Conquer Fear & Self-Doubt with Amanda Crew
Hey everybody, how's it going? I'm Chase Jarvis and welcome to another episode of the Chase Jarvis LIVE Show here on CreativeLive. This is where I, yours truly, sits down with the world's top creatives, entrepreneurs, thought leaders, and I do my very best to unpack some actionable, valuable, hopefully meaningful lessons with the aim of you living your dreams in career and hobby and in life. And my guest today is, Amanda Crew. (atmospheric electronic music) (audience applauds)
They love you. What's up?
What up, you have the squeakiest chair ever.
I do, I know this is professional sound quality. Ree ree ree.
But I was very impressed with that intro.
I would never be able to do that.
Well, you hear that? (laughing)
Yeah, I heard that.
Folks at home, it's not me. It's not a bubbly stomach, that's my chair. We're gonna celebrate it. Actually, speaking of chair, we are in an amazing location, I want to give a shout out to, Los Angeles, not really Los Angeles, th...
is particular room is Howard Hughes' office.
Which I still don't believe.
You don't believe it. I'm gonna have someone validate it.
Before we leave here. No, a shout out to my friends at 72 and Sonny who are giving us this amazing room, and here to celebrate you. New season of Silicon Valley coming out.
That show totally fucking rocked my world when it came out. (Amanda laughs) I'm in the middle of that. I'm like, I've got to start up with Creative Live, you probably know about that.
Mm-hmm. And living that Silicon Valley thing from, as an outsider, born and raised in Seattle, I've come down here and it's a thing, it's like you guys freaking nailed it.
Yeah well I spent a lot of time writing it, so I'm really, I appreciate that you appreciate my research.
Thank you. You guys have done a great job. But I do want to give you a shout out. I love the show and there's a specific reason that I, well I've gravitated towards you and your comedy and you as a personality on that show for a number of reasons, one of which is you are, until last season you were the lone female with--
The lone soldieress.
But it's incredible, and I know Silicon Valley has that backstory behind it.
And probably there's some reasoning in there, but you rock. I'm always looking for strong female ass kickers and you're leading the pack.
Yeah well I appreciate that. It's been a weird ride being the "lone" female, I mean now I have Suzanne Cryer playing my boss and so she's another "woman" up there with me--
She's funny as shit, too.
She's so fucking funny.
She's good, she's good.
She's so, so good and she's just such an amazing human being, but yeah, it's been a really weird, like when the show first came out, obviously it was getting a lot of flack for like, not having any women and Mike Judge and Alec Berg who created the show and run it, we're talking about how, you know, it's a satire and we're like making fun of Silicon Valley and there are no women in tech. And that's why. That was like a choice. But it was this weird thing where I was just getting so much attention for being the face of women, which was like a really--
You're like, I'm Canadian. We just got like phones.
Yeah, we live in igloos. What's tech? And so yeah, it's kind of an interesting ride. It made me uncomfortable at first to be honest, of being kind of like all of that attention of like, suddenly I'm the spokesperson for it.
How did you deflect that? Did you just, like--
Or not deflect, how did you respond and own it.
Yeah, it's kind of been an evolution and I'm still kind of growing with it. At first it made me feel really small to be honest because a lot of the interviews, it just was, I felt like I was just reduced to my gender.
You know, it's just like, what's it like being the only girl with a bunch of guys? And like, that's all you see me as is just the girl--
Exactly, and so I chose to kind of educate myself more on on that world and it's been fun because now I'm actually, I've started investing in some companies myself.
And so that's been like a great way to kind of empower myself, but yes, it's been an interesting journey.
I can bet. So, by my asking you that question am I then pandering?
No, no, not at all. No because you didn't phrase it in a way, it's mainly, (laughing)...
Am I in the shot? (both laughing)
There's no woman here. No, it would actually be like a lot of the times on the carpet for the show, like for each season, you know, every single person that interviewed me, even the women, it was just always the first question of, what's it like being like on a show with a bunch of guys? I'm just like, is that really your fucking question for me? That's all you can think of? And the thing that would get me so frustrated was that everyone was just focusing on that and no one would talk about the fact that Mike and Alec had created a female character who wasn't the love interest, who wasn't the sex symbol, she was smart, intelligent, confident, successful, and no one would focus on that. And to this date, Monica has never been the love interest and that's rare for a TV show, for a woman not to be the love interest.
So, legitimately that's what you just characterized. I'm going to let myself off the hook here. That's, to me, why the character is interesting.
And strong and smart and I think, it's an interesting balance that you guys have struck on the show, first of all, the show is just fucking unbelievably funny but there's some real chords that get hit, the undercurrent having, building a company in Silicon Valley, having investors, all that vernacular. My wife Kate can't watch the show because she's like--
We get that a lot.
She's like horrified because she lived all of those nightmares.
Feel like it's way too uncomfortable to watch those you're hitting way too close to home.
Yeah, it's so accurate. But I just, the way you play Monica I think is spectacular.
I wish I could be half the woman that Monica is. She's just so fucking together. It's been the one job where I actually go through hair and makeup and get into my wardrobe where it feels like a swan effect. I'm like, oh I am now a woman. (laughs) I'm such a tomboy and like such a, like a mess and like not a mess, but I just I don't I don't put that much effort into those things and then, it's the hair, the makeup, the business skirt, and then she just like so well-spoken.
She snaps right to it.
I think you do a remarkable job playing her.
It's really, really fun. But this is not your first rodeo.
Let's go back--
This Canadians been around for awhile.
That's right. Hey. I love Canadians. That's a funny thing to say. But not so funny funny. But I have, born and raised in Seattle--
I've been going up to BC for basically my entire life. I identify deeply with the balance and you guys got Trudeau for God's sakes.
For God's sake, the most sexiest man alive and just like a gentle spirit.
Yeah and so smart and talented and boy do we miss that. (Amanda laughs)
Boy do we miss that.
But talk to me about your you know, we're in LA, certainly in LA. It's about 250 degrees in this room that we're in right now.
We are sweating profusely.
We are sweating. But journey from Canada, from, you called yourself, not put together.
Not put together in Canada to star on an HBO series that's just in it's fourth season.
Yeah, we just finished our fourth season, yeah. So, I grew up in Vancouver not far from Seattle, but a small town in Vancouver, Langley. I got in trouble when the first time I was on a nighttime show, I was on Jimmy Kimmel and I said that I was from Langley where the slogan was... I'm from Langley, wanna bang me? That--
Didn't go over well on Jimmy Kimmel?
It didn't go over too well with Langley.
(laughs) It was in one of the textbooks in like the eighth grade I opened it someone had written that and I thought it was the funniest thing ever.
Taking it forward from eighth grade. Okay, in Canada you say grade eight.
We do say grade eight, yeah.
And we don't have senior, junior, sophomore, all that cool shit.
Yeah., that's like--
All that fuckin' bullshit.
Is it like you're, at that point is it you're 10 or 11 or 12, is it--
Grade 10, got it.
Grade 10, yeah, grade 12. 12th grade as you guys say, Senior.
Yeah, yeah, thank you for Americanizing your schooling.
But yeah, I started acting, I mean I've always been interested in acting and performing. I danced when I was like a kid and--
Wait a minute, all kids dance. So what do you mean you danced when you were a kid?
I tap danced.
The real shit.
You still got it?
I do actually.
You don't lose that shit. It's like riding a bike.
Great. I might have to break it out and get a nice, actually I just tried to move this table and I just about broke the legs off, so that's not a good place to dance. But at some point, okay.
well okay, I'll tap dance on that table there.
You started dancing?
Yeah and just my mom saw that I really enjoyed performing but she never wanted me to get an agent until I was a little older and she knew for sure that that's what I wanted to do, So but she always kind of found recreational classes for me to take just like weird theater classes and, to see if I really loved it. And I was lucky that the high school I went to had a film program--
Which was rare, I mean that was like in 2002 when I took that program which is I thought was so cool and my teacher there she saw that I was really into it and so she recommended this class downtown Vancouver which was in the city.
