Make It Til You Make It with Owen Smith
We love you. Everybody. If you can hear me out there in Internet land is your good friend Chase. Welcome. Done up. So the chase drivers live show you on. Creativelive could not be more happy about the guest that I got on the show today Before I reveal his identity, I think actually, there was a full full ball screen picture of him before I started talking on pretending like Nobody knows. Um, it was a great back story to this one. Owen Smith is first and foremost. I identify with him as a comedian, but he's also a well known television writer producer actor. He's written for a serious Siri's is like Black s Survivor's remorse. Um, I've seen him on the are saying, Ah, Hall show Late Night with Stephen Colbert, Conan Russell Simmons presents Def Comedy Jam You get the story. This guy is a freakin legend, and I can't wait. You spend a little bit of time with him today and have you all out there in the Internet along for the ride. My guest today is the one and only the inimitable Mr Owen Sm...
ith in the house blocking buddy. Uh huh. Hey, was happening Have to be. Wow, this is happening. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. On. And you said you just said a wonderful word in, but I always have toe whenever I type that we always have to look it up. Inimitable, inevitable. There you go on. Do use it too often, I think. But it's it's one of my favorites, too, because we all are ones. Ones of a kind and especially you, my friend. Holy smokes. The last 90 days of our relationship has been, um I think fun and different, and I I think it's worth recapping how we ended up where we are, right this minute together. So for definite home, um, you may have seen if you pay attention or subscribe to my YouTube channel. Released a little video because at one point, just like two weeks ago, maybe maybe three weeks ago, the phone just started digging and left and right. And it was like, you're on Joe Rogan right now with Owen Smith Caribbean, and I'm like, this doesn't make sense to me because I'm walking down the street and I haven't recorded anything with these people, so I don't know how I'm on the pink and strange things happen on the Internet, right? It's a creative place. Men right colleagues Nossa, who's running this broadcast right now hands me her phone watching the podcast in your life. And then she's filming me. Watch this thing and a comedian that I really respect and admire is talking to it a podcast, really respect and admire. And they a little bit of shit talking about mostly saying nice things about yours truly. And I'm like, Oh, shit, I think I just don't run the comments there and then, you know, in jumped in the comments and short story too long Already. You really made it happen on Thank you. Yeah. One shell man honored man on earth, I would have Ah, I wish I could have been there. I really wanted me to in person. I, uh, been a fan for a long time. You have, ah, inspired me more than you know. Every time I'm awful. Project. I always try to acquire a new skill. And it was You were doing this 30 days of every day. You were released earlier than noon interview. You did with it? Yes. And I signed up for that. Let me get this guy My email. And I watched every day I bought books. People has, like what? And then I just went into a deep dive of you, man. And, uh, when you posted ah, video of how you shoot those interviews, I was blown away because first it showed me that you pay attention to detail and every little thing matters. And I'm like that. So I'm like, man, and it gave me inspiration to want to shoot more and create more because, uh, every couple of years and put something out and if it doesn't go well, then I just get shy. And I won't do it again for four years and does man. And they said, Who is this guy? Just keeps going. He So it's I love this guy. And so and then I saw that you had sponsorship and all of this, all these things. And he's not in Hollywood. He's making this happen. So I never imagined. But I would be on your on yourself, Uh, is full circle. You put stuff out there, say things and you take action. And, you know, I've always believed this about the world in general on the Internet is a great sort of mirror of that. Sometimes that we're making really making room should happen, right? And, um, so again, I'm super grateful to have you on the show. Our, um our paths are intertwined. The fact that I have been paying attention to this show shows now 11 years old, um, and you were referencing in your conversation with Joe Rogan and used indicated 30 days of genius that you've been paying attention to that for a long time and in a weird world like you are down there in Hollywood with your fancy agent and managers, except we're talking where it gets before the way we were live, and, uh and there's a lot of upside in that world. But there's also a lot of upside in the world that you're talking about in pointing to, which is just like men. You're just doing it. And you didn't have the, you know, the big fancy agent. And and yet there you are in Hollywood consuming non Hollywood content. And so there's to me those air virtual that's a virtual circle of inspiration and positivity like that. We can look at one another from wherever we are. The thing that's not being said is that that that is a construct right, that that's a thing and that the people in Hollywood are Everyone thinks that you all got figured out. You know all the answers and you got your agent and you're on the comedy clubs and Def Jam and Conan and all that stuff. So it's a It's a relief. Thank you for being transparent and vulnerable and sharing that. And I'll say the flip side is like I am inspired is held by the work that you put out there, the quality that level that you're flying at writing. I mean, you've got a lot of stuff going. So mutual admiration society. I want to thank you. Um, also going away. I got, um I just got a tax from NASA is producing this show that she could try and drag in that little video. Just the intro, maybe one. Great. We'll see if I'm right now. That's okay doing this and everyone's in their own homes right now trying to figure it out. We're all 2000 miles apart, but, uh, way and bring in that video. If that works at all. I think his name is Chase Jarvis in the narrow. Hey, check this shit. I love way. Nothing we did we owe me on the show world like cost. Thank you. Uh, taking encouragement would be coming. But I think this guy that this is show notebooks thing I've been working on. And it's a cool thing that I've been I was afraid to put out. I didn't know and and Joe's like, Oh, man, that's the coolest thing I've seen you doing, man, I could have happened with that. He's like, Well, I got scared of my narration going so far. It's okay, right? So I got scared, and that's great is great. I don't know if I should put this out or not. But then there's this one clown on the Internet, and I have been watching him for a long time, and he just he's dumb as a box of rocks. But he is willing to put anything out there. And if someone like I'm watching this guy, he's I mean, he's a chump, but he puts it out there, and you could see him and Joan laughing about me being jumped and but just He's willing to throw it to the wall and see what sticks. And that's what I do like him for that. He's an okay guy, but he's putting stuff out there. But you fired me, too. Think twice about this notebook thing and say, you know what? I'm going to give it a shot. They write some code, says I'm gonna give it a shot. And so a little bit of tribute to chase Jarvis here, but no books is gonna happen, and it's gonna be big. And I'm gonna put on YouTube and just, like, good go put on YouTube. Uh, that's exactly how with, uh, got to get you to do a d are down here. Yeah, man, it was Ah. I mean, it was something about that. The whole idea came about when, um, my my wife was spring cleaning. Uh, to be means throw away all my stuff and, uh, see what you want. Oh, like she wants to know when my I have downstairs have all these old comedy No books and tapes. And and she was like, You don't need this stuff ago. Oh, yes, I do. What you talking about? It going through the notebooks showing I still you know, and I started reading some stuff. Oh, this is funny And I started rediscovering things that I I didn't do or jokes that I used to tell and and I was able to talk my wife and letting me keep this stuff, and it was like it was a big deal to me. I was like, I felt like at that moment I knew a lot of my peers had the same experience because I'm not a hoarder by any sense of the word, but I will keep. I have kept these notebooks with me for years, and when I started asking my friends, I mean, you got your own noble still. Yeah, and I started saying, Hey, would you do interview immediately? Everyone has just been so like I can't wait to do it and I will go. I went to their homes and I recorded them. And what happened? What ended up happening is it became like this organic conversation, tenancy like their origin story, and you can see you can visually see the comics go