Photographing Kids: Part 2
And this is mohr personality wise like your personality is incredible the way you interact with these kids well I'm taking it that was some nice tio europol thank you um to me like that's not me right off the bat like I I I feel like I could do a version of that but it's going to be something that I learned to do and that I put myself out there I don't think you should ever do something that's a version of you what is more like you? Well, I'm not as out like the picturing myself doing all the noises and all of the like like out there amplified I have a beard I'm closer I don't know that but it's it's like I'm gonna feel like I have to learn to do that so what I'm asking you taught a positive thing therapy I think you look better no, I do want interjects I actually feel really strongly about this. Um there are some if I think about the probably ten most intriguing photographers I know uh no, not melissa right now because I don't know but if I were trying teo um their work is very differ...
ent and their style is very different and their interaction with their subjects is very different and if any one of those tried to be like the other one or tried teo get more in that vein we would have lost something in terms of seeing their work, you know, I feel like with kids that there's a certain amount of the bells and whistles of a personality that's needed. Yeah, I am gonna correct you, because for me this works because it's, my personality and it started working when I got really honest about my personality instead of tried to hide the embarrassing things I don't love listening to myself in going. I don't even realize how many sound effects make nicole was taping. This is like, do you make sound effects for everything? We're eating pizza? I was like, I guess I do, I don't even think about that that much, but me, if I were out there trying to be like you, don't let me be a little calmer, let me be less of a freak. Let me stop making so many noises I don't know that I'd be has lost in the experience of seeing who this child is and what our exchanges and reading him, I wouldn't be doing that as well, because I'd be so consumed with how can I be a less obnoxious version of me? You know too mean and so the sooner I dropped that is one more thing I have to think about, the more power I have to be able to focus the person I'm talking teo and so if you are going to be just completely what's, natural and comfortable to you um that just means you got to drop all that extra weight in terms of mind space and focus more on the exchanges you're having and showcasing things the way you see them, you know and that's not just like hey love yourself and be good kind of garbage that's that's what I honestly see time and time again and some there's some beautiful children photography out there of people I know are incredibly introverted and quiet and hardly interactive all they photograph but they see from a distance in certain unique, very beautiful ways and their work is stunning, so I I don't at all agree that you should try to get yourself beam or a version of something else that you see that you may think works and is that personality of yours? Does it just not work with some kids? It's because the personality well, remember what I said in the beginning, my personality needs to be adjusted to what I see there, so one aspect of I mean, I'm just like I say with kids all kinds of different personalities inside one child there there there's a personal type sure but there's a multitude of experiences and feelings and things they express I'm the same way like I remember writing this to you guys because I just did one of those do idealist whose personality typing I look a lot of study that I think it's fascinating like how we make our decisions based on how we process things which is not the same as how things are you know and and I think that when I do the personality tests on the extroverts introvert thing I come exactly in the middle like I'm really strongly jared and really strongly extroverted depends on where I am in the space I'm in so when I'm in these exchanges if I have a really soft quiet child who's gonna respond better to a softer tone and this and that I can I can do that because I'm responding to who they are you know and I'm not gonna be running around and eating their cookies okay okay okay ready for the internet questions yeah yeah okay so I thought this was uh pretty cute question uh chris david forty two in the chat room saying major question how do you deal with snot and drool I had so many pictures that are ruined by a really place not bubble or drool dripped yes that is a fantastic question and it's a day to day reality for me at least in most shooters um I have a big thing about wiping that off as we're going I usually well go ahead say mom, don't you get that dad, would you get that mom, I think it's your turn you know um and we're skating there all in four years back my hand wipe up is not and wipe it on the back of my pants and then somebody around me will be like, you're disgusting and I'm like, wow, I know it was that or spend two hours in voter shop you know? I mean it's a it's a time management thing, so I'm big on removing those elements a soon as I see them and one of the chutes coming up the family shoot, the little boy started getting upset and crying and then he got better and fine, but he had this one oddly large teardrop still in his eye and when I end up catching it later and that's just literally just telling him to blink and it got out but you'll see because the way the light's hitting him it's really obvious and it's something that I need a photo shopping and I'll show you both versions of it later but that sort of thing is just like it's ah it's a real every day, so I think rules not things in isan noses and I do a full face check before you start I look and I see you knows anything in eyes or you know how has it been looking? I do the same thing with mom to you know not for it's not for me but for like makeup and isn't out yet and I'll do things we're all just kind of rub makeup in a little bit I'm like I just think that you know you're fabulous but I'm have you write on you and I don't want to see any little lines and stuff and express it in a way that like we're