The entire premise of the course most kids don't do posing, um, this was this course was actually built off a book way. Actually, I have the posing playbook, which I put out last fall, and I was talking teo craig swanson, co founder of creative eye, than we were talking about the fact that it wouldn't it be great to kind of try to bring it to life like, yes, you can have the book when you're out and about on shoots, but the whole premise, the book and the whole premises course is they don't do posing, and the irony is when people call my studio, they say, I love the work, and I love how it's all imposed. The irony is, it's not imposed its very post, it's just posed with the idea of working with children. When I have a child, walk up to me and pick their post and unfroze shot, this is usually what I get for that is a npo post, you know, and there's not a lot wrong with that, you know, it's, awesome expression, clean lighting, technically well shot. Um, this is what I typically tend to g...
et when I go for an unpublicized look in my experience, so I think some of the factors that go into play, and if you done this if you worked with children sometimes it can seem like an act of congress to get them to just stand up and put their hands on her hips like just just do that you know, just to give them that place and still have eye contact and all that sort of thing but it's certainly better from where we started with I also get this a lot when you're talking about imposed the I have to pee look, you know, children just grabbing parts of their body they are where they are I had a three hour shoot once with a little boy who just really was fascinated with his part on the idea of trying to work with him to just say one of just one out of the hands it was a lot of type cropping and interesting angles and photographing back you kind of gotta work with what you got but I have been as rest mentioned I have been photographing for ten years I've been teaching for five hours five years and but I'm photographing thousands of portrait sessions I photograph quite a lot children quite often and in that time I've also photographed a number of adults and it always amazes me when I photograph adults and they just do what I say like really you're just going to do that and I don't have to like wipe anything off your face that you come clean um and sparkly and you smell good you're not pooping on may I mean that's amazing I love it even people who have exceptionally little time I should explain this next slide I had to take it out of I had a photograph that I took of the obama's and I love it but I don't have they didn't sign a license for me to use it on creative live that I actually couldn't believe that that they didn't take the time to do that but it illustrated my point that even people have extraordinary little amount of time in still respond and do what you need in the short amount of time you have this is normally what I have in a short amount of time with the child one of the things that was very interesting about our pre shoots is we had a very little amount of time to shoot it and you'll see that on our live shoots too and that provides an extra challenge I'm not sure what kind of time you a lot for your photograph session photography sessions with kids but I find that the more time I have the more I could knock out issues and really kind of move into something with more flow so it's one of the suggestions I give you is give it more time than maybe you currently have a lot of I talked a lot of doctors who have maybe a forty five minute sessions scheduled and I think that's that's rough you're kind of set yourself up for a little bit of a tougher go and it's not that in my sessions or about two to three hours I'm not photographing for two to three hours that includes breaks and collapses and temper tantrums and potty breaks and whatever you need on dh so that the session is kind of flow like this and the shots are being taken here and a couple down here if you get my curve but it's trying to rush it all in and a short amount of time is up with a lot of shots like this all right so we're going to go to that little video I talked about a little video that just further illustrates what I mean when I talk about posing children you're not really utilizing all the commands as easily as possible you have to interject a lot more so this is ahh mom and her little boy split screen nothing I mean we didn't put together um any significant lighting I think we had little elsie like l c d lights popped up and we kept the camera angles to the same angle so they weren't even the angle that you would necessary shoot from I think there might even be one or two physical shots in here but they weren't processed means so this is really rough organic exactly what isthe as if you were there I help you I'll help you right here we go. Oh, but I got you please do me a favor and put your weight on your back foot yep. Excellent and they go ahead and lean florid slightly at the chest four is that a perfect and then imagine swirling your hips a little bit to your left wall yep. And then hook your right hand in your pocket and then shit out a little bit and then down and then shoulders just a little bit more towards the wall that left wall yep roll roll your shoulder up a little bit and in perfect in a little bit more towards the wall. Yes, very good. Excellent. Here we go. We're gonna try another pose. Be ready. You ready? Okay. Now do me a favor and turn completely away from the camera. Yep. And then, um go ahead and kick your left hip out quite a bit. Yep, like quite a bit and that your shoulders are still facing directly away from me and then put your hand in your left pocket your left hand in your left pocket and then pull your right hand up to touch the back of the right top your shoulder right hand up to touch such the right hand and your right hand and a very good and then completely turned back to look at me at the camera yep, very good. And then go ahead and give yourself space to turn a little bit more so you can move your legs a little bit more and then that left hip is really far out. Yeah, very good. Chin up just a little bit. There we go. All right, do me a favor and cross your leg. Put one leg over the other excellent. And when you crash your leg, imagine like you're actually not putting any weight down. So you don't you're not naturally doing it. You lift your leg up just a little bit. Yep. And then you're going toe take your arms exactly as they are and lean forward very nice and then lean for just a hair more and then put your chin out a little bit and then down a little bit. Yes, very good. And then relax. Very nice. All right, so do me a favor and pull your left leg up really high. Yeah, like, really high and then actually kicked that knee a little bit over the other knee so it's at at an odd angle? Yes, exactly. It doesn't feel good, but that does not matter. And then pull your left arm completely over your left your pull your right arm completely over your left knee yeah, and then bring it down just a a little bit more you're gonna lean forded the chest just a little bit more and then that left arm of yours is gonna tuck under your right arm yeah there you go beautiful. I love that in your lean forward even just a hair more almost the point where you're falling off the chair all right excellent to be a favor and pull your knees up completely like you're hugging them to your chest yes and cross your legs at the ankles very good and then you're gonna lean ford quite a lot like almost to the point yet very good and then pull your arms out you're not actually hugging yeah try try this try this try dropping them in the middle of your legs is that possible if your arms are crossed yeah like that and then lean forward even more even more very good without falling excellent very nice go ahead step off the back of the platform to give you the opportunity to lean forward with your arms over the chair yep completely and then kind of pull in a little bit towards me here we go and then you could really stretch forward search forward and then down yeah then chin up just a hair there we go beautiful excellent and leave ford with your arms out like it's a chair and then you could look at me it's kind of your grade all right, that's it okay love that that it was very funny so far today this is just hilarious and then yellow flowers that's hilarious and all too familiar. Yes, yes and this is really difficult because we tried to do just verbal instructions no mirroring and she was so good about it cause I was like and then you know you then you just I'm just trying to tell her and she she did such a great job and so did he you could see he was actually trying the fact that he stayed in frame for a lot of it was tremendous, but I mean, it illustrates the fact that you're just it's not the same thing at all in terms of what you're doing um and big thank you to them for jumping involuntary to do that um okay, so rules opposing and what works with kids because it's different styles different the goal of a pose is to flatter the subject. That is your goal. That is what you're going for when you pose your subject and the goal of posing kids is to show what they not only look like but who they really are like show more of their spirit and I think in terms of the type of talk I like to do and I think a lot of charts you like to do is their personality you really want to showcase a lot of their personality but doing and physically flattering