back to like 1995 when they wrote that joke. And it's like so vulnerable and they can. It's kind of like looking at where you've come from. Then what I got most of the due to is to perform those jokes on stage in front of a live audience. So it gives. It gave the audience a different company experience. The artists, they they're not burning new material. But they were like revisiting. You know who they were. And it's just it's just an amazing experience for anybody who loves Kamini or for any creative. And so I was really excited about it, and then when we took it around, we got some interest. But it's this thing where I wanted I wanted to talk to. I'm affected by a bunch of different comedians from a bunch of different like we all aspire to do. The same thing made people laugh. We all use different instruments. We all use different ways of getting there and so I didn't want to insert networks, only use a certain type of comic and I've been influenced by so many different types of comedians. So I really wanted to be able to to show all of their processes. So I knew a media as like I got to take this to YouTube, but I tried for network play and it just didn't really It didn't really sink sink up. And so then when Joe bought it up again because he did it and I was like, You're right And it took me back to my initial instinct, which was do it on YouTube and then again, if I can, I wanted to add, I would love to know what the formula is to get sponsorship. I yeah, I just want to be ableto, you know, afford to do it. And because it's also like my love letter, the comedy as well, because I I'm always fascinated how we all can get how my tribe, I guess, can get people to laugh. But we all use different ways of getting there, and I was fascinated to see, like how some people, right and with the penmanship is and and some people use their computer now and their methods of doing it. And it just ended just opened up for this great conversation because it's like it's like if you were talking to, you know, another photographer, you know, questions to ask and were to take the conversation that most people wouldn't know annual would also have their respect. So it's just that it's not like I think the show is really great way we finished the trailer doing this pandemic in very proud of it. My son has My son is 3.5 and he's watched it over and over and over again. And, uh, he said he said to her dog shit today, trouble No, I already said is so sweet like, Oh my God, he was like, Talk. She does. He doesn't know that you know that. I think the whole Kingston you can't know Daddy's were getting shot where you can't say that where he goes, why I go with listen se dog Just say dog goes okay, dog. And then he got this little look in his eye for a few beats. Kobani goes shit. E knows what he's doing. He knows what Do you do it? She's got jeans he's got there. They were like it is right now in our wired. If you come again. Yeah. Yes, I'm already in trouble. I know, I know it. Uh, it's been fun. It's a lot of hard work, but I'm excited and hopefully we're planning to drop it on April 16th. Um, going back, I can pull through Well, it on my drunk, all the episodes that once we just have people who used to consuming things or space it out. But April is the date is gonna be on Smith TV May and you guys can check it out. And if you go to text Owen dot com, I send, I'll send you will send you an episode early before everybody else. That would be amazing press. That's not super hard, good and awesome. Maybe we can put some of these notes in the, uh It's playing again. Not so I'm watching your video. Um, yeah, I blew me away. When I got that, I Was that what, like way? It reminds me that we're all drawing inspiration from all kinds of sources, right. We're drawing some people who are further along in the development as an artist than others and people who are new to the game and for one reason or another, you did their bold f or they don't know enough. Teoh. You know Teoh be concerned where they're putting out there and the fact that weakened raw inspiration from anywhere from both ends of the spectrum. I love that so much. There's this interconnectedness. There's a humanity, part of it, a professional respect and appreciation. And it's in a weird way for for little blips. The playing field is leveled, and it makes me want to invest the next few minutes in an exploration of your influence. You've said you've been influenced by so many different comedians from all different, um, walks of life. I would I would love to know a little bit more about, you know, you're come up story and where you draw inspiration from and neither individual. Definitely. Yeah, well, I mean, so I was born in the Bahamas, right? And I was raised in Prince George's County, Maryland, in the first time I touched the stage was in. PG County is more affectionately known This PG County. One of the most famous people from there currently is it's Kevin Durant. Dave Chappelle, uh, from near martinlaurence. I mean, they was maybe born in Ohio, but he lived, and we just say D c cause it's easier. But PG County is where, uh, and he says he's from Montgomery, and then you got Martin Lawrence is from PG County. And so the first time I touched the stage was there. And this is like right when comedy was kind of becoming segregated a little bit where they were black rooms. And then there were mainstream rooms. And so the first time I started, uh, was in front of a black room black crowd. So there were so many so many powerful comedians and performers that just stepped into my beginnings that I don't I'm not too certain I'd be able to sell putting them on a platform like notebooks. But their stories are so incredible and so valuable and to be I'm more inspired by what's interesting. Then, um, then then who's high at at the current time? So, um and so then I moved to Chicago. I moved to other Midwest, where I started performing Maurin main rooms at the zanies. And then there was also a black room part, all jokes aside, So there were two different types of comedians who performed in each spot, but they both had this. They just They both gave me so much just as a performer and and it was so funny sitting in a lot of what we do on stage, just talking. But most of what we do is listening. So, like, I'll be sitting in the back of club waiting to go up just watching these other acts. And I've learned so much about other cultures just from listening to comedians talk about their journey, then me, Um then then me being, uh that means just doing all the talking, You know what I mean? So, like, I've learned more about like, I like, you know, my Irish comedian, friends and Italians. I've learned more about all of that stuff just sitting in the back, The company on Comedy Club. So in zanies, I met people like Diana Lime. Oh, rest in peace. And I meant something Amazing comedians. I met Lewis Black. I mean, all those guys in that space that all jokes aside, I met like Corey Holcomb and Dion Cold and Dereck Davis and hoping, And so all of them shaped like how my funny is, you know? So you mentioned early and I want to export wishes for a second, uh, the segregation aspect. There were black rooms and then they were not black. Yeah, and you get back rooms and mainstream rooms. Yeah, a lot of people didn't work both, and I worked both. And so and what happened is a young performer. It is. I had to axe I had for the Black Room and then I had I had act for the black woman didn't have the act with mainstream room and I just got tired of that. And eventually I grew into just having one act. Couldn't I couldn't keep track of, you know what it was, and I bought me closer into finding out who I am and what it is that I want to say. But yet when I first started, I will I be in the back rooms just being a lot more animated and and then I'd be in the in the white rooms. They wouldn't always catch my cultural references, so I would try to my sisters say, mainstream rooms. I would I would try to talk more about, like, pop culture things, and I figured, get out away as you do it. Over the years, I figured out a way there, break away from that and figure out what's interesting about me it and present that so that no matter who you are, you'll find him. But that's that's like a part of the journey, and that's kind of like what we talk about. That's one of the things we talk about it notebooks, because when you first start, you have to make strangers laugh. So whatever you see, you may not realize that you aren't enough. You know what I mean? You make it. What do they like? You know, it's so this is even within even within a I think I just love this thread so much because that is the journey that I don't know, a creator who hasn't been in that journey. Maybe there's a handful of people that, like that, are so either self aware or uh or self obsessed. They can keep all the other noise out. But for many of us, myself included, When I was just leaning from your story is at the beginning, I mean, we're social animals, right? We're creatures we need to fit in, one of like we want to do