all here together with one common goal yeah so when you're, uh when you're not connecting with the child and it's just the child doesn't like you or isn't receptive or whatever does it hurt your feelings or how have you practiced um to help it not hurt your feelings kind of it's not coming out right but do you ever take it personal or have you learned not to okay so I think the question is if you know I didn't know my general and this right here this right? So I think the question is if you were photographing the child and you feel like no matter what you do the kid does not like you do you take it personally or how have you learned to not take it personally? Did you not take it personally? Okay so there's an element tio every time we walk into shoot I'm thinking about what this perspective is like for the child, what they're experiencing and how they're feeling and if I have to think that in very short amount of time I haven't given him enough to not like me you know? So I don't think it's going to be about me I think it's going to be about things around us things that we're experiencing so in that respect I don't take it personally um I think it was the the byron katie quote was, um I believe everyone in the world loves me I just don't expect that they've all realized it yet something like that uh and uh and I think that's the element if you go in with the expectation that we're all going to like each other we're on the same page and you know, everything's going to be sweet and lovely you know I'm not saying that you're not gonna be wrong in some cases but unless someone really calls it out to me and says no this shit's not working because he hates you I'm I'm not gonna have my feelings are you know, because I feel like there's a lot of elements going on uh and luckily that's never happened that makes sense your perspective do I care whether or not they like me I said earlier that it may sound needy but I really really want them to like me because the shoot goes better so yes I care I also know that people express themselves in different ways I mean, we probably all known people that we had a whole long conversation with and everything went beautifully and um and or for you everyone beautifully but you couldn't read them you're like I think that went great isn't that later they're like know my god they loved you like because I like no that's just how they are you know? Okay, we have tons more questions but just checking to see if you want okay? So let's go on yes, well, what do you want to do one more and then we'll go to steal I love saying that name okay, add a question from tom on the roof because you mentioned in that last one when we were in the dark space that um you just wanted to get the natural light so do you ever when you're on location used flash for after sessions or light modifiers and um on camera flash for phil, I do use on camera flash fulfill you know, not very often, but if I'm in a situation like that one, for instance I would have pulled it we're running around the camera crew and I got one shoulder bag on and I didn't have it if I had it and I would sit right there part with a turn it on and use that for phil yeah, but if I didn't have that I was gonna use my reflector as best as possible and I do use reflector on every single sheet ideo now whether or not I pull it out every time is uh you don't use it in every single instance but probably every single shoot I do I've used it at one point during the shoot I'm a huge fan of reflectors and simply because I feel like they give me this wonderful way tio completely let my subject well with a super lightweight product you know on and I've gotten really good at I think you saw earlier was that was that the shooter jackson was bouncing on my legs was at the shoot yes the very getting did you guys see that I'm like you can do that in a way that you don't have to get a samaritan of course what you sacrifice there is any sense of looking like someone who's not a dork I mean you're you're given that up because you're but I'm out there with usually in a field or a park or the home with the kid in the family and I really care it's not the same thing like if I were doing a fashion shoot for instance why would I want to sit in the front row like fitz? But in that kind of instance I never care how I look it's not really part of the equation and a number of folks were asking earlier with regards to your reflector do you just use that one size and if so what size is it and then if you have a family do you have a bigger one than using um I have a lot of reflectors actually but the one I used most often by goto reflector is thie actually bruce door and one from west got which has got the silver shiny side and the other side don't you think god it's hard words uh stay low and stay fast and then just like did you hear that e I use that one because I think the light that comes from that soft side is a little bit a little bit more touch of warmth and I like that a lot most the time and then do everything shiny side the question was what what size was too it was this size good answer looking for you and it folds up so small what that looks like the forty two it was forty two and the if I do have the smaller ones that I might pop out if I'm doing a close up and I don't want anything that is that means because I wouldn't take a reflector everywhere I go but maybe in my run around back I might have a small little one yeah I use it for a family what I use a reflective her family absolutely bigger nearly always yeah because of the family when you've got multiple subjects with multiple lighting situations depending on their height and where they are relation to each other it's more important I believe he's reflected able to even out the light. One more technical question um from from melissa and twitter what about white balance when you're going from endorsed outdoors or is that all the way back and I should everything out of balance because I know I'm processing all my shoots and I don't want to have tio image that I want to have a consistent white balance for when I do my processing okay now we're going on to joy what's the thing I have to throw it audience members all right bring me sentence there's get the next one joy is suggesting a ball of tissues game okay