Pricing: Extras List
you know it's fun because we have literally been talking about pricing almost all day so far. We started off by reviewing the homework from last night. And then, you know, I thought it was important that we talked about that transition from what we were working on this morning and last night into pricing. And so I hope that everyone really was able to grasp what we were doing were going from really finding your three words, really finding out what makes you unique into pricing because pricing is nothing more than just a way for people to buy us, and we're just giving them away for them to purchase us. We're going to the wave to purchase what we're doing and what we're providing. So that's kind of why pricing is so important because pricing good pricing, it just gets out of the way of a booking that was already meant to happen. And so you're connecting with your client. And we spent so much time yesterday talking about how to build a purpose to what you dio how to build a business all a...
bout you and what you dream and what you value on what you aspire Teoh, and pricing is just meant to get out of the way of all of that goodness, it's just supposed to get away, so it makes it sound like it's unimportant because it's like, Oh, were spent all dancing. It is just supposed to get out of the way, but really, the fact that it's it's so complicated and it's so confusing for us, How much more important is that we make sure we translate that accurately and easily to our clients, And so we're really going for clarity. Remember that clarity is the number one thing that we need to we need to put in our packages. We don't want confusion because that's the reason that people don't book. Confusion is kind of our enemy right now. We don't want confusion, and so we want to create packages and prices that makes sense and are easy to buy. Who spent the morning we went over package model and we went over the Ala cart model, and that's that foundation, and you kind of have to pick one. There are other methods available, but really, when it comes down to photographers, most are gonna be using either a package or in Allah cart model. And again we did use a lot of examples from the wedding portrait industry. But I want to make very clear to you guys that what we're really talking about is all the theories that are there for pricing. And so you really can pull from all those theories, no matter what niche or what genre of photography you're in. Even small business owners that aren't photographers and they have been watching can pull all those same theories and apply them to exactly what they're doing. So it's the theories were trying to get across. Now, No matter whether you have a package bottle or where they haven't Ala cart model, you have to have an extras list. You have to have that list that sits on the side that people can either come back and buy from later or also used to support what they want to buy right now. And so we're gonna go into detail on the psychology, the theories, socio economics of it, oven extras list and how to construct one. So that's what we're gonna be doing right now, and then we'll bring sake. A backup will kind of deconstruct. We'll take what we learned last segment where we went over her pricing from last year and, well, deconstructed a little bit and start to build some new pricing from it. Now that we have all the components that we need sound good. All right, here we go. So the first and most important thing, in my opinion about the extras list, is to know the purpose of the extras list for you, The extras list has to have a purpose. And what's doing for your your price list again, I'm gonna keep saying it at this point. Hopefully, you've been able to figure out which one makes more sense to you. The package model or the Ala CART model. Both are something that could be profitable for you. I'm not advocating for one or for the other. Rather, I'm just trying to present clearly each of the options available when you're picking, and hopefully this point, you have a good sense of where you want to go. What makes the most amount of sense for your business? A great question we got from online had to do with you know what's best if I'm just starting out and we talked about the package model. But at this point, we're focused now on the extras list, and the extras list does serve a purpose. You have to know the purpose, because what we're really looking at is that when we are a package model, we want our clients to book off of the package list, and so are extras. List is there to support the packages? Our extras list is there to push people back to buying off the package list. Our extras list is there to encourage them to buy what they want inside of a package. We want them to buy what they want inside of a package, and we have to be clear about that because that's very important. You know, we talked about not being able to serve two masters once again, no matter what. When you post a package list and then you also post extras list, they can be in competition if you're trying to make both priced to be booked, priced to be bought. If you make both price to be bought, there's confusion. Do I buy that album the package? Do I buy that album after the fact? Do I buy that engagement session package or do I buy it after the fact? And that's why we have to know the purpose and the purpose. When you have packages, it's your extra list to support them, right? The purpose when you have a package models for that extra list to support. And so again, when you look at the Ala cart model, it's the exact opposite. You do want the extras to be booked. Rather, you want those extras to be booked. You want the extra list to be easy to book. That was what we talked about. We talked about sending the product component is making sure that the extras list is easy for people to book, easy for people to jump on board with easy for people to get. We talked about making it easy, simple must have need to be attainable and very simple to get to. And so it's important you don't want to miss the important point because a lot of times people will create packages and then created all a cart list along with it, and that doesn't work. You know, we don't wanna have packages of Allah cart. Likewise, we don't have a package list a set of packages and then having extras list. That's just as easy to book, because then it's just confusing. Which one should I go through and that will pull people? It really does put their decisions. I want to give you guys an example. Daniel, really probably my favorite author that I that I can think of You wrote a book called Predictably Irrational and It's All About the socio economic behaviours. And he calls it behavioral economics What he's studying. And he did a