way as well, I think if you look at, uh those steps that I went through with her when I was saying do this do this do this adds way too much that was way too much for any sort of kid, so what we want to do is figure out how to take those steps, mirror them physically, moved them ourselves, do it for them and shrink that down to like a third of the amount of words that I'm using so let's talk about the actual posing rules, what we really want to think about in terms that any time you want to flatter a subject these poles imposing rules are going to come into three categories and I'll walk you through them as we're going one this is a great rule don't break it ever do whatever you can to adapt your subject to make this rule work it's going to be in that category or it's going to be in the category of it could go either way. It depends on your subject and what they're doing. If you need to follow this rule or number three, it doesn't matter all with kids it does it's not even relevant with children if you're trying to force children into this posing rule, you're missing the point because it doesn't apply to kids so it's going to be one of those three categories? Um, I think in terms of this rule breaking the cheek line, the posing rule is that when you have a subject somewhat in profile, you don't want their nose to break the other cheek line so when they're turning, if you see her nose has broken the cheap line and that is opposing no, no, when the reason for this rule is that you especially if you have a particularly self conscious subject who's self conscious about their knows you don't want to overemphasize it by breaking the chief klein you can do that, you actually can exaggerate the size of a nose and that's the reason for the rule it's a good rule with kids especially if you have a kid coming in with a cute little tiny button nose and it doesn't matter it doesn't matter and you don't have to worry about it as much does it matter if you were entering this print into competition? Yeah, it's don't matters they'll still care but for everyday marketing and sales sales your client and to show something really lovely this is a rule that I would put down as you can gauge it by the kid and not worry about it or worry about it, but that is the rule that would be my opinion all this should be prefaced by the fact that it's moving um but in a normal situation, if you have a subject laughing and playing, you're just going to say just a little bit more towards me and then you don't break the chief line not that I think this subject to worry about because she's also gorgeous and I don't hardly ever worry about kids, but if I know it's a quick little adjustment or if I just step to the side a little bit and I fix it, then I d'oh shoulders shoulders air huge imposing because they're literally the largest part of your body the shoulders are structurally the largest part of your body and with kids that's really true because kids tend to come smaller, they come to cut that come to small size and the face and the head of the subject is supported by these shoulders, so where they go is really significant and everything is connected to everything that's funny, that was the premise of my health and energy course that I gave you a couple months ago everything is connected to everything here it's physically true, like if I move this, this will move if I go like this, this will move everything that you move on a subject will move something else, and especially if you've got them set up in relation to a lighting, you've got to consider that every movement is going to move something else so in a in a subject like this, if you notice she's got one shoulder turn more towards the camera than the other, that is the easiest way to work it with children is to have them go a little bit this way a little bit that way, if you saw in this last shot encouraging swinging of the arms every time they swing the arms everything's connected everything the shoulders will move. So when I have kids run and dance and you'll hear this and some of the video we show, I tell them to swing their arms, move their arms, move their hips because I know it'll automatically shift their shoulders and if I tell them, hey, do me a favor and move alternate one children so it's a little close to the camera, I don't get it, I get it weird, you know? So if you think about it in a more natural context, you move something that the shoulders are attached to, which is the arms um in this sort of image, I have a shot from the posting playbook where I'm literally mirroring and I physically turned my shoulder while I'm talking to her and I don't say do this, but most kids will do a visual version of simon says, if I'm doing this, why I'm talking to them unconsciously mirror me just because they're following along so I start with that physical spot and then I just expression next good expression next yes, global instruction allow girl memory is just there's there's definitely talking I'm definitely speaking the whole way I'm doing it, but I realized that half remember when I said that I had it was very difficult for me to do that split screen video because I was just saying the words to her that's very difficult versus you know, physically showing her and what I often do is we'll get in the spot that they're in do it first and then have them go sit in that spot too and then and then talking through it again that's the easiest way to do it what I was trying to do is just you work use words to answer your question, which was it? Do you just mirror or to use words to? I'm doing both because the mere ing goes ahead and eliminates about two thirds of the words and I want to use less words because it's too much for kids it's similar to try to follow along in another language think about it that way if I'm trying to follow along in french and you come at me with a whole paragraph I might hear train station I got that, but if you use two words and one of them is train station I know go to the train station it's the exact same sort of thing with kids use less words so they'd get it more quickly and they can respond to just those words because the attention spans um and then you're the rest of it give them the visual clue for the rest of it um really simple to is telling kids to put their weight on their back foot depending on the age of the child will either understand that or it doesn't make any sense the other thing I say is toe you know act like a flamingo be a pirate you know make the noise and by them doing that they naturally put their weight on the back foot because a pirate always has a peg leg of course every one of them and no not every one of them coming correcting me no that's not true tamara um and then the flamingo of course they do pretty much always have their way in the back light right unless I got that wrong a leg nothing you guys away from me nose you know that for me goes yeah you're near florida whose florida that's it atlanta florida same thing s telling them to put like the rate on the back way or act out a part of something that is one leg makes a big difference the other thing to think about in terms of the shoulders posing rule is it doesn't always have to be so dramatic obviously it could simply be the angle of the camera and the shallow depth of field. If the shoulders are arm or out of focus, it tends to be less emphasis on them, of course, and then the illusion, then, is that it's a little more turned simply because I have the farther shoulder, a little more out of camera and the simple tilt in her chin, then and and my angle combined makes the shoulder seemed farther away, so the same exact shot just kind of go a little bit like this, and then my angles this way, suddenly the shoulders were turned. They don't have to actually turn the shoulders and that's really that's. Probably the most common thing I do with kids is I just my angle hit. I have them follow me with their chin and then the angles, the shoulders, even though their pretty broad they now have the illusion of being one a little close to the camera than the other. And of course, sometimes you break the rule together because that makes the shot. These big football shoulders the football shoulders look, is the look you want to avoid a lot of the time, especially children and women supposedly, but in a case like this, that makes the shot the propelling for the fact they're about the smashes cute little nose on my lens that the shoulder's being such a big prominent part of the shot make the shot and of course you don't correct for that um hands hands are another big one and I'm kind of going at it from the order of what I look at it the breaking the cheek one is because I'm looking at the faces a lot of the times it's one of the things I'm constantly thinking about whether or not I use it it doesn't matter as much um hands is another big one and and you'll see it a lot of life shoots I do that's that's a big emphasis hands kind of give away someone's comfort level so if you are thinking about posing adults, for instance hands make a difference in terms of how flattering it looks or how loose uncomfortable somebody looks with kids. It shows that I might be showing you this, but I'm doing this and there's an inconsistent message here and it confuses me that's kind of what you feel when you see images where the hands I don't really have an emphasis in an image like this simply lifting their hands into the shop make a huge difference to the overall composition versus if they