us. We need to be a part of that. You mentioned tribe earlier. We need, like, have a community and be accepted. And so you're like, What do they want to hear? I want to tell what they want to hear, chameleons and then at some point and for different folks that comes at different times. But it's like a lead weight that slams into your head and says, You had to do you and that's you know, it sounds like that that all of those different influences to me across a variety of of time they talked about comedians that have been in the game for a long, long time. And I'm sure there a Zai mentioned earlier some folks who are just starting out that inspire you, but and also of the different sort of levels of comedy. Like, How long do you figure that took you to find your own voice to go from different, you know? Yeah, that's a great question. What I love about stand up comedy is that you can't cheat it. You cannot seal it up. And so I remember I remember I was I was a feature act. I was middling for a, uh, headlining comedian named Kevin. Not right. He lives in Ah, he may still be based in Chicago, and we put were performing in the U P. The upper peninsula. I believe it was in Michigan and we both drove separate cars like I followed them up there. And, uh, this was I was probably doing comedy for maybe three years, and I was killing. But I was not saying anything like you couldn't remember one thing about my act. You just It was just do just woo. But if you went back to work the next day, you know, I saw this funny comedian. What were you talking about? You know that And so and back in that time, the whole narrative was if you did, you started out. It was a three person show. It would be the emcee than the feature act that in the headliner and the way you got to be headliner is you had to We were told you had to give strong performances in those other slots. So I was just working on giving my strong show. So I was killing in front of cabin and he was doing fine after me. I think he may have is a may struggle, like one show, right? And, uh, but I wasn't a year. You struggling like if I was in New York commonly, Yeah. You can't take this Heat kept, but I wasn't. I wasn't I don't think I was that way. I was. I was a little arrogant in my twenties. I don't believe I was that way, but he did say to me, He goes, how long you've been doing? And I said, I said, like, people. Yes, he goes, You know, it takes, uh, 7 to 10 years to find your voice. And then he just walked away and I was, like, kind of like a And that's how most young comics seven in 70% of our right. He was so right. Yeah. Yeah. And Kevin couldn't have been more all right. He was so right. And it takes to with So if I took me about 12 years, 12 years to become okay and accountable with who I am, And when I talked about years in notebooks, some of them discovered it earlier. And I go Oh, wow. Like and it's so funny. Like how we all get those places, but it just takes. But I was raised like my name's Owen have a safe name, and I mean, I was raised to be safe. So for me, e So for me to to say the things that make my friends laugh organically to be able to say those in front of strangers in a and no guilt sort of way delivering it took me longer to get to that space to go. This really wouldn't want to say And this is gonna make all of us have a good time, as opposed to so But he could have been more right. It takes It takes 10 years to find your voice. I could listen to a comedian and tell how long they've been doing it by their Almost by this subject, you can almost tell by, like, how far? Because then I would I would want to impress Common to have been doing it longer than me. Like I have a great set and they and they wouldn't give it to me. They would say stuff like, um uh, this one comic with him. Me? You're leaving a lot of meat on the bones. I know what he was talking about. I could go deeper, Another common. Always tell me you can go deep enough. That stuff used to frustrate me, man, but I finally know what they're talking about. And now I enjoy the process of doing that and you can see the difference. You know, when you perform now, it's but it takes years, man, and it's and it is always something is always something to work on. It's always another thing. You can get better tightened, sharpen its It's a never ending. It's almost like a living organism. You mean like when we release specials and put them out in the world? That's just a moment in time. If you see me do that material live, it may impact. You weigh more than it did watching it on screen because I believe Jay Leno said, the reason why he's never take the specialist because a little of the magic gives the rule. And another that's true, you know, for for me in particular, if you see me live, that experience will trump far Trump, um, watching videos of me just speak. Being live. It's a live art form, but as comedians, we do learn how to be funny on cameras. Well, it's something you have to burn. When I first started that that took me a long time because I just made people laugh who were in front of me. And then I will watch it back ago to say Funny E. Oh, well, I have to do this. And after that, you know, it's like all these little technical things and you have to get it to a space to wear. You're not thinking of it. And when I watch people who are like, who have it, naturally, I'm like how they got it, You know what I mean? I just or and when I watched people who are still raw but that you see him snapping to it, then fall out of it. I'm just fascinated by the whole thing. And so, yes, so it's it's a stance in your question in a lower away. No, you long it. Yeah, I would honestly say 10 years easily because And what's gonna happen is you're gonna have a great night's great. But then you bump into a node a comic who, maybe encouraging or they may seem like they're not being encouraging. But there, uh, I was since the criticisms and you know what? People like your great cause. You know, you can always take the material a little bit further. You know, you can always take different angles or ways in or it it's a never ending puzzle that I love, uh, trying to figure out and what I what you just told a beautiful story about the way that comics work and think, and it's, ah, 100% applicable to any creative journey. So there, folks at home, where you might not be a comment, but whether you're a photographer, designer and entrepreneur, like anyone who's creating anything, I believe deeply. And I wrote about this in my book created calling it like what you just shared with us is mastery when you have actually mastered something in your 10 years into your thing or whatever. 10,000 hours, whatever the the thing is you, you can see those, like when you see another comic who's like, Oh, just he's dipping in and out of it right there and then or you're someone that when they've achieved it or reached it or they're struggling when you are a master of something, you can like, teleport into their brain and know exactly what's going on. And so people have asked me on my sort of conversations about mastering. And there's a lot of things that haven't mastered. Photography is one of them for you. It's comedy, and that's one of the things that the criteria for being on the show honestly is like. You've mastered something and the question is like, Well, how do you know when you have? And the answer that I give would be curious. To hear your take here is like If you have to ask, you haven't master something, there's literally it's like the Matrix. It just goes, click and then you Can you conceive e sort of the future of the past. You could see it all in three dimensions. I don't know how that resonates with you or not, but it sounded like you were talking. Yes, Oh, yes, yeah, is you all. You also just respect what it is you're trying to master For me. Stand up comedy is one of the most humbling kings, and I wish there was more of a performance aspect of photography, and that was why I thrived in the commercial aspect of photography. Was that the finer Because fine art is your like I could do the woods looking for the perfect shot in You know, you really, you spent six months looking for it. And commercial, there's It's almost like a performance because there's 100 people on set and you're directing an orchestra and and when you look at a performance of a photographer, you're like, Yeah, I don't like he's not very good at that. He's just a photographer. But the performance aspect of comedy is I am in Oh, I'm so inspired by scared Oh, homeless, of trying to put it out there and figuring the you know the journey. But tell me what it's like to do that on stage to discover all this shit in real time with your guts turned inside out. You know, when I wasn't talking about anything, I didn't feel it was almost like I was. I was wasting staged. But when I get up there and I talked about things that are happening and things that are personal to me, and it's it's scary onto phone or true thoughts of feelings that I have your scared if they don't laugh. But not so much what? You've been doing it long enough. You