Rebuilding a Pricing Sheet Part One
Why don't you go introduce? I never introduced yourself everyone but just talk a little bit as it pertains to pricing about you know uh we're looking at wedding packages for to begin with right and what kind of price range are you trying to book in? You have a certain amount you want to make per wedding is or you know, do you have any thoughts about that what we're getting pricing loaded? Um I like tio average around three thousand a wedding yeah and my clientele is usually it's usually their second wedding I do a lot of weddings on orcas island in the san juan island so just up there by the way it's really beautiful. Yes oh that's that's not going to hear you tell me I'm going to start off with him right up here in this board. What are your must haves? I know that you might be like oh, I thought it wasn't until about thirty minutes ago but what would you say are your number one number two and number three must have? Well, my thought is my number one must have is an album because I rea...
lly love the final product that's my goal okay you're number one must have is a final phrase album I'm gonna put that up here we'll talk about it number two must have in your opinion the digital files camera put files you can really read that ok, by the way are we ok with that? My hand running changes all the time it might look like a girl's today and tomorrow might look like you know you just don't know number three so the number three is kind of my my must have talked about that which is a second photographer I'll put it down we'll come back tio we'll put second photo down because that's what's going to fit well need this for later okay so a couple rules rules of thumb here and it's important for everyone to hear this when you are coming up with your must have they have to be your clients must have they can't be your must half let me tell you a story and don't worry I'm not picking on you but this represents some people said I love canvas prints I love them so does sarah we both love campus friends we have a gorgeous forty by forty square canvas print hung up in our house red above right to the right of our mantle it's of us on our wedding day and we just love it walk by every day and I'm not can you guys I seriously look at every day and I'm just so so excited about we love the canvas medium I could go on about it guess what? My clients could care less they don't like campus I don't know why I don't know why but if I thought that my my liking of canvas of campus prince should be something I offer them then they would not buy that that would be the wrong must have and I would have I would have made a grave mistake thinking that my must have are theirs and this is where it differs from what we talked about earlier with creative purpose and finding words that define who you are that doesn't necessarily mean that doesn't mean you're going to track that kind of client it doesn't necessarily mean they're going to want to buy the exact same things you want to buy that's a bit superfluous but we're considering must haves attracting the right kind of client is important attracting the kind of clients that want the exact same things that you might prefer isn't important and what is important is understanding what they must have. So what I recommend to you is if you say second photographer it's probably because you like having a second talk over there it's important your rent and I'd recommend it then that you make the decision about whether that has to be in every package because it's something that you need to have or whether it's truly a client's must have any thoughts about that I'm not sure they know the difference that it's not a must have and neither is a must have or it's not you know, I mean, it's like that black and white versus gray either is or everything else is it's not I'm going racing where you think number three must have would be what's the other thing they might want. Well, I mean, the first thing that comes to mind is an engagement session, but a lot of my clients it's not a must have because they book with me from afar often get bookings, they never ok. So right now what you're saying is that these two things are head and shoulders above whatever number three would be. Yes, so that's great, by the way, you might be someone who only has two must have or that the top two are so much larger than anything else we'd put down here. I still want to put something here because we still want to use it, but what do you think a third option would be? And maybe it is second title, by the way, but it just it might be a dual reason it might be something you want to have and something that they want. I'm stumped. Well, you've got to give me something you got to start talking and I'll work with you on it that's so I'll go through some of the different options, maybe it could be all day coverage it could be a print does everybody want a wall? Hanging print is a talk with this is where we have to go deep and figure out you know, what is something else that they want? I mean, I think oftentimes I'm asked about a second photographer but a second trip here and we'll get going I think that what you're going to find it in the next segment we start creating packages, we're going to start learning more about that that's often times what happens is we're unsure about our must has were first put them on paper or we get them in the wrong order and I'll show you howto check that so for the sake of right now put second target down and we're gonna keep working with that don't worry, this is what happens a lot of time we know are number one we know our number two in the number three is like I don't know flip a coin it's like you have one ok well maybe like the online gallery but I would not say it's a must have item must it's expected it's expected and it will go to the difference they're gonna put second are and the world and show you how to work with let's show you how to work with this because I think a lot of people are in the exact same boat you're in right now that's why I love this example right here so let's pull up your current prices let's just talk through your current prices we have it up here in the screen I'm gonna go ahead and switch through and so here is your let's see this would be your top package right here this is the everything by the way I don't have any opinions on named package names around that's what you mean by pakistan that there's no pricing theory about that so we won't we won't talk about that I think it's great by the way I'm not picking on you at all and this one is sixty two hundred dollars good designed by the way three pretty everything packages all day coverage up to ten hours to photographers one videographer ten by ten a bite to eight by eight's and engage in session with guest book let's go to the first package since that's the order that we did this in and let's talk about the first package first packet is a nice and simple is that right? No one more one more where is that? There is a small is beautiful okay, so two thousand dollars one photographer five hours of coverage eight by eight twenty side out and ten digital images go and write that up here just really quickly so we have that put one package