fantastic survey that shows exactly how crippling decisions are two people. So in this survey, he did. He got together a set of I think it's doctors and during with these 100 doctors, what he did was he presented a situation that I asked him what the what they would do. He said, OK, you have tested this patient. They've come in and they complained about hip problems and you've worked through all the different tests, and you can't figure out what's wrong. You've tried every medication. You can't figure out what's wrong. So you finally make the recommendation to send them off to hip replacement surgery. There's nothing else that you can think of is a doctor that you haven't tried. But then right before they go into hip replacement surgery a day or two before you realize that you haven't tried ibuprofen somehow it slipped through the cracks. You haven't tried ibuprofen. What do you do? And the good news is, all 100 doctors surveyed said, Oh, my goodness, you pull them back out of surgery and you give them ibuprofen just to see if that would work. That's comforting to know. I thought that was reassuring, Um, and so he kept track of that. So all the doctors, when faced with a decision of surgery or ibuprofen, pulled the patient back out of surgery and said, Let's do ibuprofen. Let's try that first. Then he took another 100 doctors totally separate 100 doctors, and he ran a very similar survey. He sat down. He presented a case of he said, very similarly. You have a patient and they've come and complain about hip problems, and you've tried everything that you know. If you tried testing, you tried testing all these different things. You've run them through different procedures. You've tried every kind of medication. Eventually, the only option left is to send them on to hip replacement surgery, and so you send them off to hip replacement surgery. But you realize you realize 22 or three days before surgery that there's two medicines you haven't tried. There is pure oxycodone and ibuprofen. So what do you do? Do you pull them back out of hip replacement surgery? And if you pull them back at a hip replacement surgery, which medicine do you try now? Over 50% of the doctor said they would just send them on hip replacement surgery decisions cripple us. I mean, look at that scenario. That tells us a lot about how we as humans make decisions and, more importantly, how crippling they are for us, how hard they are. Because a doctor, obviously you could have pulled him back and tried each separately. But the fact they would have had to make two decisions rather than just 12 very difficult decisions as an actual survey that Dan Aerially put together and what it really what he could boils down to is that as humans, as human beings, it's not that we don't care about these decisions. It's not to be, don't care about them at all is that we care so much about all the decisions. But we face so many throughout the day that it becomes crippling to us and we don't know what to do. We take the easiest option we take the easiest road presented. Daniel really does another all share one more example with you. He doesn't example where he looks at the organ donation rate across all the European countries, and you notice is that it's really interesting. There are either countries where, like 85 90% of people in that country donate their organs. And there's countries where only like 10 to 15% of people doing things. There is nothing in between nothing, and he goes on the tell a story about how he starts researching this, he says. That's so odd, he says. Maybe it's because you know, certain countries have cultures where they're predisposed Toby inclined to donate their organs, and certain countries don't. But he looked at these different countries and cultures, and he looked at England and Wales and they were on different sides of the map. He looked at countries that are culturally very similar, Germany and Austrian. He's you know, he's talking about these, and they're on different sides of the map. Some have 10 to 15% organ donation. Others have 1985 90% organ donation, he says. Well, maybe it's look deeper. And I think there was one country was the Netherlands. I believe. I don't know exactly which country who actually met a letter out to every single person trying to get them trying to get more than 10 to 15% of people the organ to donate their organs. And it only move the needle like about 5% you know? And so he goes on, and he finally figures out what it is. It's the form at the D. M V all the countries who have 85 90% when you're filling out the form of the D. D M V, it says, Check this box. If you don't want to donate your organ and we don't check the box and you sign up for your organ donation program, 85 to 90% the countries that have 10 to 15% their form of the D. M. V says check this box. If you do want to donate your organs and nobody checks the box. And so nobody donates organs, and it just goes to show you. It's another example about the way that we cognitively work. And again, it's not that we don't care about decisions. It's not that we don't like decisions is that we have so many decisions that we make every single day that they cripple us and any opportunity we have toe where we don't I mean, that's a big decision organ donation. And it's one of those things where it's like, I think I want to think about that a little bit longer. If I can think about it a bit longer, I think I will. And so we take the easiest option. Now let's translate that back to photography. Typical when people are buying your photography, whether it's a fine art piece to put in the wall, whether it's a portrait, a family portrait session with family members, they haven't had a in a photo in a while, certainly a wedding. These are big moments, these air moments that people are going to feel crippled by decisions. They're gonna want to make the right decision and so we have to understand that decisions are difficult and our extras list can support that. That's the primary function of extras. Less is to support, whether it's a buying mechanism through ala carte or whether to support our package model, which is, you know, our packages, which is through the package model. And so that's really the foundation I want to share with you guys. These examples because a lot of you have asked questions about your I'm not a wedding photographer to these principles. Apply. Yes, this is pricing theory. This is theory. This has studied. This is researched and this has been proven thes concepts in these court tenants of how we build things. So a lot of the examples are gonna be from the wedding the portrait market. But these are the theories that apply across the board matter what portion of photography here, and really, no matter what small business