just go OK, I need to work on them or what scares me now more is when they laugh really hard because I'm like, Oh, for really? Like I just said something, you know? I mean, it also, that's we know him in the right space. But I was just like, Oh, man, I don't know how long I want to keep saying this because it's really, really a personal admission. You know, Um and when I talk about how humbling comedy is, it always always did. It reminds you like I remember one time I did star search, right? I'm not. My style does not really lend itself towards competitive comedy and more storyteller, a long winded person in. And, you know, if I was a set up punch line, it would let myself more favorably to, ah, competition style. But I did it. And when I got off and it was life like this, it was live. And they said we hit, like, 25 30 million people. I'm at the airport, um, going to a gig literally the next day and people are coming up to me. I flew to that game. They would really like that real time. I fly to that gig four people showed humility. Yeah, and I had to give them the same. So that gave the 25 million people You know what I mean? But as far as like humility, like, you know, I was because you get on the plane here like 25 million people, the heads getting swollen. You get to that room. How many people can for two people cancelled? I mean, that's how humbling this game is on that level in just in so many regards. And it's like you go through so many emotions, like when you see your peers, you go through a lot of my friends can. They're called and they want to be angry. But then we always go. I always go. But what is it that you're not doing? What is it that you could do more of like vent? Get it out. But that's their journey, man. Like, are you putting the work? Are you putting out tapes? You don't know what they did to get that, and you can't you know, they make for the specific algorithm that you don't you know, it's just you have to be. And so when you start mixing all that other stuff with it. It can get cloudy. But what I'm fascinated about with comedians is ash. We don't miss anything. So if some of my friends are complainers, that's what they do. I'm not I I've never I've never been able to hold an audience for it. Uh, but some of our friends, they could have just had the greatest thing. And then they find out one thing, and I kind of love that about him cause I go. Hey, you still you like you got You got all this, but, uh, so I'm just fascinated by So if so many different types of people that come into this and they all have a different they have, I can't say that I keep saying going back to ancient, but they play a different instrument. And but the but the most interesting people are the people who are, like, uniquely themselves to me, you know? And then what are they doing with it? Is like the other part, right? Um, some people run from it because there's nothing about her journey, the journey. There's the journey of, like, figuring out who you are, and you watch someone do that and then there's almost, like a second arc of when you figure okay, You feel right now you were going to do with it. That's a whole separate journey. Almost definitely. And some people I talked to 22 about some commenters. You'll watch their act when it still trying to figure it out. You go. The act is okay. But when you talk to him offstage, you go. Why aren't you talking about that? Yeah, yes. And so it's just it's just the never ending, you know, journey in life and life experiences and all these things. It just keeps giving us more. And the other thing, too, is that everything that we think of That's funny. It may not fit in the space of stand up. It may be a funding your film, What may be a funny Maybe it maybe funniest as a sketch. What may be funny. So that's also interesting trying to figure out where do you put your you know, where do you put your funny like? Um, yeah, some things I've done, I go, Oh, man, that's gonna be more impactful in a visual medium if people can can see it, You know, um, and so that that's also that's like a new thing that I'm I'm discovering. Now where you go? Uh, this is funny. Is it as a bit? But, man, if I This was a this was a sitcom ever So whoa, look out. You know, I mean, so yeah, it kind of it kind of moves that way too. I, um this makes me want to redirect the conversation to what we opened with which we were talking about your Hollywood No grounding. And that's where all the comedy clubs and agency managers and, um, made me wanna share. Somebody think maybe ever shared this, but, um, and it has a lot to do with, like, finding your own way and which is what I feel like we've been talking about, you know, discovering who you are as a creator and that 10 year journey. Um, I also about e I would say in the two thousands 5678 maybe 89 10. Um, I for some, a number of reasons got pulled into the, um, William Morris endeavor. See a and super high pound agent, folks. And that was I was making the case of Hey, the next sort of ground of celebrity in the world is going to be the people who have never heard of because the Internet's gonna give you direct access into them And what the Hollywood machine is really good at manufacturing these people. But, you know, watch out because there's a whole universe and I think that was a slightly intoxicating idea to agents and talent managers and all that stuff, and we saw the early beginnings of it. But then what? What my my understanding what Hollywood is like. Okay, great. They just went well, a lot higher up on the ladder. And they said, like the Internet is now the proving ground and you're gonna get a late night special. You're going to get all these other things once you've, you know, figured it out there. So I think Hollywood response responded accurately. But I'm gonna you know, the last piece of my story here is when I was in that world, honestly and I had, you know, I bounced around a little, but I experienced each of those agencies or private turned down 10 shows. MTV, Bravo, VH one and I looked at the foundations and mechanics of in what you had to give up. Get your own show, where to get your photography special. And And it was a shit sandwich, Honest shit sandwich. The people looked at me like they were given me like they were Ben and over I was in a deep hole and they were handed me a rope like you better grab this causes the last broke that's coming along. And I'm like, That is the shittiest Europe of everything. I wouldn't put my hands on that rope. Yeah, this that And I actually found that system didn't deliver at all. And I was hustling way more revenue, more bigger opportunities than any of these high flying agents or managers were getting me. And I was like, So you want me to pay it X percent from what? What are you doing for me? And so I ended up running away, and I think now we're at a world where again I think Hollywood basically just ratchet itself up. And now we got it. We really are in a world where there's a ladder to climb and and I wanted This is my perception. So now it's sort of re oriented and I think it's better. But to your point into Joe Rogan's point, which brought all of us together here today, is like doing notebooks on YouTube, putting out content on a regular basis, whether this show is content or whatever, like just doing shit instead of not doing shitting, waiting for it to happen. Am I alone in this thought? Do you share it? And what would you say about that little rant that I just Well, it's a lot. It's a lot of impact. I will look, I'll start with the lasting and give them work backwards as's faras doing shit. I could not agree with you Mawr and I was just telling my wife that had I not done Joe Rogan's interview, I would not be here right now, right? And had I and I was just being honest about what influenced me and why I was so bummed about it, not doing what I knew it could do. And when I literally got on my phone, I get on instagram. But I was like, What? I'm who? What? When I saw that message, I was like, It's like these constant reminders like, Hey man, keep doing you know, like is this is so like, well, I'm about it to a podcast. We'll put that out and see what happens and just keep moving forward. That's very important. Um, and I think if you I and I think it's almost about what's your intention behind doing a shit, right? So because the reason why I haven't been like flooding Instagram with sketches and things of that nature is that I didn't really have a purpose for doing it, and I didn't because my goal is I want to have an audience so I can come to Seattle and Hitch all up. Hey, I'm performing here and you guys come. So is a shameless plug. Go to text on one dot com, you know, do some some comedy of mine and you can judge for yourself. See if you want to mess with me. But then and that's all. That's really all I'm gonna do. So I do everything I'm doing notebooks and all of these things for the sole reason, so that I can go out a couple of times a year and perform in front of an audience that I can sell hard tickets and fill a room and, uh, and had that expand to