Many of you have heard of my untraditional approach to marketing, and you guys know that I'm a huge believer of word of mouth and word of mouse marketing. So I want people talking about me, and I want people passing my name around on the web as do you and please forgive me if I referred to myself for I too much just take that out and apply it to yourself. My goal has always been for clients and friends and strangers and anybody who's ever come across the work. I want them to endorse my work like they were part of the process, and part of making them part of the process is by personalizing the things that I'm putting out. But we went through this in depth during episode one. Now there are still forms, traditional forms of marketing and traditional. I think the largest forms of traditional marketing are going to print advertising online advertising, bridal shows and paying referral. Freeze done, done, done. So this brings us up, tio what kind of clumped in as the traditional forms of mar...
keting. But when I started, I did not have money for funds to participate in a traditional forms of marketing. So if I had money back then, I might have. Because I think that what happens is you get going in your business and you're so desperate to get business that you're willing to pay a referral fees and you're willing to do bridal shows, and I understand that some vital shows work really well for photographers, I'm not a photographer that a bridal show would work for it doesn't play to my strengths, nor does it highlight my personality, so it would definitely be a liability. Now I used untraditional marketing, so and I didn't have any money, so that problem took care of itself, so I didn't have to make the decision of whether or not I wasn't the traditional aren't traditional, but I opted to do untraditional marketing, which basically coined as on tradition, marketing is taking what little you have and making it work. Still to this day. Seven years later, I'm going into my seventh season. I used the same marketing strategy as I did in the past. In fact, at the time, it could have been untraditional, but now I believe that so many photographers, they're using it that it has become commonplace, and I encourage photographers subscribing to the school of thought. So if you're at home and you're watching and you're like marketing strategy, I don't have one, and you feel like you can't compete in your neck of the woods, the way that other photographers are competing, you know, it's, like, you see all these photographers taking online ads, and you see them advertising on logs and you see them going to bottle shows, and then all of a sudden you feel like I can't play that game? Welcome to the club. What I learned my first year of business are things that I still do to this day, which has become why I'm so passionate about it. I get excited talking about this stuff because it feels really good to start something and realize, oh, I don't have to change this tiny bit of my business, everything else I'd have, teo, but this is the one constant I'm thankful to. You maybe have funds now to invest in traditional forms of marketing, but I choose not to, because just like our moms have always said, if it ain't broke, don't fix it. When I started, I didn't know that I was making a marketing strategy, so people often time like year three or four would say, oh, so what is your marketing strategy, and I was just like what I have no idea like in college I knew that fortune five hundred companies had marketing strategies but this little girl from orange county did not have a marketing strategy but I think in retrospect what was happening was I was using pieces of my resources and that's going to be the goal for you today is to use your resources to market your services so what does my marketing strategy looks like now the goal is for you to look at my marketing strategy and take out what won't won't work for you and then maybe capitalized on what might work for you are we on the same page okay are you guys feeling I feel like we're all a little quiet I feel like I just want to get some dance music on so you can raise like the rays that raise the energy of raised the roof okay no I okay so I definitely need to clarify that I specialize in wedding only I have noticed that there have been other portrait photographers and glamour photographers and family photographers who are watching and they're applying certain aspects to their business and I absolutely love it marketing for me begins the day of the wedding so at the end of the wedding I will instagram a photo and I will choose to have that instagram photo link directly to twitter and facebook and I will tag all the vendors from the wedding with a thank you so thank you and then I was the vendors that I worked with from that wedding because I want to openly vocalize that I enjoyed my time their shares sneak peek and let them know that hey I appreciate you now I tell my clients that it will take about three to four weeks for them to see their wedding images but you know from episode to that I say it takes three to four weeks is for them to see their images but they see your image is in two weeks you want teo over promise you want toe under promise don't think that you definitely you definitely want teo I remember you saying that I just feel like yeah ok I'm like I've always said that good good I'm glad you see it right so just listen tio okay what I what I'm making sure to do is I will instagrammed a photo from the day of now it could be of the couple usually out during sunset or it could be a picture of the of the reception if there's a lot of details if I'm tagging not the bride and groom I'm you know taking the vendors I want to make sure that I'm showing showcasing their work so one of those two photos now I tell