all right we're onto seo um all I know that her she's nine years old and the celeste when she was trying teo gather subjects remotely yes you could use the little balls in the face I have warned I have warned that my life out of wicker ones because I'm so power hungry now in this I think that if they if they make any move teo and I feel that because they're strapped down because they get their funds on it they can't move much and they've gotta stay right there like none of you slept last night they all traveled it except jim native uh some of you on twenty hour plane rides the person I'm calling out which is kind of rude of me really you were awesome to come in your son's sick and I feel terrible that was e really think about it from your perspective um but anyway I'll keep one uh was there a question no, I was moving on you're moving on so seong, the only thing that we really garnered in terms of knowing about the personalities of these children was when I asked the less I like it be great to get a little bit of a range of personalities we could just kind of get a couple words to describe the kids because I wanted to go in blind but I didn't want everybody to the same personality type kind of lack the ability to showcase various personality types um and she said the number one thing anybody said was yeah, my child really sweet like the goddess of their varying personalities are all suite which is true but that is hilarious um but seong we know a suite and we knew she was nine um and uh is this where they came over and fix my audio? Ok, ok, yeah that's why you are nine I heard is that correct okay, so the first thing we're saying that you probably couldn't hear very well is she's going like this I say you go that's basic conversation is very good all right and that means third right? Excellent. I have a nine year old in third grade and she is reading and learning math and she's asking me to help her out with her math homework and I don't know how to do it cause it's getting harder I had this thought okay I don't know if you could hear that but I was saying that I also have a third grader a nine year old and I was talking about how the homework is getting harder and it's not I used to be a breeze passing go do that now mike uh what time's what that would be really cool to get a shot of you right over there and I'm shooting from over here it's all you have to do is go stand on whichever stare you think would look best for you and that's me giving the child of choice so that's a big thing I do a lot imposing is I let the child take the lead I let them choose the pose I let them set up who goes where andi tweak it to what I know will look best in a shot but um if I sit there and basically tell them what to do the whole time I don't have any ownership or buy in from them so I'm always saying what do you think they're there and I I need to be prepared to live with whatever choice they go with site choose to spot thing it'll be fine interchangeably that one that one that's the best one for you I think so too ok and how many times have you had your photograph taken like nine million times probably yeah probably um my thought because you're so pretty my thought is let's have you on your way we're going to get it so that we're gonna have facing this way a little bit and then turning this way I'm gonna be posing you ready and I'm gonna have you looking back at me and saying things like you're doing a great job tomorrow my news hammered by the way um because I really want a lot of like I want you to really support me you know sam so you don't give me a lot of sport let's see what you think was that was that on that's kind off this island, right? Which I do a better job. Yeah, you think I kind of know what I'm doing or not really how about this? You think that's a good closer maybe maybe I would hear you more room and I also what about that one that's pretty good right let's try it here so that's the shot we get like when I backed up I go what about back here that's pretty good toe looks and have you come in a little bit here I'm gonna try something really cool like what if we had you lean this way a little bit so with this child she's nine years old she's really engaged she's fun the two things I'm finding right out of the gate is that she is at two really interact very interactive that's the first thing that leaps out leaps out to me she's also probably going to be enough experience with the cameras that she's gonna pose a lot so the two things I need to do our keeper engaged and keep her from the cheese smile those the first and foremost things I want to do but because she's interactive what I say about interactive children that they're very malleable so I'm gonna pose her aa lot more than I did with jax I didn't pose jack's hardly at all clocked in places you know with with seong I'm going to be able to move around and go ahead and get a shot that I think is more attractive because she's such a pretty girl and kind of be ableto find like more s curves and more kind of shoulders here heads filled here, etcetera and as long as I'm constantly keeping this exchange going that's working all right gorgeous temple what do you see it? This is called leading lives okay she's the director okay, so if she's directing that she has to tell you where to stand, I think she's all right where should just dead what do you think that's a good spot and then do you where should you see and in relation to her right there but don't you think she should like snuggle you a little bit because you're freezing and what you see I'm as I'm having this whole conversation I'm changing lenses but I don't want it to be about that I want to be like we're having a conversation and whatever I do with my hands is relevant but what I'm doing with my hands is switching from the eighty five, which I just thought that last shot with this one out of camera I'm switching I'm switching from that to the four, seventy two eight because I'm a lot closer okay? And I'm just leaving thirty five from the ground with nice what did you do it this you should face her a little bit more I'm gonna completely just mess with your hair a little bit ignore me carry quit this racket there okay and then go ahead that t to do that that's remarkable is wait wait not not there