Advanced Bass Production

Lesson 9 of 18

Mic'ing the Cab

 

Advanced Bass Production

Lesson 9 of 18

Mic'ing the Cab

 

Lesson Info

Mic'ing the Cab

Basically what we've gone over so far as we went over setting up a base getting it in tune or a bunch of bases what have you getting them in tune um we covered slightly tracking very basic tracking which I assume anybody watching an advanced class knows how to track so I went through my editing work flow lightly which is obviously something you need to build upon to develop your own went through rift building and then we started making noise with ants got a couple pretty good tones which uh where we picked up with just a room mike and kind of got an idea of how they would work in different songs that we brought in now what I want to do is start talking about putting mike song cabs and what different likes d'oh the first time I ever went in the studio I was ah go singing for a band not very well mind you and we brought in a base head I was always the governor so I had all the gear and I brought my base heading my base cab even though I didn't play bass in the band like all right so we'r...

e going to make this up and he threw me don't nobody mike scabs anymore and he just plugged in most heads have a d I out on xlr out and you can just get the sound from that and he literally told me nobody mike's cabs anymore um and now this studio is one of my competitors in l a but ah, I was really it was kind of disheartening because it takes the whole recording experience away from you and why did we bring that two hundred pound cab? Um I like my king based cabs I used to not like making base cabs but I've realized to me there's something about getting on your hands and knees and really listening that sure you can get a good sound italy with impulses which we'll talk about we talked about a little bit and I think we're going to go into more tomorrow because it's very cool technology to have but there's nothing quite like putting a microphone on a cab and finding where it sounds best and messing with its very it's like I said with the d ies and white it would rather use something that a plug and it's more romantic it's that's really recording to me and I think it's exciting especially with the mikes that will be using right now really exciting mike's which is the nerdy thing I've ever seen in my life so why I use a mike on a cab is ah the tones more unique it's if you're going die out it's going to sound the execs close to the exact same every single time if you put a mike on a cab like we have a norman you eighty seven a yamaha sub kick we have a sure essam fifty seven then we might usually might not and then it odd x d six also we might use that we might not depending on what kind of time we have and what we start looking for um if you move annoy minute inch you're going to hear it but if you plug your die and there's three fins it's going to plug in the exact same way every time um it's not as exciting and then I have ah my third reason is you feel the vibe which is the romantic in me I get a lot of flak from my assistant for talking about vibe I think putting like something's is exciting I love mike hell of making drums I like my king which is where guitars or my favorite thing to record release everything to put microphones on um I love it I love the u eighty seven I love putting it on base cabs and that's why we brought that here so I guess before anything I'll kind of talk about my technique for playing putting mike son I don't know if I even have a slide yeah here you go for the u eighty seven what I like about it is I use it or any large diaphragm condenser doesn't have to cost three thousand dollars it could be a road or an audio technica something around two, three hundred bucks will get you so where you need to be for the most part I just had a choice because creative live was very nice to me and I chose what I would use in an ideal world has a full range sound cuts off a little bit on the low end of which I like because I end up using the die anyway um to me it replicates what a human years like and I'll show you an example before they do anything. I started my music career, my real music career playing bass my band always made fun of me because in plane and I really care about my tone, so I've been down, I listened to the amp and then I get back up in the er and I'm just messing with knives, messing with knobs and so I the way I wanted that I like a condenser mike is where I would bend over and put my head and where I'm on stage, what I want my cab to sound like. And so as you can see, I threw this u eighty seven up yesterday and I kind of put it where I thought I would bend over if I thought something was wrong with my info on stage, so what we're going to do now is we're gonna we're gonna go more subtle into a different session um go back into that more pop rock session and we're going to go through the sbt classic because I think that's the easiest to kind of decipher without like really dirty stuff up like I would love tio and kind of show how you eighty seven would record bass I don't know this is going to take me like three minutes if we have any questions or comments yet, but probably not kind of a common question. Oh pattan had said I suppose you don't track really loud with the u eighty seven will be more careful I don't I do live in a suburban neighborhood I don't crank camps really louder usually get a sound that, like I said, if I can bend over in front of the amp, I think that the mic safe if my ears don't blow out and I can still makes a record later that day so that's, my rule of thumb is personal safety and health. Ah yeah, I was just going to ask with a large dive famous or any ever like danger of blowing the diaphragm and they're like, if you put that on a kick drum, it would probably know that you know, I know a lot of people that use you eighty seven's on kick drums, obviously they're not putting it inside the kick but your kick outside mike a lot of dudes use that a lot of use the u forty seven um I'm gonna before I do anything with the empire going to move that mike away from it just to make sure that I can bend over in front of it without hurting myself, so I