my clients they're going to see their photos three to four weeks after but on tuesday or wednesday after the wedding I bought a sneak peek now what is a sneak peek a sneak peak looks different for a lot of photographers but I will talk about my sneak peeks they are no more than twenty twenty one pictures from a wedding and I include a slideshow now part of the reason why I don't include more than twenty photos because I've been to bomb post reese girl and you scroll and you scroll on the pictures just go on and on and on and if I if I stay true to what I subscribe which is to be posting photos onley to attract the type of clients that I want I'll be honest from a wedding day I don't know if I'm going to be capturing eighty five ninety five photos that I think could capture the ideal client however the slide show that has around seventy five to eighty five photos that tells the story of the day the clients they find the slideshow normally more appealing because it's a story from beginning middle and end and they share that slide show with their friends and family what I have discovered is that the slide show has become a jasmine starr commercial starring my clients and they pass around that commercial saying look at how great our wedding was so much fun we had look a gram on the dance floor and what's attached at the end of the sideshow is a promo for me and could be a promo for you now when it comes time to block the images for the sneak peek on the tuesday or wednesday after the wedding, I'm setting the block post up for six a m pacific standard time. The reason why I'm doing it six a m pacific standard time is that it means it's nine o'clock eastern standard time, so when prospective clients are on the east coast, most of the time bright, perceptive clients fall into a pattern they goingto work, they get a cup of coffee, they start email, they surf the web before they get into the routine of the day. If I'm blogging my blood post, say at eleven pacific center time, they're already into the groove of their day. I want to make sure that the block is ready and waiting for them when they wake up at their time frame. Now I will then follow up with a social media pushed and social media pushes for me come in the form of twitter and facebook. We're going to get into social media in a separate section later today, so I'm going to refrain from those questions until that section. But I want to tell you exactly what I'm doing because there is a pattern to what I do, so for the east coast brides, you're posting it. Six a m but if you've a west coast you're waiting till nine am here no, it goes live it's live to anybody so I posted it six am so if there's a bright up at six a m on the west coast she could see it. And the bride who is at work at nine a m concede I just make sure that it's live and online so anybody on east on either coast can see it does that make sense? Are you? Yeah, I'm thinking about right. Yeah. Ok. Yes. Ok. If not you follow up now I was just thinking about in news feeds how if it came up at six a m it might have already been so mary so that later that's the social media sadiq just live it's just that's a great question. So that's, why it's just out there and open so sometimes people will subscribe to the blogger and they have a couple coffees they read it or whatever. Okay, got it now the social media push in regards to feeds. I will do that to around eight fifteen because my west coast brides are now in the office following that same morning routine and most likely will kind of follow up in their morning feed and then it will appear on the east coast feed before they go to lunch so I'm doing between eight and fifteen it's eleven to eleven fifteen I know this seems very strategic, but I've noticed that there's peaks and spikes and I want to make sure that I'm being as smart and savvy as possible and I want the same for you. Cool. Yes, great! And this is perfect. Thank you for asking questions if I'm going okay? So when you are tweeting about the wedding, it's always a great thing, teo, obviously, but I'm going to here's the thing I'm going to keep these conversations as basic as possible, so please forgive me if they seem to basic but as you are tweeting is very important for you to tweet towards a venue, which is why I encourage people not to sync up their facebook and twitter, because a lot of times I've been seeing conversations in this facebook restart group we'll say, I don't really know much about twitter, but I just think up my facebook and twitter and then I don't never check twitter like if you don't never took twitter, you should not be on twitter like you want to play to your strengths and know why you're doing it, using it strategically, so I blocked you social media's separately, so if you are going to tweet about the wedding making sure that you're tweeting at the venue and at coordinators because what happens is that they re tweet the oh you hope that they retweet that then your network grows and also their networks who may or may not have a photographer can see oh why is my wedding coordinator retweeting this person? And they might see you and I have books, weddings and gigs through that mechanisms well, one time I tweeted at terran era resort I loved her and it's in l a it's gorgeous it's beautiful I could shoot there day in day out I had tweeted at hernia they retweeted it and I ended up getting a wedding inquiry just from their tweet alone that was great that social media at its finest so making sure that you're harnessing those things were gonna get into social media later too, but that was just a little caveat now now at ten am I follow up to ensure that I'm still on those feeds boo so here we are six am blood is life am I doing social media push ten a m pacific standard time I'm uploading a