In the city, the big city.
A little suburb girl to the city. And so I took the class and the last class was like a performance for your parents but then also there was casting directors and agents and and that's how I got my manager who I'm still with today.
That was when I was, 15 was when I got a manager or agent in Canada as it is. And that's when I started. And for the first year I booked nothing, literally nothing. I could not even book a commercial.
Hey, but you start slow.
Oh yeah, no, you gotta start real slow. I really started slow.
So slow that it's nothing, actually.
But yeah, so that's that's how I started and then after the first year then things started to kind of pick up.
Okay, so you are familiar with the show so I think you know enough that the people that we want to, or the people that do listen to this are people who are either self-identified as creativity, entrepreneurship, they're trying to make a go of this and they've already identified and they want to get better or there's a whole nother pile of people that are like I kind of want to do this but I'm scared and when you, at 15, like identifying did you just know? I mean or was there outside pressure to do this--
I had outside pressure to not do this. This, whatever this is, by the way. This is--
Whatever this all is.
Yeah, I mean, I was really lucky that my parents were supportive of me pursuing it, but definitely were not pushing me into it like my mom's not a stage mom who has wanted me to be a star. I think she probably would have preferred that I didn't get into this after seeing what I have to go through. But she was really, again she saw that I had interest in it and what I love about what my mom did was she sought out, kind of opportunities for me through classes. And so I took so many classes when I was in high school, for acting, and I really did love it and I remember when I graduated from high school, I done some work in the industry and film and TV but, it was that thing of like, you're supposed to go to as we you guys, do you do College University, you have a different word for it or something.
College but you don't do University.
University and college are interchangeable.
Yeah okay, so I'm dumb.
And then high school, you guys call it high school, right?
High school, yeah.
But we don't have like junior high.
Anyways, you just assume that you're supposed to go to university after and it was that kind of the crossroads of, do I do that? And so I kind of like half stepped into, I went to like, Community College for one semester and I didn't even finish that one because I ended up booking a movie and then I was like okay, fuck this, like I'm gonna go full force--
But did you feel pressured to do that? To go to school and not pursue your thing?
I felt that, not pressure from anyone but more of a societal, is that the word?
As you can tell, I did not go to school. (laughing) But it wasn't for my parents, it was just this idea that's what you're supposed to do, cause I did well in school. And so I thought that that's what I was supposed to do and so I kind of, you know I took General Studies for one semester and just thought that that's what I was supposed to do, but then, as you know, I started booking jobs and making money acting. I was like, okay let's--
Let's do this.
Well there's a handful of really prudent themes to this show and one of them is that that's a very hard thing to... Often for people it's a hard thing to break into because there's a lot of cultural bias against it and yet it's sort of the first time in the history of our culture that it might actually be riskier to do the safe thing, like to think that you're going to, go to school, go to college, graduate with, whatever, $100,000 in debt and you're going to get a good job and then you're going to be set. Because there's no gold watch, there's no 40 years of employment at one particular thing. I mean now that you're established probably there's no fear there but did you have any fear of that when you're like what am i doing I'm I'm and then you moved to Los Angeles and then you started like doing this more and--
Yeah I mean, I think every actor in the back of their mind has this fear of, when will they catch on to the fact that like I'm fooling everyone and when will this dry up? I was lucky in that the first year after I graduated high school I was working quite a bit, but I definitely have had periods since then where, I mean when the recession hit, it was also the Writers Union had a strike and so there was like nothing going on and there was like a year and a half where I didn't work on anything. And I had been like working and then all of a sudden the bank accounts going low and like there's no auditions and it was a really interesting time because it did make me kind of everything not that everything had been easy up to that point but everything had been just on this,
It elt natural and progression.
Yeah and it was just like it was just moving forward and up and then all of a sudden everything took a stop and then everything went down for me. And I had to kind of almost start back up again, like I had, before the recession hit I had just finished a big studio movie as one of the leads which it was like a huge get. And the movie flopped and it was supposed to be this thing where it was supposed to be huge and then I would just keep going up and it's--
So the recession, movie flop, and the writers strike and--
Oh, my God.
Yeah it's just I, for two years basically didn't work and because of how our industry works then it was basically like I had to start all over again and suddenly it was really humbling because I had to then go back to like auditioning literally for like guest stars on TV shows no one was watching. And even those I couldn't book, which it was just you know I've been going on for the leads of studio movies and then I'm now auditioning for a guest star on some shitty sitcom. But if I'm really grateful for that experience because it did kind of Humble me and then also kind of it shows you that, I don't know, because I've been building back up to that it's like okay I didn't fake everyone, like I can do this and I can lose it all again--
When you can do it twice.
Once you might be lucky. You've got to do it twice to be good.
So, A, I love the humility with which you approached that. B, that weird pillow that's sitting next to you...
You like that?
There was this pillow that Amanda was leaning against, and it was like, it was for in case she didn't like, fill out the couch enough and she filled it out and but now it's just sitting there. I got yeah I'm sorry.
I love that you got so distracted
I'm like the cushion, it's bugging me I'm sorry.
That's something that I would do.
Could you take the cushion away, Matt? Thank you.
Take out that cushion.
Take up the cushion. For the folks home that are listening to this instead of watching, I'm sorry. You didn't see the cushion. It was just bugging me. The part that I loved about your humility is we just went there, you know, it wasn't like there was a big build-up about what's it like to, because I have never known you to stumble, just what I know about your career but how much of success is humility? How much of your career has been benefited from work ethic, from not expecting to, you know, that some sort of trajectory of like, you get a hit and then you're off to the races?
Yeah I think, again like, other than the first year when I first started auditioning and didn't book anything but after that, like I said, like things just kind of naturally fell into place yes it was I still got rejected for stuff and had to fight my way up but I kind of got really lucky when I first started and started just booking American projects even those in Canada. But then when all of that like fell down, I lost my thought.
Did it hurt? Was it hard? Do you attribute success now to that period of having to go through that? Because I think there's I mean the reason I'm asking is there's so many people who are listening right now who are like everything just for the people who've "made it", everything just sort of happens and it's who you know and it's who you and I'm trying to remind people that it's not the case I've never sat with someone, like yourself, for whom it just went like that naturally.
Yeah, no, absolutely not.
It's just like, kicking, biting, scratching, the swan, everything looks calm on top but you're kicking like hell under the water.
Oh, I like that.
Yeah there you go.
That's a good visual.
But I mean, is that accurate or am I putting words in your mouth?
No, no it's absolutely accurate. And I'm still, that was kind of, you know, I have friends who are in this industry who are much higher than I am and seeing, the battle that they're up against, you realize it never ends. And I remember thinking that like, oh once I book this kind of a role it's over I'm like coasting.
And that's what I was going to say was that was also part of what happened with this at the time of the recession was, I just finished, I booked this huge job like it was that one that I thought in my mind, I'm like we're done, we're done.
We made it.
High five, self.
Yeah exactly and I then, two things happened was, I had it in my idea, an idea in my head that I would now then like people should just be like offering me shit. Like hi, I just booked this huge movie. I'm in this huge movie, people should be knocking at my door. And so then when I would get auditions, in my mind I was too good to be auditioning for this part, like they should just be offering it to me. And so I turned down a lot of auditions and then I also turned down auditions out of fear because I also had in my mind that people would be expecting a certain quality of work from me in the room and if I couldn't deliver that, If I looked at the audition scenes and I was like, oh this looks hard then I didn't want it. I didn't want to fail in the room which was new for me because before was just like, I'll fucking do anything. I will like, show up and like if I fail I fail, but I'm like gonna try and all of a sudden I was paralyzed with fear. And that's also what happened in that time of like the recession is that I kind of, I freaked out and I like steppeed back and then I had that kind of sobering moment when I woke up one day and realized like, you are not where you like, you used to be and like you can't you can't expect--
You can't pretend. You can't pretend your way out of this one.