just were at her sides and it can change the shot entirely in one frame like this for the small children doing five or six hand configurations makes a really big difference in the five or six very different looking shots um in a shot like this when you don't look at their hands and they kind of look a little clumpy and grabby it could take you out of the shot it kind of misses the emphasis in terms of ah nice she looks fun and happy but she also looks like she's about to touch me um and then if you're not paying attention this kind of goes into all the details you can lose a hand altogether like it's just gone and that's when it comes to kids imposing that's crazy common like the long shirts or they just they tear and halfway off while they're talking to you where I'm losing limbs all the time in children so you got to kind of take an eye and look at it and say, oh, you know what let's do that again just lift that shirt up, let me jump back and get that shot again um that that comes into all the details. The other thing to think about with ham is that the rule of thumb is that you don't especially for females you don't want to show the back of the hand towards the camera you want to show the edge of the hand so if I'm posing instead of doing this I kind of want to do this um there's two two parts that one from a flattering perspective these look like bigger hands and like larger and especially if they're closer to the camera the closer anything is to the lens the larger it appears, especially in relation to the rest of the composition. So the goal is to have the hands not so close to the camera and to show an edge so this would be a lovely look this would be not eleven look with children and families I don't care I don't want something overly dramatic and overly like if I could make a small shift I do but an image like this this is all hands but what I see when I look at this image and what I'm going for a look at this images I see belonging I see we're all belonging to each other and I'm gonna refuse up and hold you tight um I see spirit express expression I see light in the eyes and so I don't mind if his hands air here and mom's hands are like this that doesn't matter to me at all because of what the bigger thing I'm going for in the image does that make sense? So it's that's how you kind of shift the rules if for instance mom had her hands out like this, then that wouldn't work would change that, but in general that is where that the shift occurs um on an image like this of this gorgeous little boy who had loved to death on an image like this everything looks sweet you know we've got a nice little composition his hands or here so it doesn't look like the the angle of the shot is too weird we've got some nice parallel horizon lines what's off in the shot no no I like the legs wait what's officer what's wrong I think what I yes yes okay never mind you're gonna get uh what is not working that image it's funny you're going to like ten times I'm like no I actually like that no, I was happy with the lady big do what's off I'll give you a hint we're talking about it the hands yes everything he looks his expression looks relaxed he looks like he's having a fun time he's leaning forward you got we've got his shoulders a little bit off we have his legs sq which we'll talk about the second um we've got nice catch light so everything's going well except for when you get here this says to me I'm not entirely comfortable with this I have some stress why are you pointing that at me that's what that says um and in cases like this you just have to play it by ear whether or not it matters but an image like this after it's shot you could love a lot of this what I might do is then crop in tow what I love because that will make me feel like I want to see my boy happy and in love and friendly and loved in love with me and and friendly and easy going. I don't want to feel like I put him in a spot that made him uncomfortable and that's what that says to me so here I think the rules do matter they do have an effect. The other big thing about hands big, big thing about hands is it brings feeling into the image it shows what we pull close and I love that about hands, especially with children with with children, parent relationships it shows what matters to us this same image imagine it with the toddlers hands just dropped on your side like it doesn't show as much I want my mama, I love my mama. Did you have a question in regards to the last photo? How would you have post his hands if you could do it over again? All I would have done was say, it looks like you're going to kill something, do me a favor and just relax, you know, something like that, and I would have done it in just that way, a really goofy over the top, I would not have said it does look like your hands were kind of crunchy, you know, I would have just very I made a big deal out of it in a funny way, and then he would have laughed and loosened them. Yeah, because what I don't want to do is put so much attention. I don't want to take his attention to systematically thinking about what he has to do for me because then I lose expression, which is why I want to go through everything first when we get to the system opposing and the last second I want to keep expression because if I do that he will sit there and say, like that's normal and kids often want to please you and what you end up getting win it with I want to please you look, is thie a lot? Ah lot and that's the last thing I want, I would take that over this so that's a little bit of a shift um, so, uh, the other thing, of course, is these candid moments this was a pure, candid moment, there's a lot going on. I do shoot moments that I see as things were happening that have nothing to do. Posing this is an image were simply I just wanted to the little girl's hair out of her face so I could get a clean, full frame image of her face mommy's helping doing that and I just I love this I love the softness I love the feel of it I love the care in the hands and I think when you can catch images like that they have a lot of impact even if there was they weren't set up proposed for any reason another thing too I talked about it shows what you hold dear it's the same way in reverse right when a mother holds dear and what they care about bringing them close here we do have the edge of her hand in frame another way to do this would have put all the focus directly in the eyes and have everything out softly out of focus but the reason I don't do that is because I like this contact of skin to skin quite a lot and I like the idea that when we use hands we can use them and hands are incredibly expressive because it's what we hold close to us what we hold dear and it's what we push away that's what we don't want and that shows up with kids all the time I mean it's it's language one oh one I want you to get away and you see that a lot and so I will pick pay attention to when I have something that expresses the emotions we won to capture and if it's silly and goofy and kids were fighting and stuff that that shows a lot too but that's where hands are um arms arms, arms, arms uh they are very long arms on people have you noticed looked out like they're really long they're almost awkward looking if you were to think about it like it's just I've got these arms but they can showcase so much free spirit in children big time it's similar to hands in that where they go and what they do say a lot about how a child is feeling their children are really intuitive that way this this shows a lot about if I feel open and wide and free spirit and easy going or if I feel closed and I want some time alone and just go away on a wonderful easy way to position hands is what you do with arms it's very difficult for a child to very freely be moving around and clinch like this doesn't happen right? So this is another way to get those hands in a soft position I had nothing to do see her right hand on her left hand, their nationally curled they're very delicate they're sweet they're edges to camera I don't do that I just I just move you know? But you end up getting that as a result often um and that's just things like things that you probably do a lot of which is silly walking and cart wheels and tumbles and things that kids were actually doing anyway you just pull back to emphasize the arms a miss on this is if you go in close and you get arms clipped especially if they're clipped in odd framing joints are odd propping joints so like that would be the wrist or the middle the elbow we'll talk about that in a second but sometimes that can really kind of mess up a shot this shot gone in too close we have lost so much spirit I said that the other way to do it is a more introspective feel you gauge a lot of that by who you're photographing this photograph was taken in the dominican republic from was part of the what if conference which is actually happened to get in bali very soon next month yes august seventh look atyou right rest I believe you um it's a wonderful conference and we were down in dominican republican went to visit a school and photographed these children and this little boy was just this was more his nature very, very focused, very introspective having him run and dance and play it wouldn't have made any sense like it wouldn't have fit his personality at least the personality that I got to see it that way at that time on dh I have to emphasize that because of course children of different people based on their external situations