folder of images to facebook and tagging my clients I want to make sure there's like a little blitzkrieg, right? So if you didn't see me at one second time first time we're going to get you another time that's the goal now most of the time my clients are finding out that they their photos have been logged when they're tagged in the photos I do have rights were like hitting refresh a couple days after their wedding, but most of time it's the most the time it is when they get tagged in the photo so that's who I am do you upload all the pictures from the bog into the facebook holder? No, I'm going to get to that in a minute but that's a great question and if I don't answer which I will but you follow up with me now facebook has been the greatest the best originator and generator of word of mouth and word of mouse referrals just this past week I sent my initial client email right? We all know what my initial client email looks like and it I asked who can I thank for this referral? And she said, I'm kind of embarrassed because he's my former co worker I haven't spoken to in two years but you shot his wedding two years ago and they booked my parasite and now I'm engaged yes, please that's great so facebook two years ago put me in contact with a prospective client and that's what you think if I had to choose one vehicle, it would definitely be facebook or get into that later do you like how I'm just leading breadcrumbs ok? The wedding gallery is usually posted two weeks after the wedding has taken place so now we're going to move on, so this is my marketing strategy immediately after the wedding, and when I say marketing strategy, I kind of feel really embarrassed, but I'm going to say, I'm goingto own it, right? Because if I'm just like, well, calling to sort of, I don't solicit confidence, so I'm going to say that this is my marketing strategy, and if it works for you, great, and if you find one that's better than mine, hook a sister up, so now I'm gonna focus on a marketing strategy for the creative team, because I need to make sure that I'm marketing separately and differently to different markets and different referrals. So at this point one the one on the gallery's posted online, I send the bride an email, and in this email, I think her for me. For me being the wedding photographer, I tell her I hope she had a wonderful honeymoon. Personalized email. Then I pop in a template, and I tell her, this is how the album process works. This is how you choose your albums. You choose your images for the album, bubble blah and also in that email, I include it's, okay for me to share the wedding images with the creative team, I know that in my contract, I have the right to but I'm always going to defer to the bride because I want to make sure that she feels like she's in control and there have been a couple of their times were on the wedding day the bride and a particular member of the creative team didn't get along so well and she'll tell me everybody but so I just always will make sure and at least I know italy everybody but the photographer so I again it's always just to make sure that she feels comfortable and knowing where her images go now I ask for permission there we go great now once the bride approves of this I send the gallery teo the wedding creative team this also includes mean this is the vendors and this is the venue now I tell them they can pick their favorites or I can select favorites that I think that they would like and there is a ton of ways that you can send images you khun send a disk, you consent a usb you can send them an online gallery. The method of delivery is not as important as you actually just getting them the images because a lot of times what happens is the wedding passes and you keep on telling yourself I really have to send those images I really have to send those images, but what happens is you get so caught up but you captain prioritized the busy and the important don't let the busy get in front of the important that's going to be a main key as you market for your business because you must understand that in order for you to stay busy you have to take care of the important so people will often ask if I include my logo on my photos when I send them tio vendors and I don't I do this specifically because I want to let them know that I trust that person and I will let them know in the email please attribute photo credit too so I'm not just sending them not asking for a lot of credit so you have to ask for what you want now the main thing for me is I want them to market their services with my photos and you want your team to market their services with your photos this is powerful powerful free marketing now most of the creative team will do a blob post on their end or they'll upload of the photos to face book and they will give me a link or credit perfect that network is a network I have zero access to unless they give me access to it that's what our photos khun dio as photographers were like gatekeepers to huge marketing potential I want to make sure that you guys know that in leverage it and own that so I have had venues on different companies use my photos as part of their newsletter. Awesome! So any bride that they've had in the past, however long that business has been in business is getting a photo about their business using my photos, which is perfect at one time I I prefer when they can endorse or promote my work as apart as a vehicle of what they do now. I worked a couple years ago with a shiv ari chair company, and a lot of times, photographers like myself will take a picture of show bari chairs by themselves for the quarter. Am I saying it wrong? Stacy? Okay, I saw you make a face, and I'm just like I'm hispanic, I could be could be saying, e, I don't know, I just I saw you make a look and I was