you let's chat about it, I'd like to connect with my client's, let's talk about it. So, yes, I talked to every single client on the phone when you talk about, um, do you ever? Uh well, we talked about attractive repellent you ever like not book a client or tell a client know if a client writes back to his emails is well, I don't have time I just need to know how much it is a nice table I don't give my pricing out over email if you'd like to chat you know I understand you're busy definitely call me if you can't then that's I understand that's like a filter right there, you know, I'm getting rid of a girl who's just price shopping who said the same email to ten different people um and I'm intimate I'm intimate remember my right intimate intimacy is not email question on that I've gotten to clients recently um they say they send me their phone number in the e mail and I call them right away as soon as I get the e mail and I get him on the phone there like you're not really sure who you are I sent this e mail out to a couple different people and I don't even know your work looks like that's happened to me on what I said to them was okay here's my website um if you want to check it out definitely let me know and I could give you a call back at another time because I don't want to book a girl who doesn't know who I am I'm angry at that point. I'm like, who wants to book that girls and make it hard for her now to book you if you don't want to book her that's it okay? And you know what? Here's where my work is, we'd like to check it out, let me know my phone number's on there, you could certainly reach me. Would you go into a conversation about okay? You haven't seen my work yet and then start asking them about themselves to find out if you are a good fit for them. Um, I would not it's too much work for me to book a girl who might not even want me. I don't want to force it if somebody is just starting out and they're sort of really looking for a client and that might work, but for me and I'm not trying to sound snobby like I have so much work, I don't need it, I don't want that girl that girl is not going to make me happy that's it it's every question, every time I have to make a decision now about clients isn't going to make me happy, or is it going to make me unhappy it's going to make me happy, then I'll do it if it's going to make me unhappy, just forget it. Okay, so like I said, I deliver the experience over the phone every once in a while, I will get a girl out of state out of seat overseas used me like I had an email this morning from women in sweden I'm not calling speeding, I mean, I guess like, good, but I don't really want to, um so I made a video hey, everybody, this is how my pricing works, same stick that I go over on the phone, but in a video and that works for women who are like, I work all day, I'm on a night shift, and for some reason we can't connect or I'm out of the office like today, I might say to somebody, hey, listen, um, out of the office for three days, but here's a video about how my experience works? The reason why I do that is because they still see me, they see my energy, they see my face, they see my studio, and if they either like it or they don't like it, that's the answer and I either hear back from them or I don't hear back from them. I made it on my flip camera like it doesn't even need to be fancy, but that's what it is and I do password protected and I change the password every couple of weeks um, I'm not, uh I don't really care if people know my pricing. In fact, I'm going to show all of you my pricing today, but I want to make sure that I can change it if I want to and not feel like, oh, the video, you know, the video circulating or whatever, so you can do to remain. I realize some of you have full time jobs, but just think about how you want to do it. How do you really want to present yourself over email? You know, I was just not personal. People misread things, overeem all the time. They forget emails, it goes into spam, their boring. I just don't suggest, you know.