Yeah and you can't like, no one like all of the kind of buzz that was around you is completely gone now. Like you freaked out, you checked out and it was a really sobering moment and I remember calling my agent being like, we have to start all over again and I'm ready but I've been like I've checked out. And that first year after that moment was like a really hard year because again I was having to audition for things that I hadn't had to audition for in like years.
And it really fucked with my confidence for a while there, but having gone through it then you gain this whole new confidence because you went back down to the bottom and fought your way up. Also, as an older person because when I first started I was like 16 and I think there's just kind of a wide eyed bushy tail sort of going on there and going through that a second time I've really kind of gained a whole new confidence and an appreciation for like what I do and what I have to offer.
Yeah, so what's interesting to you now?
What's interesting to me?
Yeah, like the show of clearly you guys are on to the fourth season which is not out yet but we're going to drop this probably the week before that drops, which is April 25, third, three, five, something like that.
Yeah, some Sunday in April. But you're already, you're wrapped of course because they're in post right now so what is occupying Amanda's time right now? Are you on to the next project, you filming in production? What's happening?
I just wrapped on the show a week ago and now it's back in that audition game. And it's been very busy and exciting but so exhausting but I have this new fire under my ass kind of trying to find that next thing for myself that challenges me in a new way and features me because the reality is there's not a lot of great roles out there for women.
And so it's like finding those projects that actually feature the woman and not just kind of have them on the sideline. And that's what I really have my eye on and so that means turning down things that could potentially be like cool to be a part of but if--
If you keep doing the things that it would be nice to be a part of, you might--
Exactly, I did that for a while because I needed that. That was what I needed in my career to move up but now it's like I need to push myself to the next thing. There's always the next thing.
Yeah of course.
But it's a hustle.
And it does a number on the old self confidence in the brain.
But I think it's kind of a drug, too. You get really addicted to it.
Yeah, the pursuit.
I think that what I, again I'm just gonna reflect on what you've said already which is it's fantastic for the folks at home to hear, A, the challenges, B, how hard folks work. I think again I'm trying to dispel this myth that shit just happens because I don't know a single human for whom that has been the way it's gone down it's always two steps forward one step back, a lot of heartbreak and hustle. And did you always know that this was going to be a thing? What I'm trying to get at now, what allows you to do that work, because it's not hard, or sorry because it's not easy, cuz it's hard.
Yeah, no I think about that--
You love the craft, like, you love being fancy.
When you finally get to be on set and you get to act. That's fun. But it takes so much work to get to that. And obviously when I first started acting, I had no idea what I was signing up--
You never do.
No, it's just--
It's all just made up until you're there.
I know and it's, yeah it's interesting because there's this after-school program that I'm involved with that helps girls find their confidence and self-empowerment and eventually helps them figure out what they want to do with their lives post to high school and so I was mentoring this girl who is interested in in either pursuing acting or directing. I was just like pushing her to direct. It's like go do that. I was like you got your phone, you can make movies on your phone. But it was hard because I was trying to be positive--
Yet also knowing like it's really fucking hard. I think it's the same in kind of like in the world of blogging and Instagram influencers and all that like the younger generation they see these you know these girls with like 10 million followers and like they just post like beautiful photos of themselves and like go to these things and take videos and they're like oh my god that looks like so much fun they get all this free clothes--
I want to do that.
I want to do that. well I want to do that and that world--
Those are some of the smartest, hardest working, people I know.
Hardest working. Like I actually look at what they do and I'm like, that's harder than what I do and I know that is such a hustle but people just see the online side of it. They don't see like all the work that they have to do behind it and I think that's what acting too is people just see you on TV or in a movie and they're like wow and then they see your Instagram and like obviously it's just the highlights of your life but no one sees you driving from Santa Monica in the morning to do an audition for pages and then drive to West Hollywood to do another audition with like pages in one day and then you have to drive home and like read a full script because then you have an audition the next, it's you know, it's a fucking grind and then to like put your heart out in both of those auditions and not hear anything back.
Not even like, no because of this. Just nothing. So you have no idea why they didn't respond to you. You don't know if it's because of your hair color which is literally a thing or if you did a shitty read or if you actually did a really good read but they're just offering it to a big name and you had no chance in hell.
You really have to keep the confident up.
Hit a triple bid. Yeah, so all right, let's shift gears. Let's go personal life. So you film a season...
There's the junket of promoting that which we're going to be the first show because we're ahead of the curve here.
Way ahead, it's coming out in April, but after that are you still buzzing because the show is on and people are like knocking at your door because every Sunday for X number of Sundays your speeds and feeds are up and you're excited and invigorated or is it lonely and you're still grinding and that's the thing that already happened for you six to twelve months ago and so you're on to the next thing, what's the psychology of next--
For you. I think for me it's the latter of what you said. Like while I'm working on the show that's what I'm focused on and of course promoting the show and I mean I'm a fan of the show myself I love watching it so--
It's so fun to watch.
It is so fun and like I love those boys. They're so fucking funny and everyone's so talented on the show and so when it's on I'm watching it, too and enjoying it, but I am focused on what's next and whether that is that I'm filming on something else or I'm just grinding at you know the audition game trying to get that next thing. But I'm never kind of just sitting back. I did that before just had that life, waiting for it to all just like comes to me and I'm like oh that's not how it happens so I as soon as I'm wrapped I'm you know I'm calling my agents being like what the fuck are we doing next? And just send me out, just send me out because I don't do well with just kind of sitting and trying to stay comfortable. That's like never been kind of my speed.
Well let's go there.
Let's do it.
Let's do it.
Let's do it. Let's get uncomfortable.
Well if being comfortable is not your gig what is your gig? Is it putting yourself out there on stage, in front of the cameras or is it that personal development, professional development? What part of you is the part that you like to be uncomfortable?
Well, I don't like to sit still and a big kind of challenge with acting is that I mean you're lucky if you're working sixty days out of the year. I mean if that's that's like a successful actor you know it's like you you don't get to work that much. That's when it's easy is when you're on set and so the hard part is that there are times of the year where it's just not as busy and you're not auditioning at all you go from like three auditions a day to not having an audition in a whole month. And I really, when I was younger I mean I really struggled with kind of that kind of like 100 to zero. And a lot of actors I think write for that reason, because that's a creative outlet that they can kind of have control over. And I always envied that about a lot of my friends who are actors who wrote. But I had never had any drive to do that but I recognized that I needed something, a creative outlet on the side that I had control of, that I could pick up when I wasn't working. And that's when I fell in love with photography because I'd always loved photography but had never really pursued it. And it was about when I was like when I realized I need some something on the side and so I just I started like teaching myself how to use a camera and that has become such an amazing creative outlet for me. And through that I've done you know, at one point me and my best friend had like a blog that we were doing with that and then I got a lot of respect for bloggers because like this was a lot of fuckin work and I'm not doing this anymore. But I also like I have this like on, totally hobby, super small on the side, but I do this like interview series called Frank, where its, I interview someone and do photos and like there's kind of a questionnaire that they fill out by hand and I scan and like gather pieces of their things and I scan the like it's this whole like big piece on a person and that has been so fulfilling for me just as this creative outlet that I have control of that there's no kind of, the outcome is just it's just for me I don't care--
There's no intermediary or end benefit.
Exactly, I'm not doing it to get to a like a higher point it's just for me and it's been one of like one of the most fulfilling things that I've done outside of acting, has been that. And it's kept me sane. And it's been interesting because once I started diving more into the photography I was able to kind of... When I would audition there's like a little bit less pressure that'd be putting on myself because it used to be like acting, writer, dialect, everything takes a backseat this is the only thing in my life. And you learn that you need to have like a balance with like all of that and I was able to then take some of the pressure off of myself with my auditions because I had these other things going on that we're also rewarding and fulfilling for me so it wasn't this thing of I need to like book this because like if I don't work soon I'm going to go fucking crazy. it's like I've got this other shit going on. And that's also been like the world of investing, too, has been a whole like this is very recent for me in the past couple months where that's started to happen and like I'm a strategic investor and I'm like part of like phone calls and stuff and I fucking love it.