like, I'm saying it wrong aren't I weigh so it's, not the chair. Okay, sorry, I seem to you see how like I was in your sorry. Sorry. Okay, I'm homeschooled thank positive affirmation. Okay, so shit. Bari chairs this company I had taken. I ask the coordinator for five minutes of the ceremony site. Unobstructed so I wait right to all the details of in place and then I shoot photos of this now the chivalry chair company appreciates it but during that time I wasn't able to take the bright out there's this gorgeous light I took her in there and I sat on the chair I had her sit on the chairs and then the coordinator sent a thank you email teo everybody who was involved in the process which is a gold mine if you're a photographer because what the coordinator descent you is all the connections you need for the people you specifically want to market to write so she sends me this now normally I wouldn't have access to the safari chair company because the coordinator does so I email the coordinator and then I asked her to share that information with other people she may or may not so I responded back and I said here's a link to the gallery you can download the images the email me and they said can we put this photo on the home page of our website yeah of course if you can you please attribute photo credit and only the tribute photo credit they hyperlinked it too so that's great and I booked the wedding from that so this is all stuff that we can do by simply granting access to people to have our images so they can talk about us specifically now if you're kind of stuck and I'm going too fast we're ok, we're ok I didn't even wait for an answer go okay, so if you're kind of out a point and you feel stuck and you don't know how to talk to the creative team, I'm going to share the email that I used with my creative team. So this is it and these are hypothetical hi jeanie carisa, peter fran molina, molly j p and julie I use their first names always because I want to what? Thank you I could take a team and that's what we find, but I want to personalize the experience just wanted to take a brief moment to thank you from the bottom of my heart for making john and jane's wedding at pelican hill absolutely amazing personalize the brighton cruising personalize the venue because these teams work very differently than photographers they're booking multiple weddings at that venue. Floors are doing multiple weddings on a day and multiple even on a weekend, so making it as specific as possible it's lovely to work with a team who collaborates and creates perfect symmetry for a bride and groom and I'm happy to have participated in events I was proud to document their love, your work and the commitment to each other made for a perfect day their wedding on march tenth has been edited and jane granted permission for me to share the images with you you can download that your preferred images here than I give him a link feel free to use the image is as you wish but I do ask us photo credit as jasmine star dot com when using the images in any city online print promotional etcetera cover your bases have any questions please don't hesitate to ask I'm here to help in any way happy face stay fabulous jay star so that's how I request photo credit that's how I let them know the images are available for them and we'll free tio uses email as you wish now when it comes to dealing now this is I have to clarify some people probably looking at this and being like what? Okay so yes these are my photos yes I made this collage and yes this is my very first wedding so crowed ok I am pride more tart of that wedding and I thought I was going to die I literally thought I was going to have an aneurysm when I shot his wedding but at the end of the day I survived and at the end of the day the bride and groom are happy now at the time I was seeing a lot of photographers very saturated high end market like los angeles and orange county wedding photographers were known to give a sample wedding books to wedding coordinators that's still very popular still to this day I didn't even have money to buy myself a simple album, much less give a sample album to somebody else. So what I thought was, is there a different way that I can give a coordinator a thank you gift? I thought the simplest way for me to do this would be through a photo now, I just didn't want to give her a stock of four by sixes from the wedding because then it just felt like a sloppy proof box, so I put together a collage and this collage to be forever, but I need it five by seven and intentionally chose detailed photos so things that weren't related to the reading room more related to the wedding itself because I want to showcase what it is they do not necessarily photos that I think are so great of two people, so I made this collage and I used it both for the florist and for the wedding coordinator, so I printed them at five by seven I print tuesday printed two stacks of twenty five by sevens, then they got to stacks and wrap them in white ribbon, and I got my logo. You look a little punch out tied a bow around it brought a handwritten note and I sent it to the wedding coordinator and I sent it to the florist, but what I didn't do was simply put my logo on on this promo card, I put the coordinators logo, joyful weddings and events. I simply went to her website and just drag it off her website, and I put it on that document and then he printed them, so basically what I was doing was printing collateral for the wedding coordinator and then giving myself a photo credit at the same time, so I sent them to her, and that investment probably cost me everything out the door, less thin. Twenty six, twenty five, twenty five, twenty six dollars she sent me, she said, more weddings, but I did a booking three weddings from her that year, and