often on dso in this sort of kate the place having him kind of hold himself in makes a big difference and it also is more apt to move your frame of reference when you look at this image, you're more apt to go right into the eyes because of the way he holds think about that visually where you go right up into the eyes that would maybe not be the same in an image like this right? It makes a big difference so if you know you want to emphasize something you frame accordingly and you use the arms as a way to get the viewer's eye there it also could make a big difference in the look and feel of a subject simply bringing them up or dropping them down obviously is a little tweak and expression and stuff but it changes the whole look of the field of child a lot I said that you don't really bunch up hands when you moved around but if you're going for something really high energy and very expressive this is very normal you see this a lot but they got paddles as they're jumping now I think this was like a what are these jumps called the eagle dropper open eagle jumper what is that called it's a jump it's a thing it's eagle sure he was going for the eagle um in an image like this when there's a really high energy burst whether it's jumping off something you typically never get soft hands you get these wide open things which shows energy like a lot that's what the arms and hands are doing just like I showed how easy it is to lose a hand it's very easy to lose an arm there easy, especially with running I I have I could do a whole course on moving subjects, andi, I probably will, but moving subjects is a whole different animal and children are often moving subjects often a lot of what you're trying to do is contain them, but one of the things you want to work with with anybody you're photographing who's moving very fast is to think about how they move their arms in this image. And I photographed a lot of sports figures my husband runs endurance magazine and I photographed a number of his covers and and then just images for some of his editorial and preston such and one of the things I'm always doing with moving athletes, especially when they're running at me or biking at me and stuff is I have to tell them where to put their limbs most people unless they're unbelievably elite trained athlete that are that are going for super super speed and a little resistance as possible even like very hard core olympian runners will run like this like this and still shot ends up being that right and then what you get is a crop right at the wrist you get elbow a kimbo, you know see that kim bo don't use that word every day. You get a lot of that and it's very natural and very normal with children. You're going to get that all day long. So in an image like this isle of this image, I love the color of the thing. I would absolutely give this to mom, and then I would laugh about her missing arm. What I enter this into competition? No, because he's got no arm. So the fix for this is to readjust myself in relation to the child and not make her self conscious. The fix for adults is to say, please adjust your arms and you run tried again this way that's the difference, because if I tell her to watch her arms, she will run like this. I mean, that's what they'll do with an athlete hold okay, I'll try again. Um, the other thing with arms is the rule in general with arms and legs is if it bends, bend it if the band's bennett I'm so something like this, you kind of you don't want this right? You want soft, you want moved you and in general, if you're going to do things that are forty five degree angles, which is like this and then you want to make sure they're not exactly the same unless you're doing this shot, which I don't know what this is, but in general, you want this on this image specifically, he was already just fiddling with his button, and all I did was make sure the lighting and the color balance we're right and then quickly work on expression, but so an image like this, where the arms are and how he's moving them, it elevates it big time. He goes from kids a g q model just like that just because of how he's positioned with his arms and his clothing. Um, this is a really classic male model shot, a very classic wedding image, like getting ready for the wedding image. There's a reason why this image is seen a lot in terms of the post is because it's a very commanding but comfortable shot, which is why it seems a little odd to see it on a toddler and kind of cool um, any questions on that as I move into next? So we have people are starting to ask questions about a bunch of different topics, let's, jump in with one really quick. Can we get a little bit more clarification on what you mean by breaking the cheek line? Kelly vienna number other people? We're not sure exactly what you meant by breaking the cheek line. So breaking the sheik line means that when a subject is turnin profile where their nose aligns next to their chick to samalin jump up and be a volunteer come on so breaking the cheek line if you are here which camera we had on the job okay so if he's facing this when I asked him to go profile turn completely towards the wall you're not your head just like turn your head yep so if we go like this he has broken the cheek line to see that in that his nose is now in front of his cheek but excuse me why touch you lovingly let's see let's go this way I got to see from the camera view but if I go like that do you see that is that catch hang on a film then he's not broken the chief that I can see his cheek the line of a sheik behind his nose and basically adjust the way his nose looks in terms of size and proportion to the rest of his face and ends up meaning here see how much smaller than those lips you got a great nose so this works out well but do you see the difference, huh? Yes, thank you very much thank you, thank you that is breaking the cheek line so with children I don't tell them lou because I move a little bit you know, unless I've got them really dialed it and then I can say that no respond, but for most part then if I tell a child turner knows a little bit so it's not breaking your cheek line will be like and I'll have a car outside for ten minutes, you know, trying to figure that out um I think we're going to move on for now, okay? Um legs legs are kind of like arms, except they're on the bottom. Uh, I just yeah, that's done. No. Um uh so it's the same thing with legs, arms if it bends bended if they've been minute, if you can avoid symmetry, do so over symmetrical legs and arms look awkward they look uncomfortable, they look overly posed. Um another opposing rule if you're gonna go with what the posing rules are versus what you break opposing rule, is that you you don't want to have the legs above the hips, so you don't want to have something like this. I break that all the time with children clearly, like I never considered that as opposing rule for me with children um s o I think in terms of I love the idea of avoiding symmetry and bendy and I do that quite a lot I ignore that part because children are very adjustable with their legs they can hug him they can do the splits they could sit on them they can crisscross and sometimes I get so used to fighting in children but I have like a family and I'll tell dad okay, now do me a favor crisscross applesauce is like are you kidding me a minute? Okay, just sit on your legs he was gonna help me out yeah, it goes on and on like that. So um here's what I do care a lot and I do not break this rule with legs is where you crop where you crop so you want to avoid cropping the joints at all times let's start with the middle image if you're going to shoot a full frame image which is top to bottom scuse me a full length image from top to bottom try not to cut off in the middle of the feet I see this all the time I see this all the time try to shoot a little farther back if you naturally tend to crop a little bit in the middle of the feet then practice shooting with mohr of your image in frame than even once and then crop in later to have it be underneath the feed you know I mean like take a couple steps back or zoom out but try not to crop like right in the middle of the feet because it ends up feeling like it's unfinished um the other and by the way, I'm not saying that's always easy when I do this this middle thing where crop a little bit in the feet, I try to crop above or below if it's something with the expression is so amazing in the moment so amazing that I just say, oh, well, I kind of messed up that part and I'm gonna keep it, but for the most part I want to avoid it everything I'm saying I'm gonna just throughout this disclaimer everything I'm saying is with the consideration of this is what you're trying for that doesn't mean I succeed every time on all of these it's what I'm trying for, um, over here, you see, when you wheat crop at the ankles, it looks broken and odd and off same thing at the knees, so I never wanna crop either in camera or out of camera at these major joint points because it just looks so off and I see this with kids photography a lot a lot, a lot on dh it's harder because their limbs are smaller and there's a lot easier ways to break this rule because you feels like anywhere you frame, you've got, you've got something like the elbows right next the wrist like where do I go? But just consider that when if you can't get it in camera while you're shooting make sure that you crop accordingly and post so I will crop in a little further to