And then my lawyer that I hired to do my contracts, we're like potentially creating a product, I don't... (laughs)
So it's very, very early stages but it's like very exciting to me. This whole new world has opened up that now as I'm doing it, it makes complete sense to me cuz I've always been interested in business, but had you told me that like two years ago, I'd be like, there's no fucking way. But like it really is, it's so interesting how life can take you down different roads if you're open to it.
I went on a tangent there.
No, no but it's a good tangent, like I feel like natural tangent tangent but I deeply identify with that I've spent my whole life trying to carve out who I was, an identity, a belief, a life, a living, around just being an artist.
And you know, to have to start to pay attention to business because of things that happened in my life like, hey, you want to be an artist like not a starving artist. And in the early days you're looking around you're like, all right who's on my team, unique team of one.
You have to advocate for yourself. That changes over time but, I became intoxicated is the right word but business is probably not the wrong word in sort of doing things that would facilitate a broader spectrum of things for myself and I also am an @anal@ investor and you know about Creative Live, those things have largely shaped a new part of me. And I've not walked away from photography, filmmaking, or any of that stuff, but I love the fact that we can all be hyphens now, that you're not just an actress, like when I found that out about you your passion for photography, I was like of course, we're all a bunch of hyphens and you know here's another one of Amanda's things.
Yeah and that was kind of, I used to have this belief when I was younger that to be an actor you could only just be an actor and I think that's why I kind of always shied away from the photography was just like, oh well that would mean that I'm not fully an actor because I'm not giving a hundred percent to acting if I'm also doing this stuff on the side. And now I can't imagine my life without having stuff going on and it just, once you take away that label from yourself of just like, I'm just an actor, I mean a whole new world has opened up for me that is so much more rewarding and fulfilling then if I just labeled myself actor, that's it, I'm not allowed to do anything else.
I love it.
Yeah, I mean cuz, you made like huge like pivots in your career and like and it's opened up, I mean the impact that you're able to have now on people as a result of that whereas if you just been, I'm just a photographer, I mean your world is so crazy to me now, like you just do so much. And that story you're talking about, sorry to like bring it in but like of why you weren't on Instagram for so long and when I read that I was like, wow and the fact that you, I mean you really could have just stayed in that dark hole and like just in like okay fucking I'm never like venturing into this ever again. And I really admired like reading that I was like wow I really admire that.
Like you you continue your like you pivoted in that world.
That was when I was casually referring to it earlier like there's, I went through some things, that thing, that business thing was--
(laughs) That business thing.
Yeah the thing is like I act like Oliver Lee through in part paralysis and in part and if you guys know I'm talking about I created an app in 2009 called Best Camera which was the first iPhone app--
Which I had by the way.
Yes! Which is the first iPhone app that shared photos to social networks, and it was a year and a half or so that Instagram, it was Apple, it's not like I created an idea and, oh well, but it's like I created cable television and I just, I create it up here. No, no create a physical thing and it was very successful, a million downloads, app of the year for Apple. Well you know, global speaking tour about the future of photography, all that stuff and when it came time to potentially transact and have never work again money, like private plane money, I couldn't pull the trigger specifically because I had spent so much of my time as creating and fulfilling what I thought an identity of a creative was and that was different from an entrepreneur and that was influenced by culture not what I was feeling in here. And so there's all kinds of things that are wrong with that and what Amanda is referencing is a blog post that I wrote sort of confessing all that five years later, which was--
For legal reasons.
Yeah, for sure.
I just spat on myself, too.
Yeah, yeah. (laughing)
I've spat on myself a lot. Anytime I say legal reasons it's a mouthful.
Wll thank you for thanking me. Wait, is that right? Yeah, thank you for thanking me.
Yeah. You just got shy.
I did, yeah, I'm so shy. Yeah, these guys they know. Hey but let's shift gears a little bit. So thank you for having my app, too, by the way. But when I saw you in the hallway, I literally felt like I'd known you for 10 years and I don't know why that is.
I know, it was the weird feeling for me too because that was the first thing I said. yeah I feel like I know you, but I don't know you and I want to give you a hug so we did.
And it's okay?
What is that about this day and age that we live in?
Ah yeah, probably the fucking Internet. I mean, which I love and I hate. I have such a love-hate relationship with social media and the internet. I think it's such a powerful tool that has like connected us and has opened my world up to different point of views, different... Artists, different products, different everything but then I also feel like there's so many voices you know and it's like the way I look at selfies where I'm just like I have a love-hate relationship with selfies because I part of me when I see like a selfie of my friend is like I cringe but I'm also like, good for them, they're feeling good, they're feeling themselves. it's a little self-indulgent, but they're feeling themselves.
Which is good to feel good.
Yeah, exactly. It's like the gym selfie. You're like, they're feeling good, they're exercising, and they're feeling confident and they're like, but are they just looking for compliments from everyone because they're actually insecure?
Yeah. No, it's good. I think it's a really interesting concept.
Yeah, no it's such a... Yeah and I struggle with it myself. I'm surprisingly a very private person and yet I also love sharing things about myself, but then sometimes I just get really shy about it, like it took me forever to post a photo of myself on Instagram. I remember the first time I posted a photo of myself it was from a red-carpet event and I felt so gross posting this photo. But I wanted to post it because I wanted to give credit to the whole team that like puts, I mean there's fuckin like 10 people that put together your whole look.
And I wanted to give them credit but I also didn't want people to think that I was like, oh, my God like how beautiful I am and tell me I'm amazing and beautiful and gorgeous and that you want to be like me, like because that's the feeling that I guess sometimes when I see those photos. But I do realize that there's positivity behind that too and it's just about--
It's complex. I think that's what we have to acknowledge and there's, we've talked about this a little bit on the show, probably not enough cuz it's something that I think about a lot and the people whom are in your shoes, even my shoes, or folks who are very, very out there...
Out there not in like in (whistles), but in like a--
But also a little.
Yeah, it requires that, but that's a it's an actual thing, there's a psychology around it, and I know a lot of people. We talk about it in private how it's kind of it's weird.
And the Instagram thing you just mentioned like telling people all that, like what is the purpose of telling people that if it's not to point back at you? And in my world I had to wait long enough to make it about a learning lesson for others and that was part of the reason I justified just continuing to put this off, because it wasn't like when it resolved itself I just went out the very next day. There was still months post that where I was like, is this the right thing? Is this the wrong thing? And I have become less and less self sensory because I'm, I don't know, I need to keep moving from it, right, that's my nature but how is it for you, because you're clearly processing this stuff? You're red carpet. You're in a super successful show and it's expected that you will promote yourself and your career. And if you don't beat your own chest and who's going to like celebrate you for you--
So how do you do it?
Yeah, I mean I think about it a lot and I put a lot of thought into it. I think my biggest thing is just making sure that any time I'm putting stuff out there, it's never in a way, the last thing I would ever want to make anyone feel is that they're less than.
And that's like always been a big thing with me is that I've never wanted to make anyone, my friends or fans feel like they're less than me and that I'm up here. And so, that's always been kind of my natural intention anytime I put stuff out there. But also recognizing that, you know, especially with fans they do look up to you and they are inspired by you and that you you can have positive impact. I mean I've been working with this trainer.
Nice, me too.
But I've always been really into fitness, but I just started training with this trainer in the summer and he had said to me, he's like, you need to be posting about this. I'm like, that's gross. I don't want it like post about my fucking workouts.
And he's like, you have a platform and you can spread a positive message with, I mean, because I've now become very passionate about like women should be like lifting weights or resistance training and like we shouldn't be cardio rats. And he's like you can help spread that message and you know as someone who suffered from like terrible self-esteem in high school and everything, it's like you can have impact by sharing that. And so I realized that part of me was being selfish by not sharing that kind of stuff.