yet, okay like this this looks really good now it's not gonna get the warm because it's for you okay there let's go all right so that's shot again they're snuggle up for warmth it's freezing two seconds before that she's doing this and when I told her a snuggle she got in tow a really relaxed lovely smile and if you can see because we've got different skin tones here I've got the reflector coming up this way and she's got a light coming coming from this way and I have to tell you that's a little bit of the extra advantage here my sons from ethiopia, my six year old and she's from ethiopia so I probably automatically was like crazy in love with her because she finds my son but I also have a nice advantage christian towns a lot especially self portrait so it's kind of helpful to realize where little quick things you can do to make the shot work really well for everybody in here and see what we'll see leaving five millimeter on the ground abby off yeah how cold is this? Ridiculous. Okay, ready let's get me of here. We're gonna do some really cool shots over here because you know why I have a feeling you'll be really good at it cake walk over here that's falling you're still raising me feeling you're not cold yet come up there and you walk it's also good to deny the child their own experience down in there and then can you think I need help getting up there way have you have appear whoa okay this already I'm gonna have you look out the window and you know what I'm doing right now okay what she faces she making geez yeah making cheese so let's see what I'm doing right now than spend a little bit of time talking to her this and that engaging trying to shake it up a little bit and get her in a way that we can get rid of the cheese smile that's all I'm doing right here I'm having her and you look fabulous and you're gonna look out this window at the trees and while we're looking at them you're gonna be thinking no thinking it so we got a lot of cheese going on right oh that is a good shot I'm telling you you have no idea so try try one thing little tree you don't have to smile it because honestly I think trees sometimes are offended by smiles look over beautiful and take a deep breath and let it out well and then try something where you put your hands in your pockets yeah and then you just you are sorry and I get this so it's just getting your hand in pocket this is right out of camera you could do some fun things based on what you want to dio um I see this shot when she's looking out the window hold on wait for it yes okay so I see this shot when she's again, this is at a camera exactly we've got with that kind of break in the background and some of the models things and stuff um I want to take that out of backdrop and I want to make a little bit more dramatic or I want to do something funky and give myself some room to play so I could either leave the shot as is I could put type in there I could suggest some sort of cool design piece before I go to print I'm gonna clean this up to make it a little bit more perfect. Um but there's a lot of options you could do right? They're excellent once you stay right there you're doing great. I'm gonna move but you're doing great memory lane her legs because it looks like the windows just on her it's going all the way down she's time going and I have the reflector down here at the base too he found some things that um okay, so let me just show you some of those other shots right there. I hope um from that section we had this full sorry man I was doing so well and then craig came by and said speeded up and I got panicked all right, so this is yeah so we got this these air just out of camera shots that thank you little whispered hush over there this this again you see the difference between a smiles right what we had before and how cool her red braces awesome. Um all right. We're back out here beautiful what? Ok, so the whole thing backs up when you back shots okay got it so we're going outside still freezing again if you can tell I've just met her a few seconds ago but I have no problem giving her a hug. Okay, freezing and she's a human child I want to see ok, this is a contest are you going? Are you cool your fingers okay, right. I want you to run up to that when you get the top two three jumper jax without without falling he do without falling and then run that wait. Okay? The whole point of this is I'm not really going for running shot starting like that I want to get her to warm up so I had to go back and forth like what, three times three times or something just gets going back does jumping jacks goes back and does what I say does jumping jacks and I'm getting a couple shots here and there and I got like one really fun, you know, being out of it but basically I need to bring her back a little bit because she started just really be very, very cold uh and so I get this fun shot out of it you know I get her in movement and having fun and playful dick girl I don't know what else to do your amazing what other if you had to choose one last photograph what do you think it would be? What do you think do you think we do like a really nice soft close up of you with your dimple so right okay, I'm gonna do this we do what we call remember remember what I told you a portrait was a portrait is just like a beautiful call calm gentle portrait uh you know why I'm doing this calm is another way to say let's not break your face by going cheese too much because you have such a ridiculously pretty face I want to see what with your hair up everywhere like you went all the way after just partially up you know, if you ever got your hair cut and sold it you make a ton of money just put that out there great way to go home, cut her hair, sell it on ebay or mom's gonna kill me uh all right. And then from here and a little more posing of you gonna fast forward and I am trying to break her than that look right there and look at that she slips into this that's true she does okay and she knows it looks good teo way get this beautiful we get this you talk radio you're just that good I mention down just a hair you're amazing. You did such a great job. Awesome it's a wrap she's fantastic. All right, that's it okay, that was gone. The future model and queen. Any questions about that shot right there? How much