the florist ended up emailing me and asking for more of these promo cards so well, I felt embarrassed a little bit silly handing these over because I didn't think that these photos were particularly all that great when I was really doing was finding the value in helping other people market their business. So what can you do to help others market their business? Yes, ryan, how how long do you wait to do this? To send them a very good question. I actually don't send the problem cards anymore, but at the time I would probably take me about three weeks. Because the wedding was edited two weeks posted online then I would have the coordinators and florist pick out their favorites and I was kind of saying, oh, they kind of like this one so that was the one that I was making sure it including in the in the problem card if a photographer shot a wedding last year and they wanted to send something to the venue do you think the venue is appreciate that or do you think that it's the time is past where you shouldn't send that anymore for I it's a perfect question and actually I'm going to get to that later but I'm gonna answer you now specifically when it comes to venues venues are a little bit different of a beast because when we're working with coordinators and florist and designers it's feels a little bit more booty or mom and pop but when you go to a venue they are very fortunate that people come to them with such frequency that there's a little bit less hustle from a venues perspective then like a mom and pop like we all need to hustle and you know the hotel is a hotel and then he was a venue and people just come to them so they might they may or may not now if you had done a wedding a year ago with the coordinator I think that she would definitely appreciate implicitly the promo cards more then say a venue a year later, but that's just like my personal opinion, but you never know. I mean, how much does it even cost, you know? Well, and I've seen some venues that where they clearly have dated canvases and print right when you walk in where you're like, wow, that was eighty six maybe so you know, maybe rate is going to be important, I think that's a great, great great insight now before we guess what then you might need it's always okay to ask because here's the thing if you're a venue and have this great photographer see elvis photographer and you shot at the hotel monaco, was it? Yeah, okay, so nicky and I don't know the last thing about the hotel at all, so let's just say that clients will go to the hotel monaco and then they see these photos from nineteen eighty seven not that the hotel monaco has nineteen eighty now if nicky were to give them a canvas oven updated aesthetically, you have nineteen, eighty seven, nineteen, eighty seven and then you have, like two thousand twelve or two thousand thirteen you never know there are sometimes catering manager's and venu proponents were just like, oh, no, now it looks funny and they would prefer to keep their old school photos on the wall ask them if it one would be okay if you provided them with a new canvas and they said, well, you know, we would have to do all of them if you have money, do all of them or say I can get three other photographers and we can all provide a canvas for you and then who are you going to pull from your network? Thank you. Who said that way? Connecting the dots like this is a big way work three months to build up our brand's. Welcome, sam. Calm down. Okay, take a deep breath. Wei have spent three months working to this moment. I did not start with marketing in the beginning, because what happens is that photographers get so excited about the marketing and you're marketing a bootleg brand. I want youto all in your mind like you went through all this process to be really proud and know who you are and network. So now if hotel monaco said we would have to do all seventeen, you're going to go to your home girls here in seattle and be like, who can pitch in two canvases and I guarantee hotel monaco coverage boom marketing at its finest cool okay, now we're gonna move into the third component, kind of like we're breaking this into, like, four components, okay, ladies I have to separate the four of you kidding. You guys were talking back there in passing notes and I just want to open the note that you guys are okay. Okay? I'm living my lifelong dream of being a team er so I'm breaking the marketing strategy into layers were going to move from the most basic to the rather advanced or mature. So now I'm kind of like the third steps towards me four sections. So we did the bride marketing the creative team marketing. Now, if I do have a wedding that I feel could be published or featured, I feel like this is going to be amazing third tier source of marketing now it requires a lot more work on my end, but the result of kind of this type of marketing specifically to new brides is priceless. I get into the specifics of wedding public being wedding remix. Okay, theo, the specifics of getting your work published on my last creative life course getting published how to shoot an editorial wedding now during that course I spoke with national wedding magazine editors from inside weddings in the knot and I spoke teo online editors from style me pretty at the larsen a green wedding shoes jen and we also had some are watkins come on from great likes weddings, and she really instructed us what we should be looking for from a photographic perspective, I felt like it was a great course and if you want to learn more about that component of marketing definitely check it out now they all wanted the same thing if you saw a pattern that editors both an online and print were really drawn to the same thing. So if you want the cliffsnotes version of what they were drawn tio here's a brief breakdown