go from a club to, uh, theaters, you know, theaters to arenas. And I'm good. I don't need stadiums, and I want to be able to tell stories and just be funny and speak to a crowd, and so that's that. That's my purpose. But when? Because I would think of sketches and things and it takes a lot of time. Why am I doing this, like, are people like connecting this with the stand up? Is it two separate things? And it s so I didn't I struggle with that for a minute, but then once I started going, okay, my purpose is I wanted I want to do stand up because Joe would always Joe Rogan would always be in my ear like you. So funny. You should be making this. You should be going out. And he kept doing it. Kind of like it because I was starting to let that dream go away because I wasn't getting the B specials on the platforms that people were watching and sounds like I don't know if I'm ever gonna be able to do that. And so then I went on Joe's. So I did that. I got the text, only dot com. I set it up, went on there, and I just try Just tried it. And Joseph is gonna break your phone, and it did. Man, I got so many contacts is ridiculous. Um, but the then ended up being able to speak to the head of the company. Ryan Leslie who, um, created super phone that I'm using. He gave me some tidbits how he uses it. It's just it's just been amazing all from me deciding to do something right instead of not doing something. And I just I just checks it those guys because I wanted to set up something for for this and they help me do that. I may have done it wrong. So be patient something taking it out. But yeah, but, uh and so in in this Hey, that's awesome. Yes. Okay, yes, my thinking. That's perfect. So I'm gonna let you know when I'm up there and we could fill a room up there and have a good time, and that's really all I want to do. And so already will get together with all the love it over. We're gonna get? Yes, not wait. I cannot wait, man. And then as faras, the Hollywood is two fold. Right. Um, I feel like when you get with the big agency on agent or what have you It helps your confidence. They, um I'm speaking to speak to it from the creative standpoint for you. You all of a sudden you get your It's like relationships, right? So you started getting a pipeline of having meetings with other people in in positions to green light. What have you write? It is I used to work the college market a lot. And in the college market, there's a new person in charge every 2 to 4 years. That's kind of like how it is here. But all you need is like two or three allies really are fan of your whatever it is you do and are pushing for you, and you never know where they're going to end up. So in getting with those people, you get to meet all these folks and people. They start watching you and you forget about things of that nature. So when I sold my first Siri's to ABC, the people in the room who are the buyers were people that I had done work with years before. So it was a warm room of the OU all over here. So it was one of those things. So they bought my show in the room, which was a tremendous thing for for how this town works, right? It was a big deal. In that space. We write the show. It was a tough experience, but it was a experience. Always wanted to see what it was like for me. I'm a person like I want to know. Like what? Like, what is it? And is there a way I can make it more efficient? Like what? What? All these? Why don't these people have these jobs? What do they do? What they and I'm curious about just all of that before I just write it off. So I had that experience and it was hard, but it was, but I got to, but I got to meet some great people. I met a I got the part of me with a guy named solid being Patterson, who was incredible. And I I look forward to doing work with him in the future. So this is it is like It's a weird city sandwich, right? But But there's some parts of it. There are parts of it that you keep causes other people eating that shit, which so? So those people like they kind of go, you go. All right. What? We're gonna do something together. You start to carve out your world where, you know, you guys kind of have the same value system work ethic, but am and is tough and the same goes with representation in all of that and in the It's trick is really tricky. But my mind said has been like I'm a comedian first. So all this other stuff is a bonus. Like if I get hired to write and show Great. If I don't okay, like I'm literally not. That's not my That's not my life, you know, that doesn't define me, but I'm honored to be there, and I'm I can't believe cause I used to watch so much TV, so I can't believe I get an opportunity to create. It's like the weirdest thing like my wife told my son the other day. Don't watch too much TV. I go. It worked out for me like watch TV man will pay you back. Uh, TV, we all right? You know, so you know, but But I do have friends who all they wanted to do is be a writer. So when when I'm with them, they're passing for it. It rubs off for me, and I get it. But again, at my core, I'm a stand up. So if I got fired from the show when that ax back, my alright I talk about it'll stay just funny, like it's Ah, it's not. I don't said I get It's over. Um but yeah, it's it's faras I your age and stuff. If it's tricky, man, it's so it's so tricky. And at the end of the day, you just start doing the math. You go. Do I need you? Yeah, Do I do I want to be fair? Like I'm actually I think it's really improved a lot in the last file called five years. Yeah, we'll see referencing toe like, seven or eight years ago when they still thought they were the shit and they were, like, way behind what was happening. Yeah. Yeah, I'm gonna get you. I'm sorry. I'm getting paid here one second okay. They were just They felt like a different Anna Kristic. Like they were living on the different plan in the s what was going. But now I think that they they've corrected. And I do think that those air services that are valuable but to me the most, like what I want to put a bow around I'm gonna hug onto Is that that you just described the Who are you at your core and what makes you sing like and not just literally seem like you're like, man, I'm just un content and happy. I want to be able to provide for myself and my family making comedy is and whether four people show up or 25 million Or, you know, if I can do this every night, right gonna do one night a week or the closest thing that can get to being on a stage is is, you know, doing it on video first. Then I'm willing to do all those things. And anything else is extra writing great all the stuff. And to me, that is just like that is around who you know you are. And when you use also like it references what we're talking about earlier with that 10,000 hours and you can tell someone who settled into, like, I'm good. Well, whatever works out, it doesn't work out on this show where these other things like, I know who I am and you can have preferences. You she works out, but it just doesn't. Your your identity is not crushed into spaghetti. I want to take just a second because I have been doing a very bad job at letting you and the Internet know that we're watching. And there are people from New Zealand, from Toronto, from Canada, from Tampa, Florida from more city. Um uh, Just scanning here. Italy. Wow. Oh, please. You'll be safe. Yeah, in Minnesota again. I'm doing very Boston, Norway, Oslo. I'm just going about But just every once in a while I forget that there are people from all over the world, Bank it and that. Amazing. Thank you. Um, a couple of comments in particular stand out to me. One is just this on understanding, and I lost it because there's so damn many. But I'll find it in a second or not. So maybe you could service its and we just that all of our journeys are individual, but the same you just describe around copies virtually exactly my journey as a photographer. And I I hope that that is a uniting thing about that creative spirit In all, the Foreman says is a great talk. I'm learning from all different career paths. We're all different and very similar. Struggles to quote make it. It's a similar journey for every creative, in my opinion. So what you're saying is sticking, Um, hey, not so you can shoot up a couple more questions to me. I'll pay attention and they just flash on the screen too fast. So I'm gonna go hand the back Mike back to you for a second own. And I would like you to tell me a story about your biggest bomb on stage because you're fighting like we all. You know, failing or even temporary failing is scary and painful, but it I look at stand up comics and I'm like, Oh, shit, you're on front, all these people and you're trying to figure it out. And it's not working like you just drive that for me. Is that too painful? Yeah, I got my bum so many times I can tell you it's like pick what? Dio Um I'll tell you. I'll tell you to write one that I had in a, uh, urban room and one that I had in a mainstream room. Uh, okay, so I did everyone first there was a Rome in the suburb of Chicago. And here's the thing. I blocked this stuff out