don't want to hurt the mike, but I guess sometimes I do things a little recklessly, I don't over think that at all, and I haven't blown out a diaphragm, so unless not be tracking two out yet, ribbon mikes are a whole different story. They can take loud noises, but if you send a phantom power to ribbon mike, which I don't use ribbons on base and they can also like you, khun bend the ribbon if you put too much in front of them. But phantom power room read in my family we use among guitars and room life's, and I am very weary of anybody but myself using my ribbon wife's air, setting them up like that, but I'm generally have less concern for condensers. I'll have concern for that one because it's, expensive and not my own t I sorry, will I find this d I we're looking for that. I wanted to give a ah shout out to mark zero from the chat room with who referencing the stringing and tuning segment from earlier in the day and said the tedious but the most important part uh and I want to thank him for pointing it out because as we've stressed million times, so we don't get that part right? You can't do any of the fun stuff it's sure gonna be fighting at the whole time and go where is the high end? Like, why, you know we're fighting it the whole time we wanted you to try to fix things with the q and compression and stuff like that that are not fixable with the cuban compression, you're angry, frustrated and mad and you will say, I wish I would have listened to andrew glover and nail levy and andrew wade and finn mukendi and all these other cranky old guys that told me and change my strength when everybody said, do that not fun stuff. All those people who know what they're talking about told me to do it. I wouldn't listen, but it's true change my wife, yeah, it's like when your parents tell you to do something or you're older siblings, my sister says, save your money, don't waste money on stuff and I end up broke because I bought I don't know an amp or a couple of lamps or a handful of amps she's usually right, and I feel like that's, her area of expertise is being a motherly sister. So I'm doing this ah my output set up again because it didn't transfer over to this session I apologize but now I know what I was what I'm doing so I'm good okay okay really well on this new thank you said his name was pastor tom was that his name? Um the guy in the chat room yeah mark zero but close another guy that talked about moving not tracking amps allowed because I just wanted him to know that I moved the mike out of the way in case they have comes out too hot so far the speaker cables are very elusive. Okay, I'm gonna show something that I didn't really think to show um crawling pulled up there when I ramp attract I've talked a little bit about phase accuracy but not a ton I usually I put a snare sample at the very beginning so that I have a very sharp transient to align the rest of the song too. So that because obviously there's going to be a degree of late and see once I go out of the box through the converter today and back into the box so I think that's something aa lot of people realized but maybe some people don't and that's what I'm doing with this definitely intended to and I just used the tap to transit that I talked about earlier to make sure that that's near starting right away you guys heard that, right? Okay, so I'm also going to turn it down. It will be easier on the amp in the microphone when I just make sure this is playing through and then I'll move that mike into place, so what I'm going to do is assume that since I was able to put my head up against that speaker without crying or any sort of discomfort that it's ok, usually like I said, I would probably record hotter, but I'm more wreck plus with my own stuff, so play this again and kind of move it to where my head is all right, let's track this I just wanted to basically when placing mike, so I think it's kind of common sense, but the closer you and our into the center, the harsher your tone is going to be, which is less the way in placing that since it's a much less focused mike it's not as big of a deal, but it gets within sm fifty seven who becomes a lot bigger deal? You can see it's not coming in very hot, so I'm giving it morgaine that's closer to the level I want I'll go into kind of compressing a little bit probably tomorrow as well because you can compress before you send out to the ramp I never compress a die on the way in just because I want compressor generally teams that transition attack that was so important to me and editing so I get asked that assistance have asked me that in bands like why don't we tracking through blah blah blah compressor and usually people that ask that question or knob turner's like I spoke of but there is I track my dies drive because I want to maintain the transient response you can use a compressor view slow the attack the accentuate the transient but that's a risk as much as I like committing that's a risk that I'm not going to take I'm gonna want to preserve my d I and then worry about it later another note that I didn't mention is I have the u eighty seven on omni which that way for anybody that understands should talk about polar patterns at all can I draw on this piece of paper yeah just have him call so the u eighty seven can work a couple ways generally and would this apply just to you a seven or there are other mike's like this never like this too yeah so there's two three ways I am really should be drawing the u eighty seven can pick up the cab it's a speaker that's a speaker that's a speaker you guys want to look at my driver I need a white board like a real teacher but this is generally how most mikes are their cardio oid it's shaped like a heart I didn't draw heart because like I said, I'm not going to drawing it just picks up what's in front of it so any buildup is coming in front of it as well figure it is another polar pattern available on the u eighty seven two picks at what's in front of it and then a phase reverse version of what's behind it and that's I use that on room lights and guitars cabs sometimes what I have now is omni, which picks up basically a full sir turtle. So for me since my ideas what I'm hearing in the room with the