environment you're in, so let's keep going here on the left. I put up the things to consider as you're building your extras list if you're a package model, and really, they're exactly the same as the Ala CART model, except we have one extra consideration to make when were in the package model. Now these air kind of, you know, big, nebulous ideas, and so we will go through each of these. But really, we have four things to consider when it comes to considerations for the extras list from a package side, and we have three things to consider when it comes to the all the cards. The three things for the card are very similar to the package side. So what? We're going to talk about that one unique component that goes along with the package extra list and then we'll move on and we'll talk about both. To start, we'll talk about number two, number three, number four as they pertain to both. And so we look at that. We have package considerations, and that's really looking at the way that you set up your packages. As an indication of how we need to set up our extras list, we need to understand how you set up your packages and then build your extras list off that, because the extras list is there to support the packages. The extras list supports what you guys are doing in the packages, and that's why it's important to look back at the packages before we construct that extras. List number two and you know, we're called number two, but it goes across to both sides is markup minimums. And this is a question I get a lot of which is what? How much should I charge my product? You know, how much should I charge my service? Jared is any baseline you can help me out with. And so mark up market minimums. That is the topic that really pertains to the minimum recommendations for mark ups, you know? And I'm gonna take you guys on this little explanation of the minimum that we might want to dio. And then what we do is we advanced from that into looking at market conditions and personal conditions. And what we'd like to do is kind of move down. The food chain would like to go from, you know, really markup minimums. That's where we might have to start when we're building our business. But we want to move it to the point where we can charge what we want to charge for a product number four personal considerations, personal conditions. We want to charge what we want to charge. But in the beginning, we might not be able to charge exactly. We want we might B'more having to compete with what is going on right now without a name, you know. But that unique differentiator is gonna help you guys to move from 2 to 3 to four. So we'll go through each of those. We'll give you some clarity and kind of some structure to how to price yourself. And again, this is a classic example of once you know the rules, you now know how you could break them. So you know this stuff coming up here it is not hard and fast. It's not something you have to abide by its something where if you understand the rules of how to create it now, you really can go out and break them as long as you understand why you're breaking. If you don't understand why you're breaking it, then sometimes it's not set up the right way. Okay, here were the packages that we were working with earlier today. These packages that we had up there and if you remember correctly with that starting package at 2600 we moved on from that to that middle package at 3700. And then we finished off that top package of 4800. These air the packages that Bronson has been booking, you know, especially last year. And so what is really important to look at here is no the price jumps. That's the first thing to look at is to know the price, jumps and right. We've talked a lot about differentiation and price jumps, but what I want to do is talk more about the price of the price jump thing, actual dollar amount that we're looking at here and so is opposed a differentiation, which is what we used to set up the packages. Now we're looking at the dollar amount because that's gonna be key as we move over to our extras list on the dollar amount. Here is we go from 263,700 so the raise in price is $1100. So what that really means is that that client has to get more than $1100 in value by going from the starting package to the middle package. If they get less than $11 of value, that it's actually better for them to just book it on the Ala cart menu on the extras list. You know, if you set up in extras list that has a cheaper than it's better than the book on the extras list and not book in your package. Remember, a fundamental concept for humans to understand is that price equals value and it really comes down to We don't know of any other way for us to judge how much something is worth unless they has a price tag to us and that kind of validates way. No, this can be true in all sorts of different examples, you know, But at the end of the day, I'm not gonna go to for India. But we need a price point for us to understand the value when we're buying a sophisticated product and we're not a sophisticated buyer now, you personally as photographers would probably have to go in and understand how much something really is worth when you're buying from another photographer because you understand how much things cost. You understand how much markup is you understand, how much they need to make you understand all the dynamics there, but what's very difficult is something they don't even know what any of these words mean. You know, I can tell. Many people have asked me, What do exactly we get with the high resolution files? You know, explain that to me. These are concepts that you know. It's an unsophisticated buyer buying something that's a sophisticated product. And so because of that, you know, price does tend to equal value, and so we can give them the value of something by putting it on our extras list. And so coming back full circle. If it's an $1100 increase from the starting package to the middle package, we had better make sure that things that are included in the middle package that weren't including the starting package are at least $ or more in value. What we include, we included an extra hour of coverage. We added a second photographer, and we added the high resolution files. So those things added up had better equal more than $1100 or else they're gonna be compelled to not by the middle package, but by the starting package and then buy it cheaper on the experts list. More importantly, you're pushing them in the wrong direction because they feel most comfortable buying the middle package and you're telling them not to. That's not clear. That's confusing. Likewise, in the middle package to the top package is another $ increase. And what do we increase from the middle package to the top package? We added an