you love that? Dibble I love love love level and the expression is great and you're really tight. We got really tied on it and I'm worried about what? Uh what? What? This is a great shot that works okay, but it was a good question. They like a follow up question from jared with regards to the cheese factor. Yes. How do you suggest to the child that smiling with the which with cheese is too much and back it off a bit without getting a serious look? How do you suggest? Okay, so if you heard from the verb is in there, I was like, let's do a portrait and she said what's a portrait I said torture usually and now I can make up any definition. I want to get the end result I want, you know, because then later I could say actually another definition for portrait and that I could need to give the true under something I said, a portrait is basically we're never really call mes soft no a lot of like do they just bring down and I'm earing you know I'm saying try this if you do this can you do this I'm getting making this expression in that expression s o one of the best ways the number one best way to get away from the cheese face is to make them genuinely laugh that's being silly and that's being goofy and that's you know telling a joke or whatever the case may be that's number one way and even if they laugh for a second despite themselves and go back into the cheese you only need that one second click that's the second best way I think is to mirror and show them you want to try something different what did you do with the end because way couldn't hear the audio where you brought her back when she's sitting on the little rock fence at the very end she just she quit smiling with an open mouth did you see what did I say to her I said be awesome you're going to be creative live and I need you look really good great job um let's see what she's running she's jumping hold on wait for it what I say I told her that we could sell her hair on ebay for a lot of money and then we're doing dramatic yeah that's fantastic okay that's what it is I told her we're doing the dramatic and you say I'm ureter okay? And then one thing I'm fighting is I've gotta catch sight in this eye but not in that and I want to get cash like, so hold on catch light is basically with out there if you are out like a light in the light like this your eyes and you look at my eyes you see a little bit of a little bit of light my eyes like you see a little bit like light rise like white parts that's cash lights and sometimes you catch sight line and not the other and I want to see both of your cash like, ok, you don't do this part hey, this really brought out the cash lights were coming back to me remember, we're doing you're looking over that way and then you got to hear your base I've got a very base all right, ready to chin down just a little bit in the back towards me a little okay and beautiful already. Okay, you totally practice in the mirror. Don't you know that? More questions? Any more questions on that? You have more questions? Of course we do. You wanna go ahead? Um obviously didn't do any, uh, appreciate consultations for the hi my name is cameron, but do you normally and how much to prep your client or subjects part of shooting yeah okay there's there's two answers here one is the answer I would advise anybody starting out and getting up speed is and the other one would be how I do it the first one is to say that when I first started to speak and I really want to get good at this honestly three years ago if you came hurt me and workshop I would say I sit down with my clients I pointed to allison because she came to a workshop that I did the big huge thing anyway um the uh what I would say is um I have a list of about forty questions I'll ask my clients um about enough information I can get and gather to be able to personality type their child before ever meet them so that was how I did that as time progressed in such I realized that I wasn't as challenged are interested being able to walk in and know exactly was walking into and I wanted to be able to show up and figure it out so now I do know pre consultation whatsoever I find out statistic information birthday age that the um and I might say something like tell me something that you just love about your child you know um and depending on the person you're talking to that could take forever not at all um and uh and that's about it then I walk in and I ask all the time shins directly or I find out you know, basted they're much younger and rocking communicate I get all my information non verbally uh that would be my answer now but if I were just starting out and want to get really good at this I would take that path that I that I took because I think that gets you really it really nails in your head in terms of what you're looking for how many exposures for jack's first all wonderful pronunciation it's good I love it how much exposure? Like how many shots were taken? Approximately plus or minus thirty percent more like but the number of the count of total shots like thirty twenty five wait one hundred eighteen images from the day so divide that up appropriately for each of you don't take render those final that's your final choices or that's total clicks that's what I did if you kind of saw way only have one hour videotape wow, I think we need to speed it up. Um so uh yeah, I don't I didn't do a lot of clicks on this simply because I knew we were pulling everything out and I wanted to kind of show case and, um but in general I think I do click helpfully a lot of the clicks I do are for entertainment purposes for the child like yeah think of me you know, but uh yeah, I mean, the average amount of images that come out, the less I'm shooting. And the more precise I am about shooting, the less work I have to do. Um, yeah, actually give two clients how many images do it actually gives. It ranges instead, really, based on how much time we spend together and all of your stuff, I mean, anywhere from, uh, my sweet spot is somewhere between fifty, sixty or so, uh, but I've got two hundred and everything's fully edited, so it's it's to my advantage to deliver less and it's to my advance all the way around. Because then the clients are so overwhelmed. It's, very easy to overwhelm your clients for succession.