That's exactly this weird psychology that's like as soon as you can justify not posting X photos of yourself for Y reasons, then the other side of the same coin is like and you're missing opportunity to help other people pursue their dreams to, you know--
Yeah and that's the other side of the coin of you know me never wanting people to feel less than, I also recognized that I was starting to kind of make myself small to make people feel comfortable and that was also though, my friend pointed it out to me I remember one time and she was just like it's a disservice to other people she's like by you being yourself because I'm just I'm such a weird nupple. And she's like, by you not being fully yourself then you're not giving, when you do that you give people permission to be themselves and by you not doing that then you're you're not giving people permission. And so it's just this interesting, you know like on one side, it's this healthy thing of like not wanting to make people feel less than, but then by stunting myself I'm not you know giving people permission, it's just really fucked up like double sided coin. And it's a very fine balance but it was that was a very eye-opening experience for me of realizing that I'd been doing a disservice to other people by trying to service them.
I think that the folks who are listening to this or watching this, I think everyone can identify this we're talking about you and your career in Hollywood et cetera, but I believe that that exists for every person. Like how much of, in this world, am i sharing? What's too much? What's not enough? And that's one of these ins I've been sort of trying to foster this conversation because it doesn't happen enough.
I want people out there to know that's something I also occasionally get to do crazy things that I have no business doing. People who are like, I'm Way blown away by and getting to learn from them. And I don't post those pictures and it's and I'm like I'm kind of bummed at some times I don't have that memory or the X or Y or Z to put that out there with confidence because I'm worried about it being misunderstood or whatever.
And I'm hearing that from you.
A, not alone, this is going to, we're all in this together, but I think you have done just a masterful job of that.
I don't know, your feeds are super funny. They are, they're just, and that's what in part when we saw each other in hallway that helped me feel like I understood you.
I knew you.
Well that makes me feel good. So thank you.
Yes, you did a good job. The mutual admiration society can now adjourn. Back to the hard fucking questions.
We love each other.
It's back to the hard questions.
I keep saying back to the hard questions and then you keep talking. (laughing) Okay all right. So um hard question number, how many hard questions have I asked? Not very many, right? What's next?
That's a great question and there's no answer to that right now. Like I said, I am back to auditioning, the terrifying world of auditioning. And so I hope, I hope, maybe by the time this airs, I'll have booked that really big fucking job. But yeah, like I said, like right now I'm just super focused on it. I have a couple projects coming out this year but again--
Yep, those are things (mumbles).
Yeah, they're just, I'm kind of this way. So I really have been focused on kind of finding that thing that challenges me and showcases me in a way that I haven't been showcased and challenged before.
Cool. Well I would like to adjourn from that point for a second because you are about to enter the promotional aspect of your--
All those questions about being the only girl.
Even though, I'm not the only girl anymore but they still say I'm the only girl.
There's two of 10.
Two of 10 females. I will share a story with you at this point. Prepare for a story people. (Amanda laughs) I went to the world premiere of the first, second, and third seasons of your show.
First one was in Palo Alto.
I was there.
Yes and there was maybe 150 or 200 people in attendance. It was chairs like brought out onto a floor screen about as big as that TV, we're in a room with the TV right there and I remember Mike Judge, creator of the show getting up and saying, so it's kind of weird because there's a lot of people in this room, it was super small. I was like big super VIP is and I when those things I don't think I posted a picture from that because I'm uncomfortable because sitting between these fancy people--
Amd I remember Mike saying something like, it's kind of weird because I guess I just have to tell us what to think because you're all in the thing.
You're basically in the show.
Yeah, in the show. What I watched happen that night was, you guys I think at that point, now you played two episodes, but at that point you, I think you might have played three because they're 22 minutes or something like that and is that how long they are, 22, 23, 24?
They're 30, cause HBO has no commercials.
That's right, that's right. See, she's already in promo mode. And I remember afterwards that whatever, watched couple shows and then the people in the audience were sort of miffed because Silicon Valley, and I don't know what it is, Silicon Valley loves Silicon Valley. I should just tell you that. Not the show, but Silicon Valley loves itself.
And there was, that someone was creating a satire about this world that they had created was very hard for the people, especially the super famous people and I remember there's a red card which is super weird in Palo Alto. Red carpet with a step and repeat and I'm watching these like, watch it they don't know if you know what to do here the San Franciscans are like, awkwardly get in front of the step-and-repeat but I watched this sort of slow-motion train wreck of Silicon Valley not capable of handling a satire about itself. Do you have that recollection at all or was that just as an outsider? Because you yourself--
I mean we would have more of an insider scoop on that because you know some of these people so we were we felt like the guest at that--
Yeah, they loved it but there was definitely an easy one--
Well, I remember Elon Musk was at that wasn't he?
Mm-hmm. It's specifically Elon and Peter Thiel who commented about it, that I'm referring. I was not going to use names but--
Yeah, they were not psyched. Because I remember one quote I think in the paper or maybe I heard it in person was something like, you guys made fun of us for trying to save the world but we really are trying to save the world.
Well because that was like the theme of the first episode that was the big joke of we're just trying to make the world a better place and I get that because most of Silicon Valley is genuinely, that's what they're doing. But it's just funny to make fun of.
Yeah, it is, but it's also like, what Silicon Valley needs to understand, don't know if LA or if pop culture is making fun of you, it means you've made it. So just relax.
Yeah, great job.
Yeah, if you're worthy of that sort of attention then, gosh nice job, you made it happen. You're worthy of us actually putting a lens on you because there's so many other things that we don't put a lens on.
It was different so the second year was in San Francisco and it was, by my recall, it was... Total adoration, everybody and sort of got over those things and again I feel like I have one toe, little pinky toe in your world but also in the tech world now and just total adoration and I think all of you all were lined up and I just remember it being very funny, the cast was insanely funny.
I got to meet a handful of you, but I didn't meet you.
I would've remembered.
Yeah I know, I would have remembered, because the hallway was like, ahhh. What's the difference between year one and year two and year two to maybe now?
Yeah I think the first year, I remember watching the first episode and cuz when you're filming it, especially the first season, you don't get to see the final product and like there's so much that's done in the Edit, too. And I remember watching the first episode being like, oh that's what we're doing? Okay cool, cool.
I can do this more.
Yeah, yeah, it's because you have no idea really this world that they were creating and the original pilot that I had auditioned for, if you had read that script versus what actually was the end product, completely different show. it changed so much from when we shot the pilot to when it actually got picked up and then we went back and actually we shot some scenes and then they changed some characters and like story lines. And yeah, a lot of my friends that auditioned for the show originally thought it was a drama. That's how different it was.
Yeah, which is insane to me now because the show is obviously so fucking hilarious.
But that original pilot, I remember reading it and it was not funny, but I knew Mike Judge and I knew his work and I knew HBO. I was like, oh I guess I should audition for this, but even my character Monica, she originally was like, sexy seductress, you didn't know if she was like good or bad, what were her intentions? And they can obviously completely change that but I'm still surprised I booked it because I'm not really sure I, actually when I auditioned for it was, you know, I was wearing like the high heels and the skirt and the shirt and everything and I walked into the audition and within two steps had tripped over a cable like on my heels and was like, well I'm not booking this like because I'm just so not that woman. But they, yeah, they quickly changed her to the Monica that is now.
Maybe in part because of you.
Maybe, maybe they just loved my heart.
I'm a big fan of Mike Judge's.
Good guy to work with?
He's amazing. If you didn't know what he looked like, if you didn't know his work, if you just met him on the street you would have no idea he's had the success that he's had. He does not carry himself at all in that way. In fact, I remember one year, I think it was the second season and he got nominated for directing, for an Emmy and so I emailed him that morning being like--
Pretty soon after he had been announced and I was like, oh, my God, congratulations, like nominated for an Emmy for directing. (laughs) He emailed me back and he was like, oh really? Like most people like they, on the day of announcing they're like on their computers--
Skowering the media.
Yeah, waiting for it. He had, like it wasn't even on his radar. And that is just so indicative of the kind of person he is. He's so down to earth so... And then just really fucking smart obviously.
Yeah, so good at his job.
And really funny.
So good at his job.
what's that look like? Is it as funny as I would guess it would be?
It's insanity. I mean when you get all of those, a lot of my scenes are either with Suzanne or with Thomas who plays Richard and that's a bit more of a tame set, but when we had the scenes with like all the boys and me and like the hacker house, it's--
Those are hilarious.
