Hot Seat - Word of Mouth Campaign
The hot seat is about are you choosing a p approval word of mouth or referral program and we will uh that's on page twenty eight how to get people talking about yusa who wants to volunteer otherwise I will close my eyes and pick darryl good coming up okay all right, so what are you going to choose? P a p approval word of mouth a referral program I'm leaning towards word of mouth ok, I guess I'm a little you know I struggle with as a photographer what to provide as my you know, referral program those don't seem this is genuine to what I do um well let's talk about your client's a little bit and maybe we can we can find to need so what's a typical client for u s o largely product photography but that could be anything from t shirts on models tio widgets of manufacturing widgets of some kind or or gift doubles, you know, home decor items so come into court might be probably the biggest thing that we do. Okay, so do the people that you work for do they talk to other companies in the field?
Do they have or is it is it that they're strictly competitive with each other or do they do they have friendly relationships to come so the manufacturers I'm starting to hear a little bit about friendly relationships, okay which is odd to me but I mean, I think they're starting to be some effort to reach out so I'm hearing a little bit about that, okay? Because if it's not a hostile environment and they say those bastards just dealing for me yeah, but if it's like because I think of the manufacturing world especially is a manufacturer will often manufacturers several products several different products for ah whole bunch of a variety of clients or they manufacture one product that goes out to to, you know, especially in the gift world to like fifty different people, right? So if you were to be in with one of them and they would know about everybody else, would there be a benefit for them to have an equally good quality of the product? Um, yeah, I think that's that's a great area from I'm not sure there's a potential they wouldn't you know there's potentially are proprietary towards what they have, but then I don't know I'm not sure. So when I was working for levi strauss on and I was shooting I was producing their their jeans campaign and they were klein for me for many, many years and then wrangler came because wrangler found out that I was shooting levi and they wanted to hire me as a producer and they said to me, but we can't really do that unless you let levi has declined girl and I said well as if you are in the incredibly fortunate position that you can't work with the producer who does both and here's why this benefit for you as I am the only producer in all of los angeles who can guarantee that he will not have the same models or the same location nice and it worked and so whenever whoever was there first and then who ever came second and I say that with the higher and, you know and I had told both of them, you know, for for for for the purposes of full disclaimer it's like, look, you know, here I'm working with both of you and, um, but I will tell you which locations in which models because that's not really all that proprietary, but it would look very awkward if the same model was in the same location with a different genes I mean, that's just really bad on dh that worked for for a very, very long time. So, you know, dead sort of just an idea. So you write the referral program for you might be a little uncomfortable to begin with. All right, um, what are you thinking about? Word of mouth? Um, you know, I responded to what you said about having a framed prints some added values on extra delivery okay okay good. So let's write this down here and we say that you were choosing word of mouth referral and you guys kind of can you know, work along with us and uh right in what sort of makes sense to you ok, so we're going to give them something extra so what what is that? Something actress did a ah monetary is it a coupon? Is it a tangible item? Isn't it gift what what feels right for you um well you said something earlier about looking into the lives of the client and what you know I am dealing with with a lot of working moms and you know, one of the things that I think my company brings to the table is getting through the work that quickly not a lot of not re shooting things people are are done and maybe even, you know, done early so you know, is there something along the lines of a benefit to the extra time the client could have that's an added that I give them sort of some time back in the sense so one of the things is one one of the speaker tricks I've learned is that when I speak life I say I will end five minutes early why? Because in a lot of conferences there's the big rush to lunch so or you know, to the next breakout session or to the whatever next that isthe so if mine are early, then they're making it guaranteed into the next session they like that a lot fight and then they and then they're ready to listen because then then then they're not sitting at a quarter to before it's over with their bag on their on their on their a lab and wondering when I'm going to be finished so they can start out because they know it. I told him so if they're let's think about this so I'm I'm working with you, I'm arriving uh my daughter's been coughing in the morning of a little concerned she might come down with a cold, but thank god nobody is calling me. I'm rushing, rushing, rushing, rushing, rushing what would I want to hear from you? Well, certainly I would want to hear that from you, but that's something ahead of time where you can say in our planning and our