they first want you to find the best fit because magazines cater to very different readers and very different bright as well as online wedding blog's catering to very different brides, making sure that you know who you're submitting to you and why you're submitting to them no if it's a good fit if it comes into for online or prince an online submission is very different from a print submission and they both comes they both come a very different advantages, but there's the waiting process is so much longer and some photographers just find that it might be a better fit for them to go directly to webb. I also know the audience there are so many wedding blog's now that you can cater to specific regions and specific you know you have a rock and roll broad block a rock and roll love you haven't off beat bride you have the d I y bride now all of these are going to be valuable for your brand but at this point you should be knowing exactly what your brand words are so even if there is this big huge behemoth of a block, you're going to know that it's not a good fit for you because you want to go more in this direction they might have a smaller readership but it's a more focused and niche readership that is going to be a much better fit for your marketing time and effort. They also want roughly one hundred to one hundred twenty five images from the wedding so again, after you've done the vendor marketing and after it in the bride marketing you're going to go through the gallery and you go through all of these images roughly let's you say you have eight hundred images you're gonna pick one hundred to one hundred twenty five and what they ask for specifically eighty percent details and twenty percent photos of people so legends photographers think oh tons of pictures of writing room no and when they say people photos they do not want twenty percent of bride and groom they want twenty percent of people so they want guest at the cocktail hour dressed up to the nines they want family portrait it's they want interesting bridle ascension no dissension in ascension of the isle interesting things like that happen like that s way get into detail last time but this is going to be a cliffsnotes version also, what they want is a detailed vendor list who worked that wedding. They don't want to take any guesses, so on your responsibility it's up to you and if you're working with a coordinator that's great, but early on very few photographers or work with coordinator so you have to go through and find out who did the limo who did the music, who did the bridesmaidsdresses who provided the groom's attire, groomsmen attire so all of those things and get into details then also what they want is what made the wedding special because there are literally thousands and thousands and thousands of weddings that happened on a weekend in the united states. What make what made the one that you photographed special a lot of times, this comes with what they do professionally or how they met or what their families d'oh. Lastly, a bride question here, a bride will be able to answer details to questions you didn't even know existed. So, for instance, let's just say she used portions of her brought her grandmother's wedding dress in the lace napkins. I didn't know it was a photographer, but she would know that you ask your things that made her day unique, tio what made her day unique, period great, I'm out of breath, but this is time consuming but having a bride's wedding featured is an honor and it has done wonders for my business, and I've noticed that when I put a wedding and it gets published either in print or online, it seems to attract more and more of the type of bride that I want to shoot so it's worth it for time and effort. Definitely. So in regards to that here's a look at a recent published we heard reason online polishing on style me pretty. Now what I like about web features is that it's click to page in the magazine something with a dog near me, and then maybe have to go home and might lose the magazine there's something very valuable about this, and also there are meta tags and search engine optimization that really plays very well going back to my block since have a very strong online presence. Now what happened in this case is that I, in the right of talked about how the coordinator I went through and made the centerpiece and she roam the aisles of home depot well, the little maid it metadata creatures that google creates or has found that getting contacted abby, it sell me pretty, and they asked to repurpose the chute on the home depot vlog. So it told like to me, I was just like, this is like a win win win and marketing that went I mean the stats on my block that day were incredible as they were for abby, so I think it was a win for everybody involved so again, finding the right fit. A lot of times people ask about the first time I got featured in print and that was inside weddings, and it was actually ah wedding that we photographed in two thousand ten here in washington, just outside of seattle, it was incarnation washington at carnation carnation farm. Now it was pouring rain that day and then it broke for twenty well, which at the time I had no idea I was like what's going on everyone normal twenty five minutes and we ran outside for their first look and because he was a farm, the added, it wasn't like a hoedown, but this small elements and casey the bride really did spend a lot of time on all of the smallest details, including outfitting the entire barn by bringing in heater lamps and lamps and custom furniture and details. And as I was shooting this wedding, I felt like this is something different. Now this is a nice wedding period, but this was completely not done in two thousand ten, so as I was going to this, I just had this like, burning sensation