and I think that's like how you keep going. So I don't I don't remember. Something will remember someone of doing shit. If this is too painful, you could No, no, it's not like going on the morning show is not I'm not very fine, but no, I'm saying a Sfar like remembering details and like the I want to say the main this place was called KJ riddles, but I'm not 100% sure. And when? Sunday night, Uh, I think the rate used to host it. It was It was like a black show. But it was like younger, uh, maybe like 18 like just like everybody. Like the music is like, Is this really hype? At the time, I was probably like 28 27 20 maybe 29 and it was younger and it was blue collar right? And when I was when I stepped on stage back then, I just smelled like college. I looked like I think I wore slacks. I would tuck my shirt in. So just off my look, general, I'm getting booed like a way. What I have to say And I went on stage and I think I was doing my I was doing my act and I could feel. And when you're not getting energy back, it can mess up your flow back then. So I was very dependent on the audience accepting me because I could kind of I could come dive into that acceptance and find my way through, and I'm It was just one person boom, another boot. Then they all just collectively just started, bore me and I got so mad. But I didn't leave. That's his stake or stage. I say. Those day I took the boot, I took the boot and I think the host was coming back. Naman let him move and I took it back to P G County. I was just like, who's booing? I started looking at who was booing and I broke whatever it was I thought I was doing And I went out a few people like I was back on the corner, and then they were like, Oh, shit, there's no. And I ended up getting him back, but it was such an unsatisfactory get back, like, I didn't know if they like. It was just a weird thing. I know the comics that were there that night when I got off stage, they were looking like I've never seen those shit like that. But I took the boot leave and then just got him back, and then I just went home. And but then I was just so like, angry and confused that what can I do that I can't do that act? I can't do it every night. You know me, like I was just like so I was so just frustrated, uh, and then but once. But I had a go like I wanted to go back and win that room. And, um oh, I got another Babou story, too. When I first I thought I went to Notre Dame, right? And how much another Damon Jerome Bettis was there, and, uh, I did stand up Comic I was doing stand up comedy on campus, which was one thing you doing material about dorms? No, it is just a very insular, uh, space. Everybody s so funny. I got asked to do comedy at a nightclub called Kevin's on the Hill. And, uh, and I remember everybody came from no today. Like a Jerome Bettis came on these athletes king and it was a dance club. And in the middle of dancing, somebody take my Are you Are you often like some comedy like No, give enough. Ah, Notre Dame. Uh, would Smith and these these are they call them Townies. They did not on the social space ain't really care about anybody for Notre Dame, but I see Jerome better sitting right in the front and all these people I'm standing on the dance floor with the flickering red, blue and green like this is the worst way to light somebody, ever especially in my complexion, is just like it's looking like. And then everybody like they would dance and making moves on the girls. They would dance, but they didn't want to stop the any jokes. And I didn't. Back then I was mad, clean She was like, Man, I didn't know today. What? Have you ever been in the dorm? And this one? Do that, man? Fuck no. Today I know, I know. And I didn't know I was so new. I didn't really know how to come out of Heckler, so I tried that I tried to extend the olive. He said, Come on, man. Hey, brother. Come on, man. Brothers trying to do something. Now you and I, Jerome, better remember him laughing so hard at me eating it, and then it just I could not get another word. I did that, man. Get off that I thank you. Good night. And everybody's like, Man, we came up here for that. So that was my work. And that scared me away from the stage for, like, nine months. But it kept calling me and I came back. I did, but I did not do stand up for about nine months after that. Then the boo there and then my mainstream booze. When I first came out to Hollywood, I never got booed in the mainstream room. That too polite for that, But I tanked in front of industry Wednesday. They said industry that at the Improv on Wednesdays, and I bought this dumb green shirt I remember was like the silk green shirt Not, but I thought it looked good. I don't know why I went on stage, and, uh, there was no audience. Really was like like, four bitter comics in the front, a big moat and then industry all in the back, like all just sitting on the high tops to site sitting and ah, I go on stage and, man, you could see the sweat think like you stopped bombing like my armpits were getting wet. I was I was sweating out the hits of the dumb green shirt. I just look so stupid. I'm just Yeah, and I started pushing. I started just trying. Teoh have, like, a mental record of like when these bits killed. And I tried to emulate that performance really fast, and it just made it all worse. Just just a blathering thing of sweat. And when I got off stage, Billy Gardell was next. He's on Mike and Molly, and now he's on What's the name of show? Uh huh. I can't think CBS has another. Come on, CBS, um, with Jeannie Ashbery I can think of it. But he was standing Any goes Welcome to Hollywood because I used to work with Billy on the road goes Welcome to Hollywood. He went up and he killed And in that set up And that's when I was like, Oh, because when I first moved here for the 1st 6 months, I didn't feel funny. I was not connecting with the audience. I had to do a gig out of town to get, like, major lesson. Okay, for me, personally, I was pushing too much because I'm 65 So I'm already presence. No. Sure. Yeah, I know. I got I got a 58 tour, so I got a short torso. When I'm 65 I'm up there like, uh, you know, just trying toe, You know, I don't know why, and it just wasn't working. And once I made some adjustments, I started being able to kill them like any kind of environment. I remember one time we were doing Ah, me Aggies was me, Leslie Jones, who is now a big, big star now, Leslie Jones and Leslie was doing the push. Think thing. So she she was in front of me, and she wasn't connected. She added, like all that shit if she cut off, stays mad. And I went on last, I closed it out and I knew I learned from watching Billy. How Toe and the Aggies was not set up for common. It was basically like a sushi dance kind of spot. And it was that people here than a moat in the like a dance lord and people I was like, the weirdest restaurant fucking castle. It was It was weird. And so But I was. But I was able to destroy that room that based on what I watched Billy do when I saw that big mode experience. So Leslie came up to your wouldn't know how to do that, son, You killed that bitch. That's that's when I knew she was gonna be famous because she was She had humility. She was like, Man, hey, like me. But you know, you How'd you do that? And so she became a friend, like, immediately, like, right there, right off their spot. But, uh, yeah, man, I'm married. I could probably write a book on how many times I've eaten. Especially when you when you try to like when you discover who you are and you want to, like, go a little deeper. Sometimes the crime in a What is this? There's so much wisdom and everything you're saying so much wisdom and that I think it's so. That's why I asked the question, Because it's so It's so raw in your face when you bomb is a comic, right? Oh, yeah. Trying to be funny. And if it's not landing, it's just like shit. I just gotta hang up and, yeah, clear us, honest person to change a ticket in the person's like no one is gonna be $200. You like shit. It's just easier to hang up and call again and try and get someone nice. Yeah, bombing is good for you to man, especially. It helps reset you like Okay, maybe. OK, maybe I'm not. That's what I mean by home. You're like, Oh, maybe I'm not. Is, uh yeah, we all go through it, especially when you try to go deeper, get all the meat on the bone. All of that stuff you have to figure, especially in this climate now, to where? There a lot of people like I have one of the one of the most awesome compliments. You know, you try not to pick him up. One time I got off stage comedy store, I was going to my my my car, and, uh, it was a woman. And she goes, Ah, I'm a feminist. And you were so fucking funny. You I loved you. And I was like, OK, like, you know, But she you could tell that she was It was kind of like, I feel like she may have, like, complained about the club before, too. So I was very happy that what I was saying didn't, like, alert her. Oh, we gotta cancel this, you know, I mean, but what? I wasn't even trying to cater to that. I was just talking about my thing, and I'm so I