production, as long as you stick to schedule, we stick to schedule and more than that produced that five minutes trick, right? Um to say were designed for busy parents like way our values. I would talk about the values right, what you stand for so you say our values include honoring, you know, not just a good business relationship, but we understand our clients of people with lives, so our day starts at whatever eight fifteen, which is when, right after parents drop off their kids an hour, days ended for forty five, which, by the way, I've never heard one photographer ever do why you're not doing, um, so that, you know, a parent could drop off their kid at school and then go drive straight to the studio, and then you give them enough time to then leave the studio to be a day care and pick up the kid before five because it's been all that, thanks clothes that would be a great way. Uh, just, you know, this is a working, working, parent friendly environment. I like that. I don't like it, I like it. Write it down, write it down, but downright it up workbook, page twenty eight. Well, we're also, you know, I find clients were off to meetings, you know, corporate america there's, another meeting to go to. So I'm offing sending a image, you know, texting an image for approval, you know, we're doing elaborate sets, it's, not several skew shots or something it's just, you know, on a beauty shots and then send them a shot on their phone they can improve from their meeting and that's been a huge time saver for for clients to so that size into a different need nice. So that's what the clients that air at that you already have a relationship where probably that understand how awesome you are so all they want so that would be the peace of mind text by trying or they just check in? Yeah, because that would be kind of good to say we have a peace of mind function that we offered to a client what's a piece of my function. Well, because we have already relationship going, but we want to give you peace of mind. So every time we do one of these elaborate sets, we send it over to you for your approval. So you have peace of mind that we're not gone fishing that we still said working hard for you, okay, I like that very good. I like that too, so that I can and turned it into kind of a thing. I love that you know, only if you make it a thing, it becomes like it becomes like a value added proposition. We've talked about it and this is really sort of important to understand it's like when you make a promise now and he said, well, the way we work together is that we offer this this is this is what we do this is our service is what makes me so special it's not just that I make cheap crap from china look good but we also have a working parent friendly environment we have a peace of mind option you know that we that we do it no charge because we know your time is value but you don't need to be here you don't need to be here we'll call you when we need you here but way all grown ups there's a grownup environment right um if you want to hold hands will hold hands and we'll sing kumbaya but most of our clients don't because they're busy making making deals for the you know from next thing so we're here to support you however you want it so tell us which of the two works for you and it works on me if you put it in relationship to something right so you can say um which which which is more comfortable the the you know, the working parent friendly environment shoot schedule or would you prefer the I'm really not a morning person schedule right where we started nine thirty and we'll go until six o'clock so you know, I think sometimes people don't know what questions they have to ask so that's really a really important piece to know if if you say to decline what do you really want one hundred off nineteen ninety nine out of ten declines will not be able to tell you what they want because they look good coming to you for answers, so if you put that in relationship for them and say which of thes do you want, then they can say yes or no and by the differentiation between the two it becomes clear what it is that they want. So in the packaging portion, when it comes to pricing, I always like to create that and, you know, we've talked about this where you raises prices thie option, you get the one that costs the list, but that doesn't have as many whistles in it, but if you want the one with the whistles than really, you're not concerned about price and you really concerned more about the quality and what we're doing here and then they say, well, you're right, I'm really not as concerned about prices and concerned about the quality, so they're looking for you to guide them into these directions. Ok, so what else do we have? Um so, I mean, I guess other than those types of I really like how you're trying to make it into a pack because that I struggle when I'm listening to all these, when you have a book to offer, you know and of course to offer I don't have those things I have my service and it's so specific to the project, so adding these sort of offering sort of give a another context of something I'm offering to make it a package to to the working family friendly kind of concept or or you know that's that incorporated right, right yeah, I mean so many of my clients also we'll just send me stuff and trust me to art directed and make it you know, make it magic without their presidents so that's why he sent the product back um well yeah, potentially and they go to the same so that it goes to their office well then put something in the box yeah, put something. Yeah, like a robert black you know something? Something fun? Yeah, the