extra hour of coverage, and we added an eight by 8 30 page album. So the value that but the amount we charge for the eight Byte album and the extra hour of coverage from two photographers had better be greater than $1100. Because that's how much we're charging to go up for the middle package to the top package. And if it isn't there going to be more prone to buying the middle package and again in this case, if what they really want is all in the top package, then we would be doing them a disservice by forcing them back to a package that hasn't they don't want in the middle packages for all of us to be guided, Teoh. But if we are a Stoute, understand exactly we want and we know that it's in the top package, there's nothing wrong with them booking that we just want to guide them towards towards the middle package unless they know exactly what it is they want. So let's go and look at that is how it breaks down under our extras list. And we already posted a little bit of our extras list on the Ala cart side. But that was for the all A cart menu, those for the all car packages, so I wouldn't pay as much attention to that. I look at this because this is separate. This is different. This is an extras list that supports the packages, and it's an extras list that supports what we're trying to achieve in booking in the packages. So again we have albums, and here they eight by eight, starts at 17 50. So again, if we go back, you can get an album for $1100 Mawr. If you just go from middle packet of the top package and you get extra our coverage from two photographers already, I don't have to look any further to see the value in the top package. If I want an album, I'm gonna buy it inside of the package. I might not be sure I wanted. Sometimes people come in. They're not sure they want or something. You know they want the album, but they don't want to buy it. Yet they sacrifice and for ago, that added savings to buy it later and on the extras list. I am putting the extra amount per page here. You know, I you always got balance, the transparency you want to have with them with not showing them too many options. I didn't show them, for example, Canvas Price, senior print price. And last year it wasn't that I didn't show up because I wasn't trying to be transparent. It was that I just don't want to overwhelm them. I've never had a bride or groom come in and meet with me and say, You know, the whole sole reason it hinges on me booking you and what it hinges on when it comes to booking is how much you charge for any by 10. Never had anyone do that before they might ask, but usually like Okay, good. Check that off the list are way asked about that? And so you know, in addition to albums, I also put parent albums on there because I do find that my couples, Do you like to buy parent albums? Would you like to buy those? Especially when they're already gonna buy an album, then sometimes add apparent home. It's not a must have, but it doesn't mean it's not something that they want. It just means it's something that hasn't reached into their top three of them. Must have. We also add in the other components that get encouraged and included. Excuse me with the with the rest of packages there. So we have an engagement session. We have a second photographer. We have digital files. And so you know, this kind of rounds out exactly what it is that we're looking to do here. Now again, if we look here, the albums are what I want to show you guys first. And the reason I want to show you guys the Alma's first is because that really comes back to this top package and how we built that top package to be in value. The value of the album being 17 50 versus the value of the package being only 1100 are increase. Now let's look at how other things factor in like digital files so digital files or $1250. We don't even get to the second part there. We'll go back and look and to go from a starting package that didn't have digital files up to the middle package that did. It's an 1100 are increase. So already you're saving $150 buy. Buy it in the package and you get a second photographer in the next hour of coverage to boot. So again now we have uncredible amount of value for someone to go from the top pack. I'm sorry from the starting package to the middle package and so you're extras list. What is it really doing here? It's pushing people back to the packages. It's saying, Hey, if you know what you want by it in a package, don't buy it on the extras list and it drives them one direction. It gives them the correct path to follow, doesn't make them sit there and make decisions and grapple with it like we know they will, and that will lead them to make decisions that they're not necessarily comfortable with that are wrong decisions or cripple them and actually caught cause indecision and indecision is what leads to not booking. So in addition, we've talked about a little bit of the bundling concept, and I love the bundling concept. I love what it does for us here. Complementary digital files with Album Purchase So here's something I know I know from doing this for years and years and years that very few people ever by the digital files afterwards, they either by them the package or they get them with an album. So really, that price point there means absolutely nothing because nobody ever pays anything. For that. I have to clients a year that probably by the digital files. So that price point is literally there to support what I'm really trying to do. If I put that price point at $250 again, it doesn't matter, does it? Because no one buys it. And if something doesn't matter, why does it? Why do you even care about the price? It doesn't matter. Why wouldn't put a price on it? The reason you put a price on it is because you need it to help describe value to something else. So we want to ascribe value toe what it's included, and that's the concept of bundling at its finest. So right now what you do is if that price for digital files was just say, I'm not even advocating $100. That's obviously very low for digital files. Let's say it was 2 $50 just for the sake of argument, if that was $200. Now, when you buy an album, not only do you get a 1700 dealer album, but you also get a $250 worth of digital files complimentary. That's pretty awesome. $30 of complementary digital files. I like that. Well, when the price is 12 50 you get $1250 with a complementary product. And since price equals value, the value of the album just skyrocketed. I'm not too worried about it because nobody bought those digital files anyways. A lot of products out there, and this is going well beyond the photography industry, and there's a lot of progress after that. He used to support other products. Some people call them loss leaders. This is not technically a loss