get kind of in the middle here or there it'll here if I have to and preferably one third up or down that makes sense okay um legs and feet another thought when posing on and you probably saw this on the video when posing legs if you have kids crossed legs the rule is to lift the weight off the bottom leg so that you don't have a thigh that's just kind of squished out that's the posing rule for legs with adult with children I rarely ever have to worry about that and if I do tell them to lift a little bit it's a game hold it is older you cared and then you get expression out of it and it can look kind of cool you don't want this of course because that looks like your legs just floating um but uh the other thing you know when I do have that I say how long can you keep her legs just barely dodging um and subtle physically look good and I'll get expression but for the most part I don't I don't care about it um obviously you can tell we have worked on bending the legs and not having too much symmetry the other thing is feet so feet feet is a mystery to me so many adults hate their feet I don't understand that at all are any of you hate like feet haters your foot foot hayter explained it to me can you give her I need to know this can you give her my friend was right there why do you hate feet? I don't hate other people's feet why do you hate your feet? I'm very flat footed and um oh don't look e I don't know I just kind of girl you my feet were abnormally larger than can we see him no during the right no it's good no now you just don't like him. Yeah so so this is this is a mystery because I always find it confusing the amount of people on it always adults never kids I have never had a kid not like their feet like in fact, I have kids like make out with her face like you know their cheeks with their feet but with adults they're like they love their feet like okay that just to make sure my feet aren't in that's why they're horrible I'm like their feet they look normal um I love my fee because they get me faces uh oh by the way these shoes were picked on approved by my daughter my fifth grader daughter um I was supposed to say that so uh luckily, I've never met a kid who hates her feet and so all the rules about like avoiding feet and the rules are that you took the feedback that they're not close to the frame that if you've been up to you sit you talk from behind if you have to show them they're as close to the body as possible and you only see the edge of the feet hear that mostly occurs if you look at her left leg you're seeing the edge of the foot that would be an optimally posed foot on dh then the other one kind of coming straight at the camera especially they were closer to the lens it would be breaking the rules to me unless it's distorted and really close to the frame and looks like a giant monster crazy one off foot I I don't worry about that so much and that we play feet all the time um in fact one of the things I do first with children a lot of you may do this too is take off the shoes, take off the shoes to show more of the whole child and of course other parts thie other parts opposing there's not really a manual for bottom hose thing the bottom shelf a lot with children like a lot a lot and I love to utilize especially if they're at the age where it's just cute and it's fun I don't think there is a posing rule for bottoms that I know of for this type of portraiture but uh yeah, I just want to show but good so those are my whole posing rolls from top to bottom in terms of the stuff that I think about in general this is this is, you know, there's always the basic things which is, you know, trying to think about your hip is this way and your shoulders this way thinking about an s curve at all times trying to avoid a boxy standing towards the camera look that being said, if I have a young boy whose box silly standing towards the camera and all I have to do is tuck his fingers into his little pockets it's a great shot because I don't worry so much about that same thing with children with little girls but I just have them then just stand apart hold their feet a little bit more apart so I at least have some variants there it's the difference between this which is just terribly unflattering and with the kid like this lean forward a little bit the chest and this this is a very kid friendly pose and it's something very easy and there's no s curve there's no shift in wait there's no weight on the back foot um and it's got symmetry all over the place but it works on a kid it's a little tougher on it at all any questions about that overall massive questions so if people want teo jump in we do they're mostly more general questions and not specifically about this, so I've got them we're saving them for those points where she is talking about the subjects that those questions are on s so if anyone has questions that are talking about the business ones, business ones and you're getting your general like locations and yeah, gear and all that stuff which I will be talking about later so does anyone here in the audience have any questions about any of it is so good that their passions left that's totally april can you pass a actually know somebody did say michael p said I got it I think she was really good with the explanations, so oh, I just got affirmation I'll take that over a question that's totally wrong god just for that the host in which the, uh fingers big clashed said it again the picture and with the fingers clutched yes. So suppose you have everything is perfect except for the fingers do you even try to get a second shot? Like, okay, I'm glad you asked that because it brings up a really good point what I try to do all the time with photography and not just with photographing children but all the time with photography is get what I can get first no matter what I don't ever say we're almost there, let me put the camera down, I say, well, we're almost there let me get this in case I never back to the second, which happens ah lot most sessions and I swear it's a fifty fifty run rate, I'll either get the best out of them in the beginning, I'll get the best out of them in the end, I rarely get them just steady, awesome the whole way through like there's something I'm working with, so either they take a while to warm up and I'm having a lot of problems and it it takes a while to get a good shot of him and get him towards the end of the session or they come in guns a blazin and they're on and already and then they're crashed and done, and I get nothing at the end, so if I have an opportunity of something in front of me, I will shoot what I have then I will try to work and fix it, but I always start with getting something because I don't know if I'll ever get back to that. You're welcome, yes, so when when you're doing the breaking the cheek line, yes and your you tried not to break that, we're trying not to break the line in your readjusting the pose are you coming? Are you making sure that the tip of the nose comes in a certain distance because you don't want it to create a tangent all right, just just it's slightly off it slightly often in front because you start turning too much and now you're just facing the camera you know but it's just slightly off and again with children everything the structure of the face is different with children their eyes are larger in the head you guys know that fact that your eyes are the same size your whole life you just grow into them so some of the things that you think about positioning that are flattering an adult which is is making their eyes larger can actually make a child that like an alien you know, if it's too much like top down close in wide angle the eyes look like it almost looks like you are distorting it but that's because the children have such big eyes same thing with the face and the nose there's not a lot of room here you didn't mean so you're just softly moving a little bit so it's just off you don't want to like create a perfect triangle or someone's I mean with the type of toffee I'm doing so the type of photography I'm doing as you'll see is very it's high energy it's fast moving it could be really so slow ones soft if that's what the subject needs, but it isn't very doesn't it doesn't appear technically precise, it doesn't appear that were going just move everything exactly like this don't move go, because if I were to shoot like that, I feel like I would just kill the look that I'm actually going for it back to the idea of what you can control and what you can influence I can't control this genuinely alive fun look, but I can influence it, I just can't I can't detail it to death means it's similar? I mean, if you guys pose for photographs, have you ever been there where it just felt like it was taking forever and they were shaped adjusting this, suggesting this so just in this and I'm like, okay, great big smile and you're like, like that's, what it feels like and with kids it's like that times ten because their attention spanish one tune you know, eso, you have to realize that like I don't get a chance to make everything perfect, perfect shot, I have to just quickly do it. So all of these things is ten steps were about to talk about, they're they're really fast paced, it's getting it all lined up, but there is an order to it in a precision to it, it's just fast and so if your nature I had somebody asked me once in a workshop, um, she said, but my nature isn't fast, I'm very slow and very methodical. I'm very quiet, and I said that if