u eighty seven the reason I put it in on me is because it most accurately refresh really that reflects to me what's going on in the room and that's because I want a three dimensional picture of my basic it's our I want it to sound like it is in the room, not just a focus picture of the speaker I want to focus picture the speaker that's when I start pulling out the s m fifty seven or s m seven a million other mike's, but for the reason I'm using the u eighty seven primarily is because of its omni function and now I can really have this is there an advantage or disadvantage to using multiple mikes on the same cabot the same time get different flavors and we'll probably go into that the thing the problem you have is the distance that you get you starts at phase issues where your waves don't align, which we'll work is another picture in a second, and I'll kind of explain that, and I'm gonna do another run through of this through this uptick. I don't even know how it's going to turn out for such a clean base tone but it's worth messing with? You really killed it on this far thank you did a good job. I don't even know if this is your flame, but I'm gonna say it isthe hopefully the rattling doesn't get intothe this is gonna be the best part in part best sounding part because it's the only part that I actually went in and edited, I'm remembering hee hee hee! God, I'm going to call it that because this song is very verse course and I don't think we need to hear the verse or the course again not that I don't like this on in case my friends are watching. Um, what's, we're gonna listen back to that and hear how it sounded very quiet so that's kind of I guess that shows that I don't know if we have any questions from people about that it all are the use of omni versus cardio later, and there were there's a variety of different questions around the idea of mic placement versus, like center. Like off on access, like distance you can you just kind of talk about a few serve rules. You thought about that? I'll talk first. We'll do let's do it at some fifty seven after this before the sub kick. But basically, this is almost dead center it's just and it's you can see it's far back. And what, ten inches or so so it's just giving you what the cat sounds like a ce far as I'm concerned, I guess you could get it a little bit further back even if you if we're dealing with a room when I'm not sitting next to the amp I've done at sound temple, I'll put a nominee my two feet away from the bass amp, and at that point, I get to crank it a little more, which obviously is my shit. Um, but this it's I just throw it up. It's a nominee, my haven there's no rule for me about like, an sm fifty seven on the lot more meticulous, and I'm like sliding it around and really thinking with this, I'm I'm not thinking at all. I'm putting it where I think I bent over and put it, one of my head was and I think I don't want to call something full proof for the right way, but it's for me, it's foolproof because it's, what I heard when I bent over there and when I came back and I sit down at my desk or sit down in the control room or put headphones on it's like, ok, I'm sitting in front of that amp again with other microphones, other microphones yet, which I'll show that more is it is nuanced as it is with guitars or yeah, very much so, and I think that for my experience with bases, its a lot other than with the u eighty seven getting ah close mike on the cab to sound good is even harder than guitar and it's so it's into that point, it's something that I can't even I'm going to do it, but to get gas centimeters, you just gotta try and geologists, right? You've got to be there, and it depends on your speaker and how it reacts, but all are definitely I'm going to get down there in a second, but it's, not the larger diaphragm condenser is in a sensitive and that's kind of what's cool about it, and I'm probably going to start using it on guitars now that I just thought about how much easier I find that to be, um but once you're using a d six or a four twenty one or an sm fifty seven or an sm seven it becomes a lot more meticulous of motions and what not and obviously we were limited on time so I'm not going to crawl around there for forty five minutes but it's not rare for me to spend an hour or more on an sm fifty seven getting it on the place or d six getting it toe work correctly with the bass speaker so hopefully that covered their ah question on mic placement with that also we have ah note from mark zero that ryan the catharsis studios guys apparently in the chat room so if that is the case ryan hello. I love your impulses thank you very much for making him yes hello, ryan hurry. I'm glad to have you here. I hope you're not talking shit about me on facebook right now. Um yeah and I you know, I really can't plug him enough. I think ryan made those like five years ago and I know I'm sure he uses them a lot and I know tons of awesome producers and engineers that use them all the time which is pretty cool how widespread something he did in his bedroom at his parentshouse in broken arrow oklahoma turned out and brian is a killer producer and engineer as well, so fifty seven time I'm going to move this out of the way even though I think it's the best bass guitar mike of all time it does not serve a purpose for us right now though, and this if we can get kind of a close up what finn was talking about with the placing like got close mike generally I don't have a flash like going on um if you can see this I go for right where the cone meets the uh I can't think of the words right now on brain parting I'm sure somebody in the chairman will know but just the seam around the cone and this is generally my starting point is right at the scene the surround is it the tone in this around? I don't know I should google it mark zero a same dust cap that is what I was looking for thank you, mark and mark is on fire today yes and fifty seven on a lot less worried about being close on the uh and if it breaks it's one hundred dollars not that they're pretty indestructible like the radio gear I have use them as weapons thrown in that people throne amid drums and they've I don't really break that input for that's