leader. I don't want to confuse you, but to give you a frame of reference of the general direction of what we're talking about, that we can use products. This is an advanced technique, by the way. This is not a basic technique, but that we can use certain products to ascribe value to other products. And that's huge. When I went from charging $750 for my digital files, which is what I price them at back in 5 High Price mint, $700 because that was the amount that I wanted them to be bought for. But nobody was buying them. I was buying and buying them in the package, but they weren't buying them in the Al Akari and the extras, Let's start. So when I change that from Senator $2 to $1200 my album sales went up by a lot just by changing the price of the digital files. Why is that? It's because we respond to price equals value, and the value of the album went up, and since the value went up in the price didn't go up, the number of bookings went up for it. I was able to increase the number of albums I sold simply by raising the price of the digital Nick's digital files that I had. So that's an advanced techniques and an advanced technique that you can use in bundling to help describe more value. So you guys all talk about I know this because I work with all sorts of you when I do consultations when I get feedback from everybody who's watched the pricing course, I hear that digital files are the number one must have for a predominant large number of you out there. Digital files, digital files. It's all they asked for it. So they asked for in the pricing in the roadmap, start a business roadmap. I All I read was just files, files, files, files. It's a big, big thing. I get it. It's a big thing, and most people I feel like that's their clients. Number one must have. And so you're dealing with this and you're dealing with the fact that if you give them their files, then you know you lose that ability and they don't come back. Necessarily buy more, and I get all of that. But the fact of the matter is, along with that, that they want to buy they want to have a digital file. Sorry, that's their number one must have. And so withholding it from them isn't the right strategy. It's not. In my opinion, I think that you want to give your clients what they want. I think that's the whole point of a business transaction, and what I want to do is make it easy for them to get those files. But I also want make it easy for them to get the other things they're concerned with and that they want For me, the second must have is what an album exactly. So that's why I chose to complement to bundle their number one must have, which I'd rather not just give to them and let them be on their merry way. But I want to give it to them cause that's what they want. That's why I chose to bundle it with their number two must have. I know they want an album, and I know they want the files and man, when their book together, it's an it's a 12 punch. It's fantastic. So that's the concept of bundling and creating, and that's the S the number one thing we talked about 1123 and four package considerations. You have to build your extras list to support your packages. That Lockhart you don't have to. It's there to be bought. This. These digital files are not there to be bought. They're there to support my packages. They're there to support you and drive you back to either buying it with the album or really buying. If you want the album inside the package, let's talk about bottom in. Pricing again is going back to the how much we're gonna mark up and how much we're going to charge for a product, and this is a very basic take on it, and I really want to be clear about that. How much you charge for your product is really, really you could. There's a lot of different things. You can utilize charge for your product, you know? I mean, I see album pricing that's all over the map. People charging $500 all up to $5000. You know, on day I don't have a problem necessarily with any of those, at least not at its core. I sure hope there's a reason for everything For each one of those price points. I'm not advocating that you should just willy nilly just assign any price to it. But I'm just saying that there's, ah large degree of variants here. But what? I am gonna try to give you some foundations, some fundamentals that you can use inside this up, and this is bottom in price. And this would be where you don't aren't able to take into consideration. The next one is where you have to start. And really, I want to go through the markup minimum here, and I call the four X mark up minimum. I believe that you should charge at a minimum four times what that product cost you. That's the overall point. I want to make that at a minimum. It's something cost you $500 to produce. You have to charge at least 2000. You have to multiply that 500 by four. And I'll explain why so one time mark up one X, That's that would be that if you if you if you had $500 costs that product, that would be charging $500 that's obviously how much you're gonna pay for the product that would be called wholesale. That would be the cost of the product and two x or doubling that. So if you charge, if you get charged 5000 I'm sorry if you get charged 500 for that product, that would be like charging 1000 be doubling the cost of that product. And really, what that's considered is retail. Really, when you go buy something in retail, the general of thumb is that they've doubled the price from their wholesaler. They bought that, stuck it on their shelf and charge you double. And that's meant to cover their costs of having a store, their employees and then they need to make some profit there as well. But they didn't do anything to make the product. They didn't make it. Somebody else made it, and all they're doing is literally buying it, taking it off the cart and put it up for yourself. They didn't have to fulfill anything that have to design anything that necktie employees to build it. They had to take their time. They live, they just took it and sold it. You know, it's like the middle men, you know. You see, people selling re selling stuff on eBay and that they're just taking stuff and they're just reselling it. And that's us a classic kind of retail model. And that would be where you see a two times two times doubling your price. That's just for the convenience of offering that, and for facilitating that purchase for giving them the ability to buy it from you and having it all be buttoned up easy to do. A lot of times we have relationships of album companies with the premier labs, all these different things to fulfill. Our products that are, consumers are clients, just can't even get access to. So doubling would be almost. You can feel like that's help out in the retail side three times, three