that's who you are that's great, then we need to we need to rework this in a way that fits you, and what that means is you're still doing everything your just not leaving your subject. So leaving your subject, I mean, that my goal with children and I think what works with children really well, whether you're high energy or you're somewhere in the middle or you're really quiet, low energy, the only thing that really matters is how you're interacting with that child and how you're getting them to trust you, because if they don't trust you, you can't influence them and that that's really vital, you need them to be able to feel like, you know what? I don't know what we're doing here, I don't know who you are, but I'll go with it like that's, mostly what you want, and so if they're very, very quiet reserved child and you're coming at them with a veil quiet, reserved nature, you're going to have a wonderful connection and you could do all of this slowly you just don't want to leave the child to go do the things so if I'm with you and I've got you perfectly engaged and you're with me and you're trusting me and then I said, okay, I'm gonna go over and fix the lighting, I'll be back in three minutes, I have to start all from scratch with you, but if I go over and I can do the lighting while I'm talking to you and I'm engaging you and you're telling me a story and maybe I'm snapping a couple candids I have you the whole time does that make sense? You were nodding about the quiet reserved part? Actually, I was also about the part where, you know, you lose the person like somebody's adjusting light happens with me a lot because I take a it's time to get it everything right, right? And I'd loose that's why I said, I'm not a people's person because I I it's better because my stars and mountains they don't go anywhere, they just save him. Yeah, whereas with people, if I take time to adjust, I just lose the expression. Yeah, so I had the pot's, right? Maybe I have everything else, right, but I lose the that expression that I was looking for, right, and then so that is why we want to do everything else before you even start to try to get expression so what I'll do is I'll connect and interact with a child on, but I won't even try from expression until I know everything set up because I try for it too early and then and then it's strange it's, strange it's sitting there, it's waiting, you know? And so if you think about, like, all all I'm doing right now, I'm getting everything else going is just building trust and whatever that means to you, it's building an interaction it's building a connection, it's having some sort of exchange something where you get them to notice you as a human and and want to respond to you. And that could be in any way that's natural to you. You know, it must be tough to hate. People cause her everywhere. I don't hey, people, I'm not good with dealing like no, I can make them pose for my pictures, so I find it really difficult. Okay, what is your major resistance? You said first that you feel like you have to do everything and then you can't use expression like I have tried it only with family and friends. So far, I haven't actually met our side, no family and friends of the hardest people to photograph, all right, keep going. So that that says it also had tried to found ian friend and the moment I started adjusting, they think I'm being all geeky and stuff I don't know they don't write I become an alien yes, yes, I understand very well then I lose it so either they're candid shots and I get what I get r I don't get anything, so you bring up a wonderful point um photograph if your soul experience with photographing children is photographing your own, you are doing the hardest thing first, for sure if your your soul experience of photographing people is your own friends and family, you're starting from the hardest place because you are somebody that they have already decided they know who you are, they're talking not teo you photographer there talk with the person they're ahead that they've known for years who they don't see this new rules photographer and that's not a fair place for you to be and it's not a place that that provides much influence and that's what we want to do here is we want to influence a situation, so when I go out and photograph my children I could photograph every single child in the world and have a great experience and then a photograph my kids and the only time I have a really good experience photographing my kids is if I say I'm not me I am somebody else called me sally, and I am from australia that's, because my friend sally stargate, I'm from australia and you don't know me, and and then I try my really weird accent that's the only time I mean otherwise, because part of it is, I want kids to be just free and natural and not have any rules imposed on them and have a great time, and when my children do that, I'm like, but, you know, you do that it's the dynamic it's so different, and if you're if you're testing yourself out on friends and family, they're not gonna respond to you as the official photographer, they're gonna respond to you somebody they know, and they don't see that way. So that's a really rough dynamic just just know that because I think when you can really get the experience that will that make you feel more confident is when it completely different people who aren't a client mode, you know that that makes a huge difference. Does that make sense? We have aubrey from colorado and she's requesting if you would show us some examples of s curves example of s curve oh yeah, so esseker is literally like the if you think about the letter s how it goes like this, so this is the letter I this is the letter t no. So this is the letter I an s curve is just this is going to go this way. This is going to go this that this is kind of more dramatic s curve on a kid. I would just say do me a little hokey pokey going or something like that. And I get him on this like an s curve is just literally putting that line, making that line more of a wiggle because it's a more attractive way to look. And again photographing a full grown woman and a kid totally different. The s curve is the same. You just get it in a different way. Yeah. Um, do you want me to do more letters? They off a bit? Could you dok do that? Um so our lk photography, you mentioned everything else except faces. What about faces? Weird smiles, crazy eyes wrinkled up nose, etcetera. Okay, so faces falls in under expression. Not not rules of posing per se. There, of course, is the idea of emphasizing the jawline with kids. I hardly ever have to do that with adults. You get a lot of you know, and you've got our you know, you actually, when you kick your head back like that, it's good ugo um what I do with adults and family shots as I show them what it looks like when they put their head back and life I said just so you know this is what I'm getting and they're like oh god don't get that and that and that's kind of how I start with kids I find that it's it sounds trite but it's hard to get an unflattering pose of a child when they're laughing they just look so bright and fun and inviting so I don't have to work so much on that what I do have to work on is the fake cheese smile because kids come to me precondition for what smile means and every single time I hear a kid look at me and go cheese I couldn't you know no no no no let's change the words let's do something different because what you're giving me is what you've memorized set of behaviors um when we get into the relationships course in a couple days we're going to talk a lot about memorize set of behaviours because I think a lot of people confuse that with their personality with a child the memorized set of behaviors is mom wants me to go like this to the camera and show my teeth and that's what's what I'm trying to avoid so what I do is I change the word I asked them to use a different word I come up with something different every time I said, you know, instead of that go say rabbit poop, you know, or whatever it is and just by saying a different word they're they're brain pattern has been interrupted and now they give me a whole different look, so part of what I work on with that is change is getting them out of what they've always done. The other thing with expressions is I don't ask for it, I don't ever say smile I don't ever say, um now do me a favor and look reflective unless I'm doing in a silly silly over the top way, you know, and often I'll get the opposite of what I'm asking for, you know? I'll say do me a favor and look at me like you're so mad at me like I came in and I just got into your locker and I left like a big bag of steaming whatever and I'll make up the whole story, and what I asked for was this angry, intense face and when I'll get instead is this awesome kind of look and laughter but most of what expression is is tapping into what the child fines that they can easily respond teo so I mean, we just saw two second clip of this little boy I gave him like nothing in the way of what I normally would do with children I just said words and you got to naturally see his face respond how he looked and he tried to do a little bit of something before he left the frame but if you do what you did see was his engagement even when he wasn't engaged out of frame you know he kind of came back it came back and he kind of makes eye contact and that's where expression comes for run is responding to the engagement that they're giving you dude