I'm just going to use um shorthand here we're going to go call one photo we're gonna call it five hours we're going to call it an eight by eight twenty and we're going to say ten ah hi rez could you get ten high rez files? Ok and so that's what we have for our first package there let's go and go into the second package groups wagered here we go nice and simple that was two thousand for a second package what? We wouldn't be ad there we have six hours now we still have one photographer we have a ten by ten and we don't know how many pages that is and this is a fine art and we have one hundred dollars and we have all the high roads files no, I only included albums I'm ok let's go through look at this guy's what way? Add another hour wait another hour there leave that off we had another our way still have one photographer we'll just put one photo there one photographer six hours from five hours six hours we went from an eight by eight twenty two a ten by ten fine art album we added some print credit in and we went from ten high res files to what looks like about what do you say thirty to fifty so let's just put thirty let's put forty here we went so that's what's included and we went from two thousand twenty six hundred so I would say that's not too bad, you know, when we're looking at certain things about what did we create natural upsell there? We definitely did. How's the price differentiation. Well, it would be six hundred dollars divided by two thousand dollars. Now I'm no rocket scientist, but I think that's twenty percent I don't know something would have to be in the math here but I think that's roughly right within the range we wanted to be maybe give or take a little bit. We might want this to be a little bit higher on dso that's good let's, go into the third package. So this is the perfect fitness is going to be packaged three and this one is forty five hundred and this one is all day and now we have two photographers. We also have a ten by ten, just like we did before we also added an eight by eight parent album. And we have is that he knows that all the dvd of images that will be all high rise. So I'm just gonna all high rez and we have the videographer for an additional eight hundred which I'm just gonna put down here at the bottom. Now tell me now at this point, so we have four packages and we've just gone through a third package which one is most booked uh well the second one second one is most looked how much how much as a percentage of citizens booked it's actually kind of funny because people I actually this is my first year doing this price list so what I'm finding is that people want you know, people usually say they want to spend around three thousand dollars and then I find that I'm adding on to the second package um and making it more in between those two in between these two is what they do is they bar this package and add something on they do yeah they do what they typically add on well they're like well I want all the digital files we only get forty of them yeah and so then I cut them a deal on the digital finds so then I sell them like a thirty three hundred dollars package so close up okay there's nothing wrong that by the way let me ask you this if you how many I don't know just give me what is your book last year but as a percentage how many booked this package do you think um probably I mean really be taken at all come up to be really technical ibooks eight weddings on dh I think more than a little more than half booked around three thousand okay, good we'll look at what I said sixty percent what's fun about it by six percent so you know what I'm going to talk about your top package way don't need it that's the first recommendation I would make you have your you have your packages right here I don't need to see what's in your top package you have your packages right here now I haven't compared him back to your must have yet I haven't compared it back to your must has yet not let me first pack we'll get to that this's what I wanted you guys to do at home I want you guys to see how we're breaking this down I want you guys to see how we go through packaging and looking at last year first as an indicator for where we're going you want to solve your must have problem you want to know for certain you have your must have doubt in start by looking at last year if your brand new at this I'm sorry you don't have that capability to you but at least you know you have one year on your belt with this this price list that gives us great you only the wedding's book no problem ate a good that's a good number to go with nothing wrong with that don't say yourself island book six weddings last year so doesn't matter don't say yourself only shot ten seniors last year don't say yourself that I only sold you know fifteen boudoir sessions whatever it is that's good knowledge and what we have to do that to go through and look at this now I'm not saying these packages of perfect they might be I don't know yet we haven't gotten there yet. What we start by doing is looking backwards we start by looking backwards at what we have and we just want to compare now again I should've brought my calculator can I get a little help from you from the ladies? What is the price differentiation here? What's twenty, six hundred divided our started six hundred by two thousand is it twenty percent? Thirty cheese shouldn't do math while on life and this is confusing is that I'm sorry I'm gonna make sure that we're ultra clear here, but that is twenty, six hundred, so we have a thirty percent price increase and what are we here? We're going to take forty, five hundred minus twenty six hundred, which is nineteen hundred. We're going to buy that by twenty, six hundred it's like eighty five who in the live audience tell us quicker way! So what I can already tell you here is that this is out of whack no matter what the actual number is it's around that, and so this number is out of whack and that's way too high, and what I'm wondering is how many of these packages did you book? None I booked my highest which we're not talking about and then the middle one in the middle one we'll talk about why you book that highest one but no one book this one and this is too much of a jump and that's what I would say this is way too much of a jump here and that jump is indicated by that price differentiation now this is a good job that's a good jump there this is way too far eighty five percent of price increase and you know it makes sense when we sit down and we think about it we're like, oh yeah if I'm a twenty six hundred to go to forty, five hundred that's a huge number and we don't think that that is photographers that are selling were thinking well twenty six, forty five I mean putting people spend more than forty seven dollars, all the time but remember it's all about the way you position it and when you position the middle option is twenty six hundred to goto forty five hundred just doesn't really work it's very hard to double that it's like the car example would be like saying about ten thousand dollars car budget and saying, well, that car you wanted twenty thousand dollars twenty five thirty it just doesn't work too well and so I just want to make sure that I point out the