times markups. So if that product costs us $ we wanted charge $1500. Well, I would say that extra $500 would be compensating you for your time it takes to produce that product. If it's an album to either never do design or even put together, take the design, make the changes, prepare it, send it off when you get it back, proof it, make sure it looks good. Bundle it up, get it ready to ship. All that kind of. That's all the time you put in. And that's something you can use again. This is just a rough frame of why and how to charge as a minimum for your product, and that would be compensating for you for your time. It also allows you to built in that budget, So if you want to pay somebody else to do that, you have that built in. So if you want to charge $1500 for something that costs $5 you kind of have a budget built in to pay someone else to do all the work to facilitate that. You know, that's kind of what they're for and in the fourth X is the profit for the business, and we don't tend to think about this sometimes. But the business also needs to profit. When you're working in your business, you should be getting paid for your time, and you should also be profiting because you're the business owner, because the business needs to profit outside of all of its employees. What we fail to think about is believe or not, we should be getting paid as an employee of our business and as the owner of our business. And the business itself needs to profit for what it's selling and that extra $500 in our example is the profit for the business. That's the profit the business takes home. You happen to be the owner. Probably if you're like most people, you on the business 100%. And so you happen to be the business owner. But that's what that extra for X is. Four extra X really to get us to forex. So I hope that helps kind of give you a basic framework for how to charge and, you know, obviously prints you want to charge more than four times the cost of Prince. Maybe that's common at least again. I'm not trying to advocate, but, you know, it's common in charge more than four times for that. And so you would made you wanna look at this is the ground, you know, ground the ground rules and then move on from there. I'm not really trying to tell you how much to charge as much as I'm just trying to give you tools with how to think about what to charge. I'm not telling you to charge four times how much products are. I'm giving you the tools on how to think about how much to charge. You can apply your own one x two x three x You can make that 1.5 x three x You know, whatever you can do what you want with it. But once you know the rules, you get to break them. Let's talk about that, too, in that three, their top end pricing considerations. So there will come a point when you move past having to just charge what the kind of what the minimums are. If you will like having to just use pure economics to figure out how much charge will come a point when you can charge what the market will bear, that's a good spot to be. We want to move from 2 to 3. We want to move into petard in what the market will bear. And so, you know, market considerations are that next evolution. You want to get there if you're providing the signature product. If you're provided for me a premium album, if your private riding something that is really awesome and amazing. Then that way you can charge what the market will bear for something that's amazing like that. So, you know, if you're charging something that has a lot of value rather than just using a standard economic markup theory that really applies, you know, mortgages, general products, you want total charge, what the market will bear. Then at some point you'll move on to that next in that last step, which is just charging what it's worth to you. And that's a great, great place to be, to be able to charge simply what it's worth to you. And, you know, it takes a while for all of us to get their only certain Certain products of mine have made it into the personal consideration category, and, you know, that's a point where you're really just looking at you, like, How much is it worth for me to put together an album? How much is it worth for me to put together? Ah, signature wall piece for them? How much is it ready for me to put together a premium offering of that canvas premium canvas? Different? How much is it worth for me to do? Those things. How much is it worth from my time to take away And you know, you see, you see certain people, you know, pricing those things just all across the map, you know, and there's one wrong with that because they've moved it into a personal consideration category. You know, you look at them, you're like, I can't believe they're charging that much, and then you kind of get bigger while they're getting it good for them. I mean, shoot, who starred you, right? And that's kind of what that argument is talking about. It's talk about the personal consideration, and maybe they aren't getting it. Maybe they're saying that's what it's worth to me, and that's telling people not to buy it. Oftentimes, they say, the easiest way to tell someone know is to just charge way more than they would pay for it. You want to tell them no now, but they would still in a bit, with the same exact response. So again we want to move down that chain. We want down the food chain from just a bear market minimum to what the market conditions will bear toe what our personal considerations will take into consideration. Um, at the end of the day, you're probably gonna land. Hopefully, in your evolution, you're gonna land between number three and number four with with your products, we're gonna land it market considerations. You're gonna land at personal considerations. You're gonna probably bounce back and forth there. But you know, that gives you a good framework for how to price some of your products. Some of your extras there again t kind of go back to exactly what we're talking about here. Markup minimums, plus market conditions, plus personal considerations are what equal your price. You really want to use all of those at your disposal and how much of each. If you use predominantly market minimums or predominantly personal considerations, you can pick and choose how much of each of these will use the percentage. But all of them add up to equal the price that you want to charge. And this could be applied to your services to, by the way services air harder because there's not a product card cost. So the market minimum theory doesn't really apply nearly as much. But if you want to get particularly can kind of think about how much your time is worth and apply that for the services. I don't talk a lot about how much my time is worth. You'll notice that when we're looking at how to set up the