that is the question yeah also stay away from ears ears or terrible um we also have a handful of questions regarding the involvement of parents on shoot so a pro photographer was asking if you allow parents to suggest poses if you have the parents interact on the shoot just in general they're involved okay great question first of all rest what do I always tell parents about children you tell her parents and this is something that I told her the other day we're not going to be raising moral human beings while we're shooting we're just going to get good pictures yes yes except use your photographs printed the word pictures I don't know what kind of an odd professional to not like that word I do I say we're not raising moral human beings for the next couple hours and why that's important is because if they don't feel like they're being monitored if they feel like they have full immunity they feel like they can do whatever they want without any sort of risk of repercussion I get more of them that that makes a lot of sense, right? So I get the clear unfettered view of who they really are when there's no restriction on them and I think that's really relevant I think that's really significant and by having that conversation advance with parents it makes a very big difference I've had parents say to me yeah that's not gonna happen and I'll say, well, if you've been to my website and you love my work, that is how I work that that is the process I don't even know howto work under the guise of them feeling they're going to get in trouble I really don't I really don't know how to do that that way um and I think honestly, by being straightforward about what your own limitations are, you can get more by in than being demanding and controlling and saying that's what I need I just say I don't even know how to do it the other way and then I'll usually get laughter like, all right, you got two hours, you know, like I'll get something like that as as buying from the most resistant parent most of them say all right, you know what you're doing and we trust you that ends up being that way so by taking basically the straight give off and letting them be whoever they are I end up getting so much more expression at the gate then I would be if I felt like this is just one more thing the kids are doing today this is one more appointment they're getting this is like totally different and special and wow, I get to do whatever I want without punishment and it makes a big impact I get I get the bonus of expressions just from starting there. The other thing is do I let parents come on the shoot absolutely all the time and if a parent says to me that they have opposing mind they want to dio instead of just me trying to do what they said they want to dio I'll ask them to show me and they're like, well, it's kind of our kid show me and then the kid just thinks it's hilarious plink mom's going okay, great shows exactly what you want and then I'll have the child literally sit down the ground next to mom mom showed the child and child thinks it's hilarious that we're doing this and then I get expression so instead of me trying to mimic it make it all happen I have the parent become very involved I often work use the parents as a as a way to kind of piggyback off the trust factor they have with the children so they have the parent has a really good relationship with the children I will be like the parents best friends for the length of the shoot I will be very affectionate in my terminology and how you know how close I stand and this and that and united sublet my pretty pretty consciously it shows that there's a big transfer of trust that happens right away o this is mommy's really good friend and that helps a lot. Yes, I have a question because I try to do this or try I do this with my kids and wonder how you handle it with other parents offering rewards and promises for after the show. Oh yeah, no no big on bribes so now there's there's again, we're not I don't care if they feel like I have to do this to do that and it sends a bad message because that's not really my job here it's not so I will, absolutely, which is why it's harder but it's my kids, but but I'm very transparent about that to the I'll say you're gonna have to handle them when you get home in this terrible lesson that we just taught them that if they do what they say they get, they get this big prize, but but I will get great photographs out of it and I just had to come it tio I have do have the hardest time photographing my own shoulder my son gives me permission to take one picture and that's it now and that's pretty much all like wow it's been a good one, right? But he won't look at the camera too, so maybe you can help me with that later but my favorite pictures of my children or when I have my husband behind me in the smiles that they give him scott yeah, well one big one big techniques that I do a lot I don't have a camera here but let's pretend this is a camera is uh if a child is not looking at me they're looking only at the ground I will literally tell the leads here and click underneath and what I'm getting is a wide open view and really distorted look and you know I feel for anybody in my studio has to look at these images later and wonder how I ended up getting a job, but I do I'll do this aa lot and at this point this becomes so annoying to them they look up at me and that happened that's a technique that works very, very often I don't know if you saw the sales program we did sail sail sales in creative live last july, but we did a forty five minute shoot in the back alley and the child never wanted to look up I never wanted to look up the whole time and in fact was glued inside like his dad's shirt and then our mom in the ground and end the game became that he will never look at me for the whole thing, so it went from being resistance toe like this is awesome, she hates it, and then I and I did all those kind of if you haven't seen that shoot, you can see exactly what to do an extreme situation where that the child won't physically look atyou and, oh, you're live on camera with a lot of people watching, but and what you do is that then you if they're gonna go with extreme, you go to the extreme and that means kind of letting them know I'm in on this game, you know, let me see what I could pull off a quarter second give me a quarter second not even a full second when you take a full second from you that'd be rude, you know it's it's, that kind of interaction um but I'm calling this the system of organic directive posing this is the framework for everything I do what every shoot ideo um what's interesting to me is I coined this term because it made the most sense me organic directive posing when I wrote my first book six years ago and basically I realized like it's that kind of dichotomy between posed people asking for my own post shots but me thinking but imposing everything it's just not the same look um and part of what I wanted where images that looked less strained and more authentic and I realized it was because of direction it was a combination of starting with what they wanted and how I could direct them into something that looked better so a lot of the time the children's set the tone in terms of what they want to start with and then I'll just it based on those rules opposing that looks great let me kick your leg here it up just a bit gold like that you know, most of the time they're actually starting the pose and that I work with what they've given me to turn it into something that follows those rules of posing that that that taking you know pays attention to them um s o back to the idea of influencing it this in order all ten of these steps the system opposing is what I do on each and every shoot oh I love that you're all taking notes that's great um by the time I get to number ten I take my shot it doesn't mean I don't take shots all along if I see candid great things but the shot I'm going for happens at number ten so I start out with uh setting expectations then clothing relocation I'm obviously going to go into all these in detail mood management then the three point lighting which isn't as hard cores that might sound uh technical settings composition framing details expression I go in that order and I didn't even realize I was doing like this if you guys ever done that like sat back and looked oh, I have a whole system for this but if you think about it like when you go home from work what do you do? You probably follow system each and every time that you don't really think about I dropped my keys to take off my shoes. I you know, etcetera, etcetera. That's what this this that's how this was born I sat there and said what do I do? And I realise everything always went in the same order every time on purpose. So, um here we go setting expectations how are we going to get from here to there? This is the first thing I do with every client I ever worked with is I start out by setting expectations how do I work? How do I go about this member? I mentioned that I have a dialogue with the parent where I say, you know, if you like my work, this is how it happens this is the part where I explain what it is, how it happens, um what? Not only what do I start with what I like to do, what the wild card situations a lot of times when people are going into a situation they've never done before, a number of people that I photograph, they've never had their children professionally photographed before it's not something they normally do it's a