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How to Hire, Train and Manage a Rockstar Growth Team for Your Business

Lesson 18 of 28

The Great Testing Tempo Myth

Ryan Deiss

How to Hire, Train and Manage a Rockstar Growth Team for Your Business

Ryan Deiss

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Lesson Info

18. The Great Testing Tempo Myth


  Class Trailer
Now Playing
1 Class Introduction Duration:18:01
3 What Is a Growth Team? Duration:07:09
5 Types of Growth Teams Duration:08:45
8 Growth Acceleration Process Duration:08:00
9 Focus on the Goal Duration:05:29
10 Analyze the Opportunity Duration:08:40
11 Brainstorm Possible Solutions Duration:18:46
12 Prioritize the Team's Ideas Duration:05:25
13 Demo: The Growth Idea Sheet Duration:09:34
14 Run the Test Duration:16:51
15 Report the Results Duration:02:53
16 The Tools We Use Duration:06:13
18 The Great Testing Tempo Myth Duration:05:47
24 Make Any Essential Hires Duration:16:38
25 Get a Quick Win Duration:03:55
26 Get an Integrated Win Duration:02:17
28 Formalize and Announce Duration:02:57

Lesson Info

The Great Testing Tempo Myth

Now let's talk about testing tempo. Again, we're still thinking about this culture of optimization, so we got like, okay, we really need to establish culture of optimization, it needs to be baked into the values, right. Now I want to be careful that we don't go the other extreme of all right, test, test, test. It's gotta be this constant thing, because on one hand, people don't have a culture of optimization at all, and the other hand, it's like this faux-bizarro-always-be-testing kind of thing that doesn't sustain itself very well. So I read recently, I think it was a blog post, and I've seen this so many times. A five percent improvement in conversation rate every month nets an 80% improvement over a year due to the nature of compounding returns. Now, this sounds really, really good. It sounds really, really, really good. In my experience, this idea of do a lot of little tests and over time they will compound. It sounds good, but it's a logical lie. It sounds incredibly logical, oh, ...

if we just do a whole lot of little-bitty tests, whole lot of them, they're eventually going to compound, it's a logical lie. You can pull it off if you're a great big company with a whole lot of traffic and a whole lot of testing budget, but in general, the fact is, most tests lose or deliver no significant results over time. That is the reality of optimization. That is the reality of testing. Most tests lose over time. Our director of optimization, the person who really is in charge of this, who now, once we had this realization that we don't want this siloed optimization, he's now beginning to lead our entire growth team, Justin Rondeau, says "A 30% win rate is damn good." That's what he says all the time. You be right 30% of the time, it's like baseball. Baseball, you get on base 30% of the time, you're an All Start, right? That means you struck out a lot. And the key here is over time. When you're talking about a five percent win rate. When you're talking about a five percent winner, something that got you a little five percent improvement, a five percent win in January is rarely still a five percent win in December. These little wins, these little slivers of a win that you think are compounding, they have almost always reverted fully to the main within a matter of weeks or months. The win that you thought was there wasn't there, and instead what you have is an insignificant increase and a colossal, colossal waste of time. So most tests lose. It's not about picking, doing a whole lot of little tests. And that's why the volume of tests should not be your goal. I don't recommend that with your growth team you have as a key metric how many tests did you run. We did that, we tried that. It failed, miserably. We incentivized our people to do a lot of tests, which meant they picked a lot of little tests. A lot of little ideas, a lot of things that could be implemented quickly. Which meant no break-through whatsoever. The volume of tests is not the goal. Testing tempo is not the goal. If you go out and read a lot of stuff about this, what I'm saying right now is a very contrarian idea, and I have no doubt that we have conversion rate optimization people and stuff like that who are probably in the chat being like, that's crazy. And you know what their arguing with, math. They're using math to argue, and if you just go with math, you're right. I have this pesky thing called experience, and we've done this, and I can tell you, it just doesn't work. It assumes that you have an endless amount of resources to run as many tests as you want, which you never do. It assumes you have an endless amount of data, to reach statistical significance in a moment's notice, which you only never do. And it assumes that these little-bitty wins hold over time, which they only never do. So it's not about volume. The goal is to run tests that truly move the needle. We are looking for needle-movers. We are looking for the things that actually have the chance of delivering a break-through. If you're going to invest the time, the energy, the effort of rolling through that process, that giant process we talked about. I mean, it's a pain in the butt. The growth accelerator process, and doing all the reporting? God dang, fast forward to the end, when you're putting together a report on what just happened. There better be something kind of cool in there, people are like, "Oh, that's neat." It's like, "Oh, we just did that? "We changed the background color? "We gotta report on that now?" Come on, right? So what I want you to think about this is in terms of ask yourself is this a variable that whispers or is this a variable that screams. That's the terminology. Again, when we think about establishing a culture of optimization and growth, having this set of shared terminology and ideas. If we begin to ask that question, "Okay, guys, sounds good. "Is this a variable that whispers "or is this a variable that screams?" I want to make sure it's screaming. And these different phrases that I'm giving you are there because so often people want to again just throw math, they want to throw numbers at it. I'm not opposed to math, right I'm really am not. Being opposed to math would be kind of strange, but I'll tell you, you can use statistics to prove dang-near anything you want to prove. At some point, you have to let logic and wisdom intervene. So let's pull out a bit. Think about this, guys. Is this a variable that whispers or is this a variable that screams? If we're screaming, then we can move forward. If it's a variable that whispers, then we shouldn't. So don't worry about testing tempo. Don't worry about the rate at which you're testing, don't worry about the volume of tests that you are doing. You can get there. You can grow over time. As you have the capacity to do more tests, do more tests, but don't have tempo and volume be the goal in and of itself. Make sure that when you look back you say those were worthwhile tests that actually moved the needle. We're constantly looking at variables that scream.

Class Description

It's a fact of life in the world of business: Sales and marketing teams just don't get along. But in order for a company to be successful, it's imperative to find a way for all parties to work together toward a single, overarching goal.

According to Ryan Deiss, founder and CEO of DigitalMarketer, the answer to this eternal conundrum is to develop a "growth team”—a cohesive unit that brings people together to minimize conflict and maximize revenue.

This course will take you through the step-by-step process of building a growth team, including how to establish an organizational structure, identify metrics and KPIs, and create meeting agendas. For companies wanting to take their business to the next level, this course is a must.

In this class, you'll learn how to:

  • Identify the four roles and eight critical skills that define the modern growth team.
  • Audit your existing team and fill in the gaps.
  • Structure your team to maximize communication and accountability.
  • Prioritize growth ideas and align your team to the same strategic goal.
  • Develop the structure of growth meetings and decide on their frequency and who should be in attendance.
  • Launch a growth team in both new and legacy businesses.
  • Eliminate the conflict that's inherent between sales and marketing teams.
  • Improve internal communication.
  • Identify the metrics and KPIs that actually matter.


Scott Nelson

Course was amazing! I'm a startup founder & the content was perfect for stage of our company. Ryan is a fantastic presenter & I found both his delivery as well as his ability to answer pointed questions to be extremely helpful. I'd recommend this to any company looking to build a growth team!

Marvin Liao

This was an incredibly helpful class & i found many of the frameworks & suggestions immediately useful. Well worth it.

Ato Kasymov

Amazing class !! Really complex issues are simplified and put together in a systemic and practical way !! Just take into work and reap the benefits !!