pride pricing, I didn't factor in how much my time was worth. You know? How much is it worth for me? How much? Doctor pay bride. Obviously, Bronson doesn't work for free. One of these things you gotta pay him. And I strip that out because I wanted us to get the pricing concepts down. I wanted to understand the theories behind it and throwing in a price point that might be widely different between you and me, Hannah, Or, you know, you and me is gonna really add more confusion. And that's not what I want to dio. But you can use this theory. You could also use this theory for your for your service is Okay. Let's talk about some bonus strategies here, and I'm just gonna review them because I've already gone through a lot of these. But I just want to provide a review of these bonus strategies, be thrown it. And that's that bundle concept. Remember the bundle concept that we saw here is with the complimentary access to the number one must have paired with number two Must have you can do this is number two and number three. It doesn't have to just be the number one must have. You could do the things that aren't must have. You can use this same theory. It works definitely works more powerfully when you combine it with must have but in packages is bundling concepts really allows people to kind of get exactly what they're looking for, and you make it easy for them again over the point of good pricing. The point of good pricing is to just give them what they want to buy and make it easy for them to buy that you're not trying to sell them stuff they don't want. You don't want to do that as a brand. You don't want to do that. That's just not gonna take you anywhere. You want to give them the products you want to give the services. You want to give them the things that they want, but you want to do it in a way toe where it's easy for them to purchase that you're trying to do that, and these concepts make it easier for them to get their. It removes some of the decisions. For them, Number two is a print or an album credit. That's another thing you can use to help that process along. If you include a print credit or an album credit, then if they don't use that, it's gonna feel like they're leaving money on the table. None of us like to leave money on the table. I remember I bought a group on a while ago, which I don't get me started on them. But I bought a group on a while ago for something because we were going to some bowling alley and I think they had a group on posted. And so I was like, Oh, OK, if we're going there, I might as well just buy that and so I can use it. So I bought it, and then we just ended up not going to that bowling functions. I was left with this this group on the news of expiring, so I didn't really know to do with it. I looked up online. I guess you get the value that you paid. You can still take the value that you paid, so it's been interesting. Is the back one in mind? I'm like, We gotta go use that bowling thing we bought. We bought, like, bucks to a bowling alley. And I have this credit to this bowling alley and you know, it comes up every once in a while. I keep thinking about it. It's almost like money left on the table. I spent that money and there's something I can still go out and get from it, and I haven't gotten it yet. And with credit, they didn't spend that money very transparent. You can tell people that it's there to help them get started on buying something they want. I'm buying maybe a print, maybe an album, and it has that effective. There's money on the table, and I want to use that money is on the table, and so it It also helps, and we'll talk about this tomorrow. It helps if you are having a hard time with sales. If you have a hard time with that hard time with bringing up again. That was a huge thing in the road map. The business roadmap to success is I get weirded out when I talk about sales, and this gives you a bit of a crutch to walk on, because now, instead of calling him up, me like, Hey, come on in, let's talk about how to sell you stuff. You can now call up and say, Hey, I just want to give you a call because I know you still had a couple $100 in credit and I want to find out how we can, how we can apply that for, You know, I don't just leave it hanging. I want you to know that I'm available. Teoh help you out with that. And now, instead of coming at a place where you feel like you might be selling, you're really coming from a place of trying to help them. It's all the same, by the way. It just feels like a little bit of a crutch, and I'm about the crutch. I'm OK. I've used used to crunch all the way through as well. I started off in this not being good at sales and feeling like I was terrible at it, and so that really helps a lot. Another another, you know, bonus strategy is to do a premiere party and a premiere party is a great way to help people out in, you know, grabbing different products off extras list. And so a premiere party can be done. I told you guys a little bit about what we like to do. Like to take a little bit of a different twist on ours. But you know, you can offer something at the premiere party. I know people that do the 25% off anything purchased at the premiere. I know people that do this a 5% off for every family member that show up, you know, and again, this is something that works for a lot of photographers, and it's a bonus strategy for how to maximize the use of your extras list. You can use this whether you're doing, you know, whether you're doing packages are all a car. But, you know, like it says if there's gonna work more effectively in Allah cart model, it's gonna work more effectively than all the CART model. And the fourth is display and show. And I love I love this because as photographers, we need to understand that we tend to sell what we show E. I know a lot of you out there don't have a studio space and you know that's OK, but it does make it harder for you to sell the things you don't show them. If you show them albums probably gonna be more inclined to buy an album. The same is true of your prints. They're the same is true of the prince that you want to sell them if you want to sell them a print or something to hang on the wall. And people always complain Photographers always complain about Oh my gosh, you know people just by those small and by four by said Why are they buying four by six? Five are buying five by seven. And then they told me they want to buy eight by to hang in there. Mantle and you know prevail will really help you out. With that. You haven't checked out the app. That's something that is a huge tool in selling the size of the print that you want. But you know, it also comes down to what you show them. If you bring them into your studio and you don't have the size of the print on your wall