was like, Okay, that's interesting. Thank you. You know, But I was like, who didn't you like and e come And this? Is there something that you can't? You can't? Um, road testing. Something is pure gold. Yes, you're getting feedback. As a creator, you put stuff out there and having a you know, sometimes you put stuff out there and it's crickets and tumbleweed you like? Okay noted. I didn't do enough toe Prepare or build my audience. Or there's all kinds of things that you learn from that. Or if you do put slipping out there and you get a range of feedback, it's like 100 80 degrees and feel like I love it. I hate it and you can talk to you can when you talk to these people face to face or eyeball the eyeball. I don't know if this is your experience, but if I give a talk and I come offstage south by southwest with something, there's 100. People want to talk and you're getting like feedback and different pieces. And you, you, when you're like this to somebody you like, you can watch their pupils like dialing it back, right and then back. Teoh, maybe a meeting a creative life. Like all I think we should do that I'm like No, because I've talked to 10,000 people. These and I know what they want and someone else is. Maybe it's sitting back in a you know, in a chair somewhere in a conference room or not putting it out there, and they're thinking about things. We're doing that from the couch. You can't actually get that kind of feedback from the couch. It's about being in your case in the room or getting feedback. Eyeball, eyeball. There's nothing like it. And you don't get that from sitting back. You have to be forward, right? Dollars. So true. That was one of the things that I felt gave me an an advantage when I did start writing in rooms. Because a lot of people you as a community normal. That's how much we traveled. Like I performed in every state except Montana, right? Like more than once. So I performed on farms. I performed it, whoever every place I've done. And so when I will be in rooms and I would hear someone go, they won't get this in the Midwest. I'm like, yes, they would. And they would be almost offended that you think this is what you want to deliver. They they get it. Like I just came from there, you know? Oh, is there? Yeah, the same act that did hear, Uh, you guys, they got it more like they were just so happy. That and so it is like this weird like where these things come from, Where people go, you know, they wouldn't get it here. No, no, no. They would this just just keep keeping. And so I but I But I had this, like, this. Validation is interior like this clock like, No, that doesn't fly. You know that you actually go more. You. This is I'm hearing this also so present. Everything you say is it's like there's this intuition of this works for me. That doesn't work for me. This is I don't not quite get lamb. I gotta put in more time. And as soon as you know, you know, there's this intuition that is so present in everything you're saying to us today, do you? Is this something you overtly acknowledges is something that's working in the background? Like, how do you How did you learn to trust yourself? Because clearly that is a key asset for you. That's a good question. Uh, you know, you know, I think how I learned to trust myself is by listening other people, like letting other opinion is trump what I initially felt and what messages this into my my gut, You know things and it turns out poorly. And you're like shit. It's like to listen to my gut. Yeah. Yeah. When you do something that someone else says is the right thing, it's against what you believe. You just do that a few times. You, like, almost end of me. Yep. Yeah. And you know what else that came from? Two as far as comedy, right? Like to me, how I know something is funny is a very personal conversation with myself, right? If it organically makes me laugh, then now, my Now, my next task is to figure out how to convey the same emotional feeling to strangers, Like to people who don't already know me and love me and kind of know my You know how I speak. And you know, all that stuff. Like the people who have never met before. How do I convey that to them? Right. So that's kind of like this Ask, But I know it's a funny things. When I was a kid, I used to try to, like, make my mom laugh. My mom would never She's never gave up anything. She just Yeah, tough what she would go. I don't think that's funny. I don't think that. And you get to the point where my mom was like that. Like I knew it was funny, you know? I mean, but But first I'd like, maybe, but then I will go stop showing your jokes out on your mom. But I also knew it. She didn't like it. I was probably in the right space because as a parent, she was looking at it through a different lens, you know? And but But that kind of helped shape me. Like listening to my instinct and then just being in so many situations where you go, Yeah, I should listen to my instincts it and then you just immediately just go. And then we just listen to that, you know? And, um yeah, and then you want to wrap yourself around people who love you, who can tell you a that might not be right. But then so true, that conversation like getting a different creative thing and which I prefer. Yeah, yeah, you've been on truth or gold and yeah. Oh, yeah. You know, gave me that lesson to who? Let me know. What? That was A great place to be. Ice cube, man. Whoa, I ask you. Yeah, Cubes. Give up your pain, Joe. Let me say yes. So, um, I worked on his show I wrote in this show. Are we there yet? That was not first Writers Guild gig, right? When I'm so I'm a part of a union. And, uh, Cube was in the show, so I will be writing stuff. A Cuban. It was like it was I wouldn't say it was intimidating. I just was so in all of them. But Cube is not. His energy is like, He laughs really hard at funny stuff, but he does not like waste words that he won't do it. But he's not a small talk kind of guy, like, Hey, the weather's kind of crazy. He just Yup. Yeah, you wouldn't. You wouldn't small talk with you even though? Yes. Great. So, um, he was performing in New York and he got me tickets to go see, And I love I love eso. He was doing his material in New York, and the crowd wasn't really in New York that they, you know, they started hip hop. So West Coast cats performing you kind of I was kind of getting that energy and I was like Man, like I'm having a good time. People are having the time. But at that moment I go how much Rather would have seen this show in Los Angeles, where people would have been crying and like, Oh, you know. And so we go back on set and I see him After the concert I go, man, Thank you, man, I said, I really I really enjoyed myself. And he said, for real, because that was our worst show and because he knew what I knew. Like they way briefly talked about just how you know New York. They're very protective over being the birthplace of hip hop. So even though Cube was doing the hits, they could only give it up. So you just you just felt it that night. But the fact that he acknowledged it spoke volumes to me like I was well, we had a nice conversation just about that. But that's how on Oh, that's why I feel like he's so successful. And when he puts out his content because he's like he all, he's very in tune to what the audience wants and kind of can block out the noise of the executives who were saying, We should be this and it's just better. But this way he's like because he can. He can sit back and look at it as an audience member. Go if I'm watching this, I want to see this so this may not, um, be on your notes or in your mandate or what have you. But this thing needs to be in here, and that's why you connects and which brings it full circle is to like you doing your own product. You don't have to listen to all that stuff, which is so empowering, man. It's almost like the most valuable people don't know their value. You know what I mean? It's like it's one of those things. Where what? I said then I talked to Joe about when he's like, You don't need it, you don't need it and it's like, Yeah, it's so inspiring to see cash just put it on their back. Oh, yeah, man, it's what I'm doing when I'm speaking to my crowd and it grows and I hope to have that same type of impact. Uh, I got this when Joe Rogan calls you one of the best comedians. He doesn't 68. It is like Ice Cube. He's kind. No, he doesn't like you didn't need to say stuff like that, right? Yeah. Yeah, I came out of nowhere is a great compliment, Man, is to have two friendships that I I never I never imagined having, but I'm so I'm blown away and getting like, every time I text him like that, Would you try? Yeah. Go, please. Yes. And we have great conversations. And but him and Neal Brennan. I remember when my friend um, Kyle Grooms great comedian was, uh he would text me from the set of the Chappelle Show because I lived in L. A at the time and he was living in New York. He was watching David and shoot this sketch so crazy. And every time I talk to cowhide like Neil said this and Neil said that I want to be friends with Neil, Sounds cool. And