Oh, my God. It's just fucking chaos in the best way, I mean. And we have such a good dynamic, all the guys and me. of I'm one of the, hello. (laughing) I'm, oh, bye. (laughing)
Don't they know this is Howard Hughes' office?
Excuse me. But yeah, we have such dirty sense of humor, so a lot of what we, I mean the videos we text each other and stuff from like, oh it's a show inappropriate like if people saw the terrible videos we're sending each other, it's a ridiculously hilarious group there. I mean I am constantly pinching myself that that's my job, is showing up to that set because they're just so fucking funny,
It's a beautiful show. Speed round.
Speed round, oh God, I'm terrible at these.
Okay should I go slow, should I talk slow? What's going to help you?
I just have to pace myself.
Okay well, speeeeed roooooound.
I may take a beat before I answer.
Okay, take a beat. Something that people who don't know about you but would be surprised if they did?
Okay, excuse me. I have a tattoo. On my wrist of a freckle that is in fact a tattoo. Yep, that little brown dot.
Yeah it's a big one.
Badass, okay? my friend--
Who inked that for you? Is that some famous--
I paid $150 for that. (laughing) Cause they have to use like a new needle, but my friend she was, I was getting my ear pierced right there and I came back out of the piercing room and my friend was getting this feather tattooed on her arm. She's like, you have to get one. And she didn't research the tattoo artist, she just did it and long story short, there was no detail and it was like she had a dick on her arm. Like complete with like fucking, like shaded and--
I was just like, well that doesn't look like a feather. She's like, you have to get a tattoo.
Matt's embarrassed, look, Matt's turning red. Our camera guy. (laughing)
Yes, she had a dick on her arm and she's like, you have to get a tattoo and I was just like, I'm not fucking getting any tattoo from this girl. So I got a freckle tattoo. So that's one interesting fact about me that most people don't know.
Yeah, it's subtle.
And badass when you see that you're like, that girl is--
Do you often wear sleeveless dresses and shirts to show it off?
Yeah and sometime you know, and sometimes, like for work, you have to cover it up.
Yeah. A lot of acting--
Cause it's distracting. Yeah like, Monica obviously wouldn't have a tattoo so that's covered up.
By a professional esthetician?
I get it. Okay, is that enough time in between them for you to get recharged now?
Yeah, I'm ready.
Okay, good, good. Thing two. Something that if you weren't right here where, and you could be teleported anywhere, where would you want to go?
Oh, my God. I've recently become obsessed with Iceland. Are we talking about place or time?
Yeah, no, Iceland, I want to go there.
Real bad, you've been? Obviously you've been. You've been everywhere.
Yeah, it's pretty, it's so--
He's a jet setter.
Look at you, you're just working me.
He's always late for his flights, bu thank God he has that fast pass.
Hey, how about the flight to get down here?
We all know. We saw the Instagram story.
Was I not the last person on an airplane?
Your flight was leaving in 17 minutes and you are still in your car-- And then the next story, you're like, I made it. And I was like, how the fuck?
That's actually, these times are true. It was four minutes, check this out.
Oh, my God.
And it's from curb and it also dropped me off to gate.
Yes, there was not a single human in line. I sprinted and I have clear so it's like two fingers-- So he's clear.
Yep, and they said okay, you're clear and there was not a person in line, I set my backpack on the deal and then I was at the farthest gate away you could possibly be in Seattle, 814. Not the one we have to write a trolley, fortunately. I sprinted the whole way, half way there I was like, this is really useless. What am i doing?
And I made it.
I'm so jealous I think men can get away with just a carry-on.
I'm allergic to everything that touches me and so I literally have to bring a towel to dry my face with, because I will have an allergic reaction to the hotel--
To the soap? Oh my gosh.
No, it's the bleach. I learned I'm allergic to bleach. It's a thing. I have to bring my own champagne.
Your shirt is very white though.
Yeah, I washed it with Honest Company.
Mm, plugged that.
Just plugged them in.
Plug it, making hundreds.
I'm not allergic to Honest Company. It's one of the only detergents, so there. Is there a single camera pointed at me right now?
Three. I'm like looking into the lens, I'm like, they're all pointed at you. (laughing)
All right, so Iceland.
I can tell you that it's amazing.
But I want to know why? Why Iceland?
Just because it's beautiful?
Oh, my God, it just looks like a fucking fairy tale. It looks like no other place on earth. And it just looks like you're just surrounded by fucking nature and--
And the people seem really cool and it just seems, yeah like a fairy tale.
Can I give you a tip?
Tip number two. Don't eat the shark.
Oh shark! You ate shark?
The national dish is a... What is it called when it's not pickled? Is it pickled? What's it called?
Pickled, yeah, it's gnarly. I think it's a pickled shark.
Is it fermented?
Fermented, yes, thank you. Fermented, pickling is fermenting. So there you go. I was mostly there. Because every local will say, not every local but some of the ones, our producer, in this case, like you have to have this fermented shark. Totally not worth it.
It sounds disgusting.
And you think, I like to be open. I eat everything. I've eaten pigs anus in Hong Kong. I don't recommend that either. Chewy--
That's fucking disgusting.
Chewy. (laughing) I have a visual.
I put some hot sauce on it.
Oh, my God.
It was on a show actually, too. I'll save you that one. Don't look that up because--
I'm actually picturing like--
Yeah, don't, oh come on. It's like--
Are they actually the shape of the anus? Like they didn't even chop it up.
It's like squid. (laughing) It's like calamari, except it wasn't deep fried. (laughing) If you're listening to this on the audio version, you should see Amanda's face, it's amazing. But this is not meant to be the topic of this discussion. It's don't eat the shark.
Yeah. I will not eat a shark.
Even when they suggest and I like to be open, it's just not worth it. It doesn't taste good and the people actually laugh when they're done feeding it to you. So you realize it's actually them just like feeding you the grossest thing in their country so that you could say you did it and everybody falls for it. I wouldn't recommend it.
Yeah I'm not gonna fall for that.
But enjoy the waterfalls and the ice bergs and the beautiful straight roads and the mountains and take a ferry, too, if you can actually. They've got some cook ferry's.
No shark and the ferry.
No shark and take the ferry. Okay, that was question number two. Not rapid-fire at all. if you liked our quick I asked you a question and I talked for 10 minutes because you put it back on me. You're very tricky.
Sneaky, sneaky. The thing that you love to eat that nobody knows?
Like, mm, I'm at a grocery store. I'm going to go home, watch some shows or hang out with my dog, you have a dog.
I, oh, my God, I'm such a boring eater.
Yeah because are you allergic to a lot of stuff?
I'm not actually allergic to a lot of foods but I really, I'm such a classic actress in the sense that--
Gum for breakfast.
Yeah, gum and cigarettes. No, I really do love eating clean. Like I actually like--
It feels good, yeah.
That's what I was trying to get at. Is there anything that's not a thing that?
I know and I'm trying to think, like what is my big like cheat meal and it's just like, oh, I'll have half my boyfriends fries. lIke scandalous. (laughing) But there isn't like--
There's something good about eating clean, right? It feels good.
Yeah, honestly, I know it's so cliche, but I really do feel so much better when I'm eating clean and like I said, I'm really into like fitness and I do, you just feel so much better when you're eating clean.
Taking care of yourself. Oh I like that.
And because I've been doing it for so long it's a habit and it doesn't feel like I'm depriving myself or that like there's foods, like oh man, because I also will allow myself to eat like--
Sure it's a birthday, here have some birthday cake.
Yeah, exactly, like you know there's that balance but I do prefer eating clean. And I can't think of something--
That's good see what that allowed me to get to was habits, which now, so what are some other habits that people have sort of maybe, what's a weird habit, what's a couple normal habits.
Talk to me about your morning.
I love morning routines. there's that website, mymorningroutine.com and I love reading people's morning routines. I can't stand people who like, you can read some of them though, you're like, you're fucking lying like you don't do like all of this stuff every single morning.