that you want to sell. You're not gonna be able to sell it in addition. I mean, if you want to sell a 20 by 30 you might want to put up a 40 by 60. I mean, I'd have a 20 by and afforded by 60 because again, we want to drive them to the middle. They're not gonna want to buy the largest print your studio. We're not gonna wanna buy the smallest print your studio. They're probably gonna want to buy the print. It's right in the middle. And I have a friend in San Diego is an amazing photographer named Kevin Connors. And I love I love what he does. He always kind of having these massive prints. A portrait photographer and this portrait photographer will have it all set up. We'll have. Kevin will have, like, a huge print, like he's got, like, 80 inch prints set up, and he will sit there and he'll ask them what size print they want to buy. And they'll be like, Well, we're thinking about 11 by 14. He's like, Oh, let my 14. Okay, so pull it out. Music. So you were thinking about a print about this size. He goes and takes us along my 14. It looks like, you know, it was like a little index card up against an Indian sprint. And they're like, Oh, it looks a little small. It's a little smaller than what I'd recommend. Yeah, you know, But it goes back to the theory of, you know, you kind of you are gonna be able to display and sell what you show. What you displaying show is what you'll have a better chance of selling. And so, you know, you need to keep that in mind if you deal the studio, take that to heart, But take it to heart also with just If you're carrying around albums to sell on, you're going into a coffee shop or something to meet with people, you bring a you know, a small album. Don't expect to sell a big album if you you know. I mean, so there's this theory kind of applies across the board. I really like it for fine art photographers, and they like it for portrait photographers, the idea of the premiere party and the display and show. I think that really applies to portrait photographers and really applies to fine art photographers. I could see it applying to product photographers, to be honest with you in landscape photographers as well. So I think that thes thes concepts you know, you guys were asking online about Well, what are some concepts that can apply outside of the event industry? And these are some really great concepts that will help out with those of you who aren't event photographers. So at this point, let me go and have Satya, You wanna come back up and we'll go ahead and get started. We've kind of wrapped up with the extras portion here before you and I dive back in. Come on up before you die back in. I thought I'd throw it over to you guys and see what we were thinking about online here. Yeah, we have one question from Adrian Far in England. Who asked what if most people like everything you have in your package, but someone comes along and they wanna kind of mess with your packages? What would you How do you handle that? Well, it's always nice, and I think there's something there is something that people fundamentally make is a mistake and I've done it before. Before I really started setting this and it really will come back to bite you and that's we think we don't We can't find a good excuse and head for why we can't pull something out of a package. And so when we pull something out of a package, it's not until later. We realize, Oh, that's something in the math, there isn't quite right and it's true. It's because we set it up as a package and then when they start when we started poorly, can't go backwards on it because we go backwards because of the way that we built these price, that this package list because the way that we built the things that go in it to be, you know, to have multiple things in it and have multiple things that bundled together when we pulled only one of them out and not the bundle. All of a sudden, the client has this massive savings that wasn't intended and it really can into believing you making less money off that package than even off e earlier package. But I always recommend the people is that they don't want something. Let's say we're talking about your middle package, that they don't want everything that's in your middle package. You say No problem. It's a package. It's a bundle. I can't really pull anything out of that. What I can do is let's go back down to the package below that, and we'll start adding back onto it. Example. I like to give us if it is. If you go into a hamburger restaurant meal in any restaurant, you say, I'd like my hamburger. Well done. I don't want the pickles. I don't want to let us on that. Want the tomato now? How much will I say for that? You know, it's not the same example. Obviously, we know it's not quite the same, but mentally we would never do something like that. You know, he wouldn't go. And how much does that save me? And so I think that it's the same principle that applies, You know, they if you can't afford that hamburger just moved down to the next level below that or something, you know, by the hamburger without if you can afford it. And I think we're looking the packages, we can't pull stuff out of packages. We can't pull stuff out. We have to go back down to the smaller package with all the card. You don't have that problem. That's kind of a nice part. So answered Belinda's question about pulling stuff out. So you got a two for one special on that way. Next question. Just really proud. Last question Before we continue on from Rachel Wakefield, what do you do if your client booked your lowest package? Only wedding day coverage and nothing else I want to buy later. How much do you charge them later on? Should just be like the middle package. You just bumping right up to that. Is there any penalty? You're any prints? No. You know, I'll let them upgrade their package all way up until the wedding day, you know? And it's something where a lot of times that will happen, You know, 345 times a year. So I was gonna call in and say, Oh, man, you know, we need more coverage. And we looked over the packages that you sent us, and yeah, you know, we'll just take the middle will take the top package, but a lot of times you know they don't want the next package up. And so yes, of course, you charging full price for that. All the card item, you know, because it's not a matter of there's just no need to give them a discount. There's no need to change the way that you charge for that, and it's available to them in the package. They want to take care of it. The package and usually it comes with other things included, along with that say, extra product. And if they only want the product, they can go ahead and buy it in the album. Start in the In the Allah cart list. Extras list, right? The experts like I've seen all the card.