then, uh, one day I'm just sitting in the back of the comedy store and near walks and I go and ask Neil. No, that's not even how happen I'm sitting here. It is guys sitting. He's sitting next to me and I just looked and he just starts talking to me. Oh, that's Neil. What's up? We just organically just started talking like maybe we get the lady goes a man, take my number number. Hey, hey. I'm friends with new and this is like it's like the funnest fish. So and then, Joe, I would I would hear this. I'd be on stage, not here. This cackle He has, like, undeniable laughing like Joe, and I'll just do my act and then But he would He would always leave. I wouldn't never really talked to him. And then one day he was just like Do You're so fucking funny. Just was I was a I thought that was you. He would watch me because I would go up after him. It just It just it was like this validation because, like I said, I'm in this space now. I'm talking about stuff that's true to me and, you know, and I'm really excited to talk about it and excited to find, like where I can take it. And when you do that, it attracts things of that nature as opposed to When I first got here, I wanted to be like and I wanted everybody that, you know, whatever, but I didn't know what I was talking about. But I, like you, said, I'm genuinely like I talk about being married. I want couples to stay together and I want to talk about just wait, not supposed to talk about but but not, but not from the space of light man, You know, my wife is terrible because I love it took me years to find my wife, and I think that that resonates with audiences, even people who are married, you know, because I'm not beating up what that is, cause I've been single longer than I've been married. But it's just fun, man. I love that. It's got a got a video on video that I watched about. I think it's called Seven Jokes to Know beautiful and cut from a different size venues and different genres and in different rooms and, you know, in line with what you're talking about earlier. I just love This is beautiful, and I know you get to work with your wife as well. Yeah, I think I think we probably would. We may do a podcast like we really like um what time's the gore and his wife are doing? But I'm so nervous that is going to start arguments in our house. The only reason I haven't hesitated, because I I would say stuff on the black ass I'm afraid to say to my wife as my life. Yeah. As soon as he a what? Yeah. You told me talking to if the next episode So my wife and guns believe next episode. Yes. Yeah, yeah. I mean, so you know, I think I think she'll be phenomenal with that. Like, sees it so immensely talented. And, uh so we'll see. We'll see. I'm still, you know, figuring we're still figuring out I would because I have all the equipment is just like, we're gonna go. We're gonna go full circle here, cause we started out this episode talking about your conversation with Joe Rogan in telling you to do a thing that he knows that you were just wanted to do. And you're like, I don't know where I saw this knucklehead named chase charters just where some of it didn't. But I'm thinking about maybe so I'm just telling you, there are people right now from Denmark. we got. I did a very bad job. Last time we got Macedonian in the house. Malta's Denver, Liverpool, Tampa, Boston. We got people up the global. The planet is basically sending a message to me. To you? Yes, I do start doing all of this stuff and I know no books has Come on. You got a trailer for that? Yeah, soon. It's not on the Internet yet, is it? It's private. Is that you know, I sent you guys a link. I sent you guys only, but it'll be on only Smith TV. After we hang here. I'm just gonna put the trailer of live, Okay. And then April 16th is when we're gonna we're gonna launch it and we're still going back and forth with whether and maybe you guys contend with you if you want all the episodes at once, or we should do one a week. And that's only because me and my editor, Matt Celfin, we're doing it ourselves. And you asked before we got on, you said I want God sponsorship. And yes, it was exactly on. I'll tell the short version because I realized that I'm keeping you longer than I promised. I would, but there's like I put you know, you talked about Joe. Put the onus back, and just like walking, I started to do that and people's out. Um, well, we like we like what you're doing, but you know, how much would it cost? Response of the show. And I would just throw the crazy ass number. And they're like, Oh, yeah, she's so you know, so we could get a punch or a TV show for that. I'm like, this is better than TV. Thank you. Totally get it. Have a great day. Appreciate. And then someone else coming that way operate on the CPM model, which is, you know, per 1000 views. You know how many dollars we my grade? The show doesn't operate like that. You might operate like that, but my show does not like that. So having been there and for the first, did it two years with nothing, and we're getting, like, 25,000 people showing up for these live shows and 50,000 people showing up for these live. This is on the internet in 2010. And, you know, would you compare that to 25 million, which you talked about performing in front of all my intelligent getting shit but 25, people watching a thing or 50,000 people. It's not that there is like, some gigantic numbers, 25 million. But this is 50,000 people who really care. Yes, there. And they're gonna watch 90 minutes of this ship, and then they're gonna go off being pitchfork card carrying members of the of the show or of Owen or fill in the blank. And so my I basically just started just doubled down doing stuff until people realised that Oh, a person doing the thing they're put on this planet to do is really valuable in any industry, because you can, you can feel it with some is doing the thing that is supposed to be doing. And I think that's what Joe was telling you on The show is like this thing. This no books like you know how it made him feel. And he's very accustomed to when something feels right, right? There are people. You you said it earlier. You wanna surround yourself with with people who have done more than you've done or who are inspirational to you? If you're the average, the five people you spend the most time with. Spend some time with some good people, like your wife. Is that people like to me. I think the world is telling you that. And what, You don't know what's gonna come out of it, right? You know? Yeah. And for me, it wasn't the individual show where it wasn't the sponsorship. It was that it basically created everything that I have right now. And I have I mean, like, the community read of live the fact that there's a platform or 20 million people learn how to take pictures and pursue the ship that they care about and started out from. Like, I don't know, maybe we should put some shit on the Internet. That would be cool to make a video. So I'm just telling you that there are people from I just listed, like, 20 countries in 10 cities that want you to do this. Yeah. So that is definitely Yeah, that's great. I'm a creative live number two man. Uh, took some podcast classes. Did I get to a lot of questions? Um, just know these questions were out there in the World Tour wants to know what's the biggest obstacle we had a lot of questions about. Agent is, you know, is that coming back? Is it worked that way? Asking questions about, um, in the parroting the line, is it? Fake it till you make it. And of course, I'm a big fan of no. Make it till you make it. That's right. Last year I love that side of Yeah, um, and this is a lot of a lot of grateful people out there for sharing and being vulnerable and telling stories about borrowing and, man anything I could ever do to to stay close to you. I'm doing it. And I'm I'm sorry we could make this happen for those folks at home who didn't know, like own was gonna come to see how we're gonna do the whole thing and arranges show do all the stuff around. But that's that is, the next time we get together, it's gonna love it. I can't wait, man. Thank you so much. Yes, I'm yet I'm over the moon and let's just recap text. Oh, and text one dot com. I saw some people doing this on their chats. I don't know if this will work. I don't see it. A Szot Samos takes away back. Uh, mentally I was It was attached to a charity. I'm not bigger yet, but I can't wait. I will donate. I would do something funny for any charity and then no books that drops on the 16th. Where the No books. April 16 on ah, own Smith TV. And you're going to You're going to hear about it. You're going to hear about it? Yeah. Make sure you have my digits. As soon as we get off the show here and left drops. Or if there's anything I can do to promote me or enter creativelive will push it out. Congratulate on making success. You're crazy. Crazy, talented, inspiring, Amazing human. I'm grateful to know you, but thank you saying saying thank you not for showing on the created at all. Right now I am for another beast show. Thank you so much for tuning in to see you again.