That's 12 hours worth of stuff.
Yeah, yeah I know like you're like and then a 6:00 am and I've done like fucking things.
I'm like bullshit. But I do love reading about people's morning routines. I have recently gotten into the... Is it called the 5 minute day or five minute journal, with the three things you're grateful for, for that day and like your affirmation for the day and then at the end of the night what your... That has been like, I just started that January first and that I've seen you can actually feel the difference.
Profound, isn't it?
Yeah just reflecting on the day and putting intention into the day and it makes me, you know, we all have our things that we need to work on but you can so quickly just kind of push them to the side and just putting focus on them I've noticed such a difference. I'm also big into like morning pages. I love a journal. Like most mornings just stream of conscience.
If you don't know what that is look up morning pages, I think it's from the artist's way.
Julia Cameron, the artists way, yeah. Which I, well I got to week 10. I didn't finish it. I should probably like do that one day.
Go back, go back.
But, so equally profound?
Yeah, yeah, it helps me. I'm very much in my head and so it kind of helps me get out of my head and I'm a very kind of, sometimes emotionally reactive person, an actor, what? And so it helps me. Some mornings I'll wake up already in a mood and it helps me kind of figure out where's that mood coming from and like what's actually, because sometimes it's just the stupidest shit like you're caring you know the weight of like a movie you watched last night that like fucked with your head and then, but you wake up in a bad way like why am I in a bad mood and you have this cloud and then you write it out and you realize like, oh it was just that and then forget about it. But those are like the two things that I do, like almost every morning and I workout in the morning. I have to like work out like within the first, like you know, have breakfast but, straight to the gym.
If I can't work out at night.
Me too, the same.
I probably worked out like five times at night in my entire life and it feels so weird, it's like writing with your left hand you're like, what the fuck am I doing? Why am I here?
But you don't wanna, you said you made fun, or not made fun of, you highlighted cardio as something that you're sort of moving away from.
Mm-hmm. I mean, I still do it because I think there's still benefits, but I really have fallen in love with like strength training and weight training. I did a movie, God, it's almost been, two years, I guess a year and a half ago, where I was playing a female wrestler. And so--
And so for that, yeah.
Do you mean as in like big-time wrestler or like trying to kick someone's ass wrestle?
No, like she--
Like Ronda Rousey sort of--
Yeah, yeah, like she was--
MMA kind of shit.
I did my own stunts.
But so preparing for that, I had to do a lot of weight training and that's when I really fell in love with it and saw the benefits and just, I felt so much better because, I mean, I had crazy back problems and once I started strengthening my core and doing the weight training, all of that went away. Because I think I didn't have the support to like hold my long lanky body up. But I think, you know, obviously so many women, I was one of them, thought you know I don't want to lift weights because I don't get big and bulky. And I learned after doing like, I did insane weight train trying to put on this muscle mass and yes you can put on muscles, but it's fucking hard so like for women who are terrified that like by lifting weights they're going to get big and bulky, it's like you'll know if you're pushing yourself to that place because you like can't like you can't lift the weight. It's like you have to be working with the trainer to be doing that much and it's like it, I don't know, my whole body shape has changed since I've started doing that and in a positive way.
But I think I'm just always telling women I'm like pick up weights, pick up weights.
All right so, I'm gonna let you off the hook there. There's a couple but it's just a way for me to get into a couple of things that are specifically about you. But we've tapped into this three or four times, and it's been, women. You're clearly a massive advocate.
I'm a woman.
Yeah, but I'm so inspired by the rise of the feminine, it's been a male, masculine culture for far too long and I'm seeking to learn as much as I can about it through conversations with you and others. Do you have a point of view on that? I mean, I know it's very vague but like you clearly you have you're working with women, young girls after school trying to teach them about self-confidence, maybe you can reflect a little bit on that or some other women's issues--
Feminism, that you're leaning into.
I mean, I think it's such an exciting time for women. I mean we have so much work still left to do but I think that--
As a culture?
Yeah, absolutely. And but I do think because of the internet this is being one of the positives that there's so many more ways to spread that message, to talk about it, and it was something growing up I was completely unaware of. I did not realize that there was this inequality and that even as I started working in the industry I didn't realize that I was getting paid less and then I started dating an actor and saw how much he was making and I was like Fuck you.
Wait a minute, what's going on?
We're at the exact same level and why the fuck are you getting paid that much? But you know, I also, when I was in high school, you know, the role models that were out there, I mean I was a fan of Brittney, but I didn't identify with her, you know the whole like sexy thing and that was what society told me that that's how I should value myself is based off of my like my sexual power and everything. And I remember when Avril Lavigne came out on the scene and I was like, what? I could wear Dickey pants and a tie and like wear like a lot of like black makeup. And I remember that having such huge impact on me. because I did feel so uncomfortable in my own skin in high school because I felt like I needed to act a certain way, but it wasn't what was natural to me, and that's why I feel so passionate about working with girls in high school, is to show them that there isn't just one way to be even though society's telling you that you have to fit in this mold, fuck that, you can be whatever mold you want to be, and kind of giving girls the confidence to explore that for themselves and figure out for themselves who they want to be. It's something that I definitely have become very passionate about over the years.
I love it, there's a fire in there for sure.
You mentioned Avril, are there other people that you think are crushing it, that you like or that are inspirational to you?
I mean, I'm, like, anyone who's just kind of doing it themselves their own way, and I think there's so many women who are doing that now, which is awesome. There isn't just, because I feel like when I was a kid, for me, it was just Avril, but now, you know, with the Lena Dunhams, and even like the Jennifer Lawrences and the Sophia Amoruso, like, there's just so many, and that's what I love about the internet, you go on Instagram now and I'm like, man, I would have been such a cooler kid, like, spin it around, knowing that I could have skipped all of that. I felt like a sheep in high school, I was just trying to follow the herd and fit in and kind of, you know, quiet my awkwardness, and now I just let my freak flag, freak, flag, fly. Say that fast.
It's a hard one.
I'm not gonna, because I just, frag, freg, frag. Yeah, I identify with that. In high school, I was actually wildly creative in my head, and as a human, I felt it in my body, and yet, being creative was very weird. I was from suburbs.
Did you struggle with, because you're, you're an attractive human being.
Were you, and I assume you were attractive in high school. Did you struggle with, kind of, how people saw you on the outside versus how you felt on the inside?
It was less about my physical appearance, because I didn't really, I wasn't cognizant of that, I think.
Maybe it's a woman thing.
Yeah, I think it's a woman thing, but I think I also had friends that were much handsomer, so the spotlight would always be on them or that. The way that I processed it was more about the culture, like, what is, what fits in, because that's the thing that I need to do. And being an artist or creative was not--
Well, and that for a male.
Yeah, for a male, it's like, literally, what's the thing that's, and being the captain of the football team and dating the cheerleader, like, that was the thing that was expected, and so I'm like, great, I'm gonna do that. And fortunately, I was a good athlete, so I could, I just picked that up. And it was so, it was painful to have said, I was really good with that for a long time, and then as a young adult, specifically when I was sort of helping myself understand who I was as we, you know, loss of innocence and all that stuff, it's just like, wow, I was really pretending. Like, it's fine, I recovered, but that's a thing, I was definitely pretending. I was pretending, and it feels weird to pretend. But you're hitting it now, was that one of the reasons that you're going back to that age for women to help them?
Yeah, because it was, what I struggled with was, I was getting so much male attention because of my outsides and just, like, attention that I wasn't comfortable with, and that I didn't feel like matched how I felt on the inside, because people saw, you know, one thing on the outside, but on the inside I felt weird and awkward, and had a weird sense of humor, but that's not what goes with, like, that on the outside, so I always felt like I wanted to do this, but I had to do this. If that makes sense. For those people listening to the audio, they have no idea what I said.
Yeah. And this and this, we're totally disrespecting you. It's like, have a dance party instead of just sit with your hands quietly folded.