stressful experience for them, have you had that? Yeah, it ends up being a stressful experience, one supposed to be fun and light hearted and easy going. I'm I feel like I'm selling the experience of the shoot, just a cz muchas the images after and so what I want to do right at front is explained that I want to say if you have any stress or concerned about this, don't there is no reason this will be fun and it'll be lighthearted, it'll be easy if you do have concerns, tell me about that now, so okay, well, I'm a little concerned that we're gonna go all this effort, we're going to show up and he's gonna be a little jerk I've had that I've had that said to me before. Have you ever had parents, like, share a lot about their children like, wow, okay, um, you know, oh, I feel like, well, what if we do all this and ends up raining? You know, all these little concerns and it's? Not until you ask what they might have concerns about that you have an opportunity to squash each and every concern so that by the time they hang up the phone, they really not only feel better, they're looking forward to this any time I have, you know? And of course, you also talk to clients, you just feel like I'm so excited to be great it's gonna be the thrill of a lifetime would be fun done awesome, but by sitting expectation, not only am I setting us up for a better shoot, I'm setting us up the whole process through so that when we get to the sales session, I actually feel like wear all position to sell these images because, you know, one of things I did, and this is probably more for the business section. But one of the things I did three years into my career was recognized that ninety percent of what I do on each and every shoot is the same, and that last ten percent, which is actually selling the prince er that is the part that makes the difference for about ninety percent of how much I'll get, so you know what? What I'm saying is that if I'm doing all those steps right here after expression, spirit number eleven is sales, right? So all of this has to happen no matter what I do in terms of post processing and everything's gonna happen. So post processing eleven twelve is sales everything's gonna happen on every shoot, no matter what I do? So if I'm not focused on that sales part, then it doesn't it doesn't even matter like I could go shoot from shoot to shoot and make ten percent of what I'd make if I just had to shoots and maximize the experience. Yes, so when I'm setting expectation, I'm setting them through all the way through to the sales I'm saying, and when we get here, then we'll sit down and we'll do our purchases. This isn't a sales course, but just to let you know part of what setting expectations are preparing them for the sales portion. Um, I think that if you don't set your client's expectations that front, you do them a disservice, and I really believe that strongly, because and you're making the job so much harder for yourself, setting their expectations is saying this is what will happen on the shoot, we'll go out to the field, we'll probably start with this, then we'll probably do some close ups, we'll have a reflector. Like tell them what to expect when they go out and shoot if they've done a sheet with you fifteen times say okay, I'm gonna try something totally different now I want to go out to this urban location I have no idea if they're going to arrest us, they might but let's let's start there and let's just try give them an idea of what to expect. I find that my clients come in one hundred percent calmer when I have not in this. So a lot of those problems that may crop up later in the chute you knock out right in the beginning by just letting them know what to expect. Um I love this quote. Expectations are a form of first class truth if people believe it it's true, I know this so much basically, my clients say, how does it work? I tell them how it works and then it works that way and that's not a control thing that's putting their them at ease and making sure the process is set up to be a smoothie is possible. Eso if it's a ten step process we start here. Um I think the other thing that's really interesting. I love this sorry it's over. Sometimes I write notes to myself that are kind of mean don't screw that part up um one of things that I've noticed is that when we go into a shoot and a client isn't prepared and I've done this a couple times before I have to spend probably the first fifteen twenty minutes just bring them all into the mood of the shoot have you had that experience where you feel like the warm up is taking a very long time so when you're doing that you're setting back everything you're setting back the feel you're setting back the freedom the child could have you're setting back the ability for more family shoots before you run out of time that first step right in the beginning lets us hit the ground running um the other thing clothing review step to clothe the view has changed dramatically for me when I first started photographing children I followed the firm rules of clothing um have any of you guys ever looked up the rules of clothing when it comes to portrait sessions yeah what what is somewhere would have seen what you've seen I'm just curious what you guys were hearing it's like right out of the gate you're looking up what the rules of clothing are uh no logo's er no patterns no patterns yet um no jeans okay um trying to think of some other things those were like the main ones obviously like no patterns and stuff I read something about like two colors and alec a pop of color is it it's just overwhelming there's like a lot of rules. If you look up the rules of clothing that's perfect it's overwhelming. It looks like there's pages and pages of what you do and don't do it with portrait sessions. And when I first started photographing kids, I followed all those rules. Okay, you're going tohave toe wear long sleeves for sure and no patterns no, no patterson hello, there's. No trendy jewellery let's make sure that if everybody is wearing one outfit, we try to get you to if not match, which would be great that's how that is, how I started then to just, you know, somewhat make sure you're coordinated and alistair stuff those those rules of clothing have changed dramatically for me as I've actually gotten out and photographed, and then steam with the images looked like after clothing will make or break a shoot it's that big of a deal? Um the rules, however, can make a break the mood and the feel of them. It could make everything look homogeneous and boring and stayed and overly formal. So I have adapted a new kind of set of rules, which I'll go into after the break. But the biggest thing I want to emphasize here as it relates to clothing is you want to think about a couple things, one no the clothing that they were in the chute doesn't have to be the clothing that we're each and every day, so another school of thought is where whatever you're comfortable with and you'll shine that's not true because some people are very comfortable in sweat, clothes and a big you know, dear, dear one of those john deere john deere has and no shoes and its etcetera, you want them, tio I would rather the client, the the child be slightly like comfortable but slightly uncomfortable and look fabulous, and then I work him through it, then to be totally comfortable and it just be kind of drab and takes away clothing you can have a massive impact on the way a shot looks. I also go consistently for layers, so I say, you know, make sure it's like dressing for san francisco, like I want two or three different layers and under thing and over thing and then the sweater and we'll take it off if you're hot will move around, but I can change the whole look. Well, they don't have to do one outfit change just in a series of ten to twelve shots, and then we go into an outfit change, so we'll go in tow a lot about clothing because it's a huge part of shooting when we get back, well, um that was fun, this's the driest media's part or tofu is part. Well, I was catching myself using your suggestions as we're sitting here kind of correcting my posture. This's been a really fun morning. Um, I think we're gonna take about a fifteen minute break, but what kind of things we're gonna look into when we get back so we go back we're gonna go step by step through all these things that we have to watch out for in terms of the system opposing I'm to give you examples of exactly what I mean with a lot more visuals. Um and then after that, we start going through shoots, shoots, shoots, shoots were gonna jump up and move and go through things and you're gonna hear a lot of going to hear how these things happen in action. We're gonna show video being out in the streets and it being a very real shoot with no, no making it easier that is wonderful. Eso we want to read a quick quote from the internet for you just to let you know exactly what people are saying. We have carolina strada who says I love you, tamara, everything you teach his heartfelt first time I watched workshop at creative life, your workshop I cried so much it was tears of joy, so you definitely are people out there and just to remind everybody already. Today, we have learned the rules of posing. And we've started going through these steps of how to achieve these perfect pictures every single time. And we have just gone through the first segment of the first day. So we have a lot to get through, and we will do. So when we get back in fifteen minutes, so we will see then.