being like I got to get this featured and I did the submission process completely wrong so what that teaches me is given editor everything she needs to know, but know what you're doing in advance. Had I done more homework, it would have been less of a headache for her, and my business would've been casted in a better light. Thankfully, maryland oliviera of inside weddings is very gracious, walking through the process and what resulted was a five page feature and inside weddings and definitely one of the proudest moments to kind of walk through and see again. Ah lot of details, the only people photos were post photos and again very, very detailed, focused on oriented yes, of course, out of this thing with your face, I imprint, and they have the whole article that goes with it. Yes, he writes the article with their editors. Oh, so what? What happens? Ok, this is a great question. This is a great, great great question, so you didn't even know it totally has something to do with it. It really paints the picture, so as I'm putting together their curriculum for restart, I'm sitting there wondering, what do people want to know? And what is me just talking hot air? So you asking what you want to know really does help me so when you're putting together the list of vendors and the bride questionnaire that I had mentioned earlier, when you're putting together your submission, I made sure and I spoke about what casey did for a living, and I'm just going to keep that here. I mean, I'm not going to say online what she did if you want, you can read in a magazine what she did for a living and what her fiance now husband did for a living. I spoke what, what their family did for a living when I don't want to think generally, but there are certain national magazines that do, like highlighting society type families or very interesting stories, and not only did she have an interesting story and came from a great family, she also had great, an impeccable taste. So all of those things kind of really meshed really well. So in order to get an editor interested and inspired, I do a short right up about what I think there is, and, you know, I sometimes do grab their block post, and then I just the block post a little bit more, so I'm tryingto work smarter and not harder, but again, editor see hundreds of weddings come across their desk every single day they click through submissions through their inbox every single day what's gonna make your stand out ah full story and again into all those details in the last how to shoot on the editorial wedding and get published workshop thank you for that question great are we cool here for questions too? Yes, go ahead so like following up with what melissa said how how many? How many words would you use like when when have you two spoke too much about it or too little like how much wouldyou go into detail? Just a few paragraphs or yeah about three paragraphs is going to be good now remember you're not trying to write the story for the magrane you just want to get enough details across but you don't want to list it in like she went to this school he went to this school they met here her dad does this so I kind of just make it fluid so I talk about originally when they met what drew them to each other, what she does now, what he does now, what their families do anything that I can get without making and I explain advance to my bride like what I'm doing so if I'm asking her so what did you say your dad did again? Like I don't want some creepy way don't know that I'm planning on sharing the images and it seems that because print is sad way, a dying thing, it's very, very, very competitive now to get in print, so I'm super selective because I don't want to spend so much time with weddings they think are going to be a toss up because the longer I wait and hope and hope and hope that it'll get printed in print, the less the lesson thais if it is for an online blogger to feature, so the timeline is a year blog's don't blog's may if it's an awesome wedding, feature it more than a year, but usually they like it within a year. Print magazine most likely will not print a wedding. Actually, I'm quite certain they won't print a wedding more than a year old. Okay, thank you. Yes. So if you shoot this wedding and you knew at the wedding that it was something you wanted to get featured too quickly afterwards connect with her and let her know what your intentions are and that you want it to essentially going permission. Or is this like outlining your contract before hand? And do you have per cent something else before you submit publication? Okay, so the two questions were how quickly do I follow up, and if I have her sign something else in my contract, it's, inclusive, that I owned the rights and the reproduction and there is the party list in the contract that there is a possibility for print and online publication, but I will not move forward unless I ask for her permission. And there have been bride too. I really want to keep it private, and I respect and I respect that, but they go through the contract before and I reserve all rights for the block. I have actually turned away wedding because they said, well, we don't want the photos like featured anywhere line we don't want them on your block, and they'll even though they found my work by coming from a blogger, so I just felt like, you know, and I explained to them, I said, thank you so much and so precious to meet, but if I can't share my work, it really it really doesn't disincentivize is need to actually push forward and what I think I should be doing and that have made exceptions for a few clients, but generally speaking, I want to share them on the block again. Look how we're marketing if I can't mark in my business through my marketing strategy, it doesn't make sense for