we're going to record that and hopefully they'll hear it back okay, I think the mike's picking that up so this one seems to be coming and water you see, I see how the transient scott a little bit off, and if you look like right here versus right here, the waves there, the exact opposite, so they are out of phase with each other right now, so I'm going to scoop them back by trimming him a little bit and now like that, one's a little bit more locked into place accurately assuming you guys can see what I'm talking about right, then let's, just listen to that fifty seven track for a second for fifty seven, sounding pretty good and pretty like wide range because usually I get a lot more focus, which, if I screwed that more into the centre, which we might try, gives you just a tighter high end, less lowland but here's, what the fifty or the eighty seven polled in which really gives us more body on call this bad wind that's? What are the odds so here's without the eighty seven a lot of tear and that's a third dimension? I'm talking about baby seven unbeatable for that just kind of brings cab into your life where it's like this sounds like a base, but it's doesn't offer the same experience to me, but then if I lose the fifty seven it's a little less focused, but I'm not crying about that, where is the eighty seven? I feel like to me after using eighty seven and then taking it out if I have it in a record I mean it's like you just broke up with your girlfriend or your grandma died there's an emptiness in your soul that you can't replace I'm trying to think what else so lets on since people have some questions about mike placement just for for reference like so for the fifty seven track let's say that you listen you know I want a little bit more presidents or I want a little less presidents what I was getting more presence right now yeah, sure let's let's let's say you know like he said it really hear a lot coming from that track let's say we want this one to be our bright presence okay track let's put it dead center and see what we get thank you for that segway we're also going to hear a lot less diversity in the mike movement on this because we're dealing with a pretty mild we're dealing with the vanilla republican of ah base sample fires right now but that will work for our needs e my noises coming from that but all right let's try this one out and see we should have a lot more presence now when it eventually gets there after the queen guitar intro yeah I realized once I moved them mike away closer it was coming really hot so let's listen to it now we're gonna need an amp with more disgusting tone so that we don't just keep getting standard sounding, huh? Yes more focus for sure this's still the one for me every time but definitely differently combined once we go when we got the fifty seventy, eighty seven and the d I r really starting to like pull together and the cool thing that's what they want and what we're going to do and how much time we still have an hour or am I looking at this wrong? Okay ah quick question when you're when you're layering tracks like this do you generally pan them? Not with base with guitar right get more creative base usually for me lives hedges said it all the time usually yeah, I feel like because if you had, you could do it in the way where no matter what the wave is going to be the same even though it's getting affected by an amp so you might get some weirdness but your effects of panning one take out even if it's like say, we're going that like weird guitar out and we have a fifty one fifty over here hardpan in a mason boogie hard panned since it's one base it's going to end up sounding like it's dead center so there's to me I know there might be people that do it a different way in a life those inconsistencies between the two lamps on the one performance might really do it for him, but I've never experienced that and I also I've never double tracked a base other than in this session where I wanted to show the difference between guitar's like I've never used to separate based performances and a record I know a couple guys that do and I just think it's pretty weird because the base wave is such a big thing compared to like a guitar way that it takes up enough space where you don't need to panic it's going to be everywhere if you put it in the center and that's enough for me, I feel like if you're getting to the point where you think about doing stuff like that, then you probably made a mistake somewhere else yeah there's there's a way to beef it up I just think that's kind of a master kiss thing to like I don't really like editing base I do it and I know how to do and I want to do it to make it sound good but base is harder to add it for me then guitar so I don't know why you would want to do two basis because in your editing twice god forbid he screwed up and he got a tune it twice double the expensive string there's just no there's no benefit to that for me um well, that's, uh, church let's, work on that heavy son. Tomorrow, I have another song, that's going to be in my kind of mixing segment, where it's a recorded that's. What the sands and I don't have a d I somebody use ideally you cem impulses or some tricks and e q and kind of ah, show that if you're given limited options, you can still accomplish what you're looking for. And hopefully, like introducing the third song will make everybody leszek of today's two songs. Um, that one has vocals as well, so I don't know if that's good or bad, but it's something.

Class Description

Everyone knows that bass guitar is the foundation of a great modern rock mix. It’s the unsung hero that holds the entire track together. Join Winds of Plague bassist and Soundtemple Studios founder Andrew Glover for a course dedicated to providing you with everything you need to know to record, edit and mix great modern bass tones.

Drawing on his 10+ years in the music industry, Andrew will guide you through tracking and getting tones using real amps and amp simulators. Plus, you’ll learn the secrets of editing and mixing bass that will take your tones from good to great including tone layering, eq/compression, and much more.

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