price differentiation issue that exists here you've got a great job of booking this package sixty percent of the time and that should tell you a lot about what your clients want when somebody when something it's book more than fifty percent of time, that is a big indicator and that stands out to me and it also tells us a lot about what they want just because that's what the book a lot of and you told me that there's usually some ad on so we can probably make some adjustments there, but there's a there's really a two step process here, we want to take our our packages or all acc are priceless in general that we had and look at how it compared to last year look at how it did last year, because that tells us some information that we need to know, and then we go from that to create our new price list. Some of some people online are not wedding photographers, you're mainly touching point geographer pricing, is this something we can take? These principles take two other genres of photography and yes, during wedding photography? Definitely yeah, you know, like I was seeing a little bit earlier, sometimes the numbers are going to change a little bit, but the theories do not change, they don't change as you go from from really not just photographers, but too small business in general you know, my dad was was joking with me a couple weeks ago, but he told me he's like, you know, your pricing presentation would be great for the government contractor that I that I that I consult for and I was laughing, I'm like I wouldn't even know what to say and he's like, just pull out all the photography examples and you know exactly what to say, but it was brought up a really great point, which is these these air? All these theories I presented to you are not just pricing for photographers it's all pricing theories built by fortune five hundred companies and what I've done is apply them back to not just a photography industry, but I used examples from weddings because that's what I know I don't want to give you an example from something that I haven't done, but what I do want to do is tell you that these principles price differentiation, starting price, the middle, the must haves they apply no matter what industry you're in even outside of photography and I think that's really important to understand and know because you're right, maybe the twenty five to fifty percent price differentiation is different when you go to a portrait model when you go to a product model when you go to an editorial model, and in fact I'd argue it definitely is different maybe you're saying yeah, I don't think package model works in the niche I'm in. You might very well be right, but that means that the ala carte model can work and you can still use the same principles. And when you're just getting started and you don't have experience in knowing what your client must haves are, how do you determine that? That's yeah, again, I keep saying this all day today, but that is a really good question because I told you, if you are brand new and you don't have anything to look back on, sorry, but I don't want to leave you hanging because there still are ways you can think about this and the ways you want to do it. The way you want to do that is to talk to people that mimic your ideal client, talk to people that and they might be friends, they might be family, they might be coworkers. They might be friends of friends, find the type of person that embodies that client. You know, we talked a lot yesterday about how to create a message that attracts the right kind of client that wants to book you find people like that, talk to them about your current price list and asked them which one they would book if they were getting married or if they were doing a family portrait session. Shin or if they were buying a piece of art for their home, which one would you book? Why? Why do you want to book that? Tell me more about that, remember, some things are not going to get a voice, they're not going to put a voice to all of their must haves, but you can start to dig deep and start to understand the buying patterns of people that fit your target market your target demographic, and you can use that almost in the same vein as we're using our past pricing, and you can start to build up a list of what people want, what you think people would have bought if you set up your packages and you kind of almost mimic what they would have bought, you can keep track of that and that's a great way when your brand new to go out and mimic what we have here in front of us with sathiah, who already has a year under her belt of doing this price list. All right, the next question up is from the entire world they want to know what was actually just a reoccurring theme here and it's, not just this class, I see it in other classes as well, and many, many photographers out there want to know, is it good to have your prices? You're beginning prices, your whole pricing structure on your web site or not, do we publish this so everyone can see that? Yeah, you know that's a great question that comes down to the way that you look at your business at the top level. I really don't think he wanted publish your prices because what you're doing is you're creating a disconnect between you, the authentic you and the you that represents your business and how much you charge for you and you're allowing people to experience it into different lights, they're allowing them to experience pricing and experience, view and who you are in two totally different circumstances in two totally different environments, so I really don't like the idea of posting it online. I don't like the idea of sending it to them over email, sometimes the situation does come up where that becomes the right thing if they can't come in to meet with me, I say, can I schedule a phone call with you and we can go through the pricing together? Can I walk you through it? And I sent it to him on the phone with them? Can I go through? What can we do a skype call if you can't make it? I totally understand, but I don't want to do is just send you pricing, I don't say that part, but I don't want to just send them pricing I mean, you know, there's there another is argument either way with whether you want to post something online about it, you know, do you want to post all of your pricing online? Do you want to post a starting price? You know, you know, average tara average client's spends this amount of do you want to just saying nothing? You know, the more you post, the less you're going to get in response as far as the numbers increase air concerned, the more information that you post, and so I love the idea of a hybrid if you're stuck like starting at most people, spend those kinds of things are good words to use that allowed them to get qualified so that they can feel like I don't want to get the phone call is guy, and I'm hoping he's three thousand he's actually twenty thousand or I don't pick up the phone and call this person to have it be a waste of my time. So putting the starting price a most you know, most couples spend most family spent most senior spend stuff like that helps guide them but doesn't give away enough information that they're not going to reach out and talk to you about it.