me to shoot the wedding, he just doesn't know I don't have her sign anything else I do. Ask I don't let her know, I ask if it's okay first, and if she gives me the permission, then I tell her she's more than welcome to share the images on her private mechanisms, but not to share them publicly, because the minute they get on pinterest, the minute they get on another blog's feature can't get pulled because they're just too out there. We're going to be starting the fourth component, the fourth component of the marketing strategy for me now, I will never forget watching american express commercial, and this was a about, if I'm not mistaken three or four years ago, and it was highlighting a fashion designer by the name diane von furstenberg matter of sixty seconds, I understood her vision, I appreciated her passion, and I respected what she did, and I don't know what thing about fashion design. I saw the commercial, I was like, go, ugh, I don't even know if you're good at what you do is clearly she's going what she does, but I understood her. And even if, even if I didn't implicitly understand the intricacies of what she did, had mad respect for where she had worked and the story that was conveyed through her passion, like I said, this was about maybe four, five years ago, and when I saw it, I told myself that I one day I'm going to make a commercial for myself because I want people to feel the same way I did when I saw diane von furstenberg a complete stranger but who loved what she did and wanted to invite people on for the journey in two thousand eight, I made my very first commercial, and when I talked to the cinematographer, I went to youtube and google that commercial, and I sent him that guy said do whatever you need, teo, but this is our inspiration, and in addition to that throughout the years I worked at the same cinematographer and I found other things on the web that if I'm particularly inspiring and how they're how they're shot and so every year the goal for me before I get that, I know that there are some photographers who called them photographer pro mose or show reels or commercials the name doesn't matter, but I would prefer in my business to itemize them as the commercial because this is what we're doing. We're dealing with commerce and it is itemized in my books and we get to pricing to advise as a marketing expense definitely and wholeheartedly so I meet with brides and so many of them will say, after I saw your videos, I felt like I knew who you were and that alone to me is worth investing in a commercial because the less time I have to spend convincing them of who I am the more time they're going to spend realising if I'm a good fit for them so that's why I wholeheartedly endorse them so I invest in a new commercial for my business every twelve to fifteen months now I know that seems a little extensive but I believe that it helps me stay current and I want it to reflect the photographer I am not the photographer I was had I not made a new commercial since two thousand eight I'm an extraordinarily different photographer than who I was then and I don't want to show up to shoot having people expect me to be one way and then acting now who I am so I save up every single year every single shoot I'm extraordinarily organizing my bookkeeper thinks that I asked you crazy but I'm like okay, this percentage goes and this account this percentage goes over here on what we do is we save up because it is a price investment but I do think that it is paid back in dividends I am thrilled always to collaborate with anton lorimer of warmer works we just recently produced a new commercial for teeth I'm getting nervous in a commercial for two thousand thirteen and I am extremely excited to give restart a sneak peek at my two thousand thirteen because it gave me a voice for the first time in my life I realised I was holding something that really represented white wine give me a reason it gave me a purpose allowed me to live out loud living out loud means to tow love with reckless abandon to play by my own rules teo make things up as I go along and then make them work I believe photography is our way of connecting with the world showing our perspective is the greatest thing I could hope for in a photo would be a moment that reveals a person's true it's the most honest part of who they are I love photography I'm smitten with the opportunity to curate life as I see it, I've come to know that the thing I cherished most is creating relationships creating connections and photography has paved the way for me to make these connections both with photographers, clients and anybody who's passionate about photography, I love helping photographers define who they are and tell a better story and I've had the honor and the privilege of connecting with other photographers and mentoring and teaching them as they find their voice. It really is about finding that one thing the thing that connects you with other people thing that gives you purpose thing that powers it'll about love for me this photography I'm doesn't star and I live out loud wait realize that someone with your video get that's anton larmer of warmer works. He is a true professional, and we started working, and the crazy thing is, in two thousand seven, anton emailed me facebook, me and he's, like, hey, I don't know who you are, and you don't know who I am. But I have this camera and I have it's really just been smith and with his work and he's gone on to do amazing things since then, and now I feel bad, calling him like, please don't forget about me. So I was just really happy that he came on, and this process has been very special to me. And the fact that he was able to incorporate it, I think, is acting now as a really definitive point in who I am as a person in my career. Thank you.