Yeah, exactly. But even when I moved to LA, I remember trying to fit into this idea of what an actress was, I was like, obsessed with the tabloids, and that was when, like, Lauren Conrad had her reality TV show, so that was my introduction to Hollywood, was like, big sunglasses, venti Starbucks cups, oversized purses, and I totally fell into that trap of playing that--
How painful and heartfelt is that to look back on that and just say how fucked up that is?
It's actually, when I look back at photos of myself then, I've almost blacked a lot that out because it's just, it was such a weird time, even the friends that I chose and the lifestyle, that's like, when I was saying I used to smoke, that's when I smoked. I was a vegan who smoked. (laughing) It's like, but they were American Spirit, so they were, like, natural. But such a fucking hypocrite, so I just remember, you know, waking up one day being just like, what the fuck am I doing? Like, that's so not me. I was such a, I was a goody two shoes, like, the fact that I was smoking and just getting fucking wasted and just partying, and that's part of growing up and learning those things, but I look back at that time and just the way I dressed and everything.
But that's one of the reasons that I'm talking about this, because there's no longform programming where you can talk about stuff like this.
No, I've never spoken about this in an interview.
Yeah, I deeply appreciate you going there. That's, at the other end of this conversation is the reality that I'm trying to connect with the folks who are listening and watching, because we've all been there, we're all awkward, we're all trying to just figure it out and get to the next thing and survive. At first, it's survive, before you can even think of thriving, it's surviving, how do you even get through these ages. And it's just a myth that you don't have it, that someone else doesn't have these same problem, so what can we do to talk about it. So that's--
We're all fucked up.
We are, we are. Except for you.
Yes, I am not fucked up. I am so perfect.
You have Trudeau going for you, you've got Canada if it all goes South. What have I not asked you that I should have asked you?
I know it's a loaded question.
Yeah, that's like a huge question. I don't know. You ask great questions, I feel like, like I said, I've talked about things I've never talked about in interviews before, which is so refreshing.
I saw you on Conan and you compared your, the whiteness of your stomach to the whiteness of Conan's stomach.
I'm a pale motherfucker.
But I think he won the paleness contest, didn't he?
He did, but like, if you look at the side by side, it's frighteningly, like, that's super close, and he's a redhead.
Yeah, he's got something on you. He said, they have to put makeup on me so they can see me.
He is so funny, he is so funny. All right, so, umm... What else, what can I ask you?
I don't know, that's such a daunting question.
But there's gotta be something, because basically, this is on the backside of you saying, I've never said those things. And so, you're open, you're saying it like it is.
Yeah, I mean, I try to be an open book. Brene Brown, that's one who, when I was, when I saw her TED Talk, the whole idea of vulnerability, that one hit me hard, and that was very, that's something that I now strive for, but I really identify with everything she was talking about. And her books are just--
The new, yeah, the new feminine energy, that vulnerability as power, she, I consider her a friend, she's been on the show two or three times, and I learned so much in that moment, however many years ago, and that is part of why I'm pulling on this threat trying to have strong women that I open the show with. Not women, oh my god, you're the only woman on the show, but like, just an amazing character that's, as you said, not all the cliche things and is a bunch of these other things. What about, is it the vulnerability piece from Brene?
Yeah, just because for so long I tried to appear as one thing because that's what I thought I was supposed to be, and this idea of that, when you expose, in a safe environment and situation where you feel there's trust and everything, but that you expose those kind of darker things about yourself, that's, I mean--
Shadow self and, yeah.
My god, because I would hide all that stuff from my closest friends the things that I was struggling with. I just always wanted to appear like I had it together, I think, because growing up, to really get into it, my sister had brain surgery when she was six, she had this very rare disease, and so when she was six, she had to have, I mean, for a year, she was in a hospital, and I was three, and so, yet I remember a lot of that time, and because she was in the hospital for so long, I mean, that's a very formative year to miss out on, like school, forming friendships, so really kind of held her back a bit in life. And I, as a result, because things came easy to me, I felt guilty about that. I really tried to kind of, that's where the kind of, making myself less than comes from, but then, also, I saw the joy it gave my parents when I did well at things. And not faulting them, that's my own projection on things, they never did anything, but it's--
There's clearly some tension there, right?
Yeah, exactly, so I realized that people valued when I did well at things, and so I had this addiction to perfectionism because if I failed then people would think I was bad and I wouldn't make people happy. And it really, you know, this is all through a lot of therapy that I realized all this shit. But it really was kind of eye-opening, realizing that I had been hiding the things that I had been struggling with from everyone, and that I was just battling in my head on my own, and once I started opening up to people I really trusted about these things and them being like, oh, my God, me too. Jesus Christ, like, so much healing in just that one conversation, and having such closer relationships with my friends and family as a result of that, I mean, it really changed my life. It sounds dramatic, but it really did, it changed all of my friendships and my relationship with myself, and now I'm kind of addicted to vulnerable conversations. And I just feel like I didn't really hang out with a friend unless we really got into what's going on. (laughing)
I, Brene, thank you for sharing that. If you haven't watched, I have two separate shows with her there.
I've seen them.
Okay, awesome. (laughing)
I am a big fan of hers, and she seemed like she was very seminal in starting that movement, isn't the right word because I don't know if she would categorize it as such, but there's a whole genre of, sort of, vulnerability, the feminine energy and how that can help shape our culture in a positive way, and especially now at this time in our culture, where things are so turbulent, there's never been a better time. So, I'm gonna go circle all the way back now, and as that character, as one of the two female characters on the show, I think you've done a really awesome job. You've impacted that part of, sort of, the feminine energy that's not all those cliche things, and I want to say nice job.
Well, thanks so much.
I'm gonna leave it at that, I'm gonna say, if you are watching this right when it drops or listening to it right when it drops, the series, we don't even know what date it is.
It's either April 23rd or 24th, whatever the Sunday is.
Whatever the Sunday is. I'll give you a short backstory before we wrap up. And I'm leaning to see if, am I in your shot again? Am I in her shot again? (laughing)
Yeah, me too, me too, me too.
I don't remember, I started following you on Twitter, I think I follow most of the cast, and then I realized that you were following me, and I was like, oh my god, that's awesome because this woman is awesome, and at some point we're going to meet. And I don't remember where we started corresponding on Twitter, but I'm super grateful.
I remember where it was, because I'd been watching the 30 Days of Genius, which I was obsessed with, and I watched all of them, and I had tweeted about one of them or maybe just a general tweet about how much I fucking loved the 30 Days of Genius, and then you tweeted me back, and it was like as if, like, Tom Cruise had tweeted at me.
Is this where I jump on the couch? (laughing)
But I remember calling up my boyfriend like, Chase Jarvis just tweeted at me, just freaking out. He's like, who's Chase Jarvis? I'm like, I've told you about him. But, I remember, I totally geeked out over that. And that's what's been so cool the show, I've been able to meet, obviously like, actors are exciting to me, but I've gotten to interact and meet some people in that space that I really, like, really admire, and I feel so fortunate that, I recognize that the show has given me that opportunity and it's such, like, it's been such a gift to me.
Well, you wear it super well.
It's super fun to watch and I'm a huge fan. It's super funny, season four of Silicon Valley, HBO. Amanda, your handle is Amanda C.
Yeah, for Catherine, my middle name, because someone took Amanda Crew, so Amanda C Crew.
Amanda C Crew, and almost like, I DM'd with someone who wasn't following me, and I was like, wait a minute, she was following me two weeks ago, to set up the show, and it bounced because apparently Amanda Crew, whoever has Amanda Crew is not you.
You gotta look for the blue check, yo.
Okay, got it, I know, I'm slow. (laughing)
It's like you're new to tech.
Amanda C Crew on Twitter and all of the stuff, you can follow her, she is fantastic and amazing and fun and engaging, and thank you for being you.
Thanks for having me.
Signing off. There's another show coming up soon. It's probably gonna have someone who's not quite as awesome. Actually, now the person who is gonna watch is like, wait a minute, I'm the next show and I wasn't as awesome as Amanda? Anyways, signing off. I love you people, have a good one. (soft instrumental music)