rubber chicken here yeah, like a rubber chicken or something like because you you have humor. Yeah, right. We know this about you so you can find the weirdest oddest things and, uh you number them is like a limited edition this's one of ten rubber ducks and this is a number two out of eleven rubber chicken highly collectible highly collectively yeah, like you can make it a thing so that they're like what is this sending this because you have that sort of, you know, fun part about use I go spend they spend days hunting down the weirdest crap and find I consent I could totally do that that will get people talking yeah, he will not believe what the guys sent me send me a rubber chicken what are you going to do with the rubber chicken? I have no clothes but I look it I love it. Okay, good. So s o we let's that uh and then we get people talking yes so we're going to get them talking that's you're going to get him talking with like, weird weird uh we'd gift potentially I mean that's a great idea actually I think it fits right in with kind of the personality my studio and when we're shooting together that wouldn't you know there's always little little hooks little something that comes along that they would fit right in with that. Okay, so very good I did that ok, so I think that's ah couple things we get people talking about yeah, you feel good about that? I do okay good. Any any other feedback for him from life audience do you like the rubber chicken? The rubber chicken is scared it's played my play because yeah, everybody was chuckling. Okay, good. Well, thank you for that. I think we may even have time for one more hot seat and we'll check with the audience. So thank you so much for our who wants to be next john, come on let's let's get you let's get you in the hot seat and good while john is doing that this's one that came in from sherry bear in the chat room who says it's not original, but tried and true, at least for photographers giving a dollar amount off the person session and purchases for every person that they refer and books it's a win win because you get the referrals, and then but the person has to come back and to actually redeem that money off and then hopefully spend more money. Excellent. And I and I'm really glad that this came in so here's how I feel about this it's great, but everybody does it so it will be it's sort of a predictable is a predictable program to me. So if it works great, but I like things that make you go home that are, you know, that if you can find that and that really depends on the specialty off the product and sort of what it exactly is like, you know, with pharaoh there, I mean, I love the rubber chicken. If I was you, I'd be playing that up. I put it on my business card, I make it my logo, you know, because it just has that it says everything about product photography stuff from china, you know, and and oh you know, we could even do the gnome thing traveling rubber chicken you know, like take it with you and send those pictures and we have a gallery and you know and you can win a special price if if you're rubber chicken makes it on our you know, it's endless so I like things that have sort of a something that's really remember that that that makes you remember it excellent. So thank you for joining the hot seat so let's talk about your business a little bit so we talked earlier about, um you know the fine art aspect of your business. So have you figured out which one of the ones you want to do pee approval word of mouth referral program I think it's more ah word of mouth okay, um because in the past I sold in more galleries and I'm trying to more off the website which you can lend towards for the mouth. Wonderful. So what is an approximate price point for your fine art? Um starts in just under four hundred and up for um usually fairly big print. Ok, so how big are they talking by thirty or sometimes the panorama zehr different like sixteen buys however it works out to be okay, okay, great. All right, so let's write down word of mouth have you had any ideas as to what you know how you could create the word of mouth aspect? What? What is it that you can do that special about this that will make people talk about you? Um, well, that's not too much. I was trying to do more siri's for the flower work and then for the landscape, more of area specific. Um, so, um, when I'm in a different area, I was hoping to try to get into having a book on an area so that I could be cambo local author at different kind of places people would go to ok, so you're saying that you are going to create or you have created, like, a serious that's specific to particular area, right, right. So you mentioned about you, all right, all right, so you are photographing sort of fewer flowers or your landscapes around value and then the word of mouth aspect, sort of as somebody would buy it, you give them a book that is specific to this particular area, right? So who does that is carry holum and carrie column is an artist that does thes, you know, really intricate fabulous water colors on on nautical maps. And so when I bought it at the fancy shmancy gallery in hawaii yes, I did, uh and then I got the book, you know, the carry holland book which is, you know, published in scorches. And you see all these other things that that all he wants more paintings. So I think the word of mouth is sort of the talking about it is if you do a serious off flowers in a particular area, then it would only work of this person that buys it is sort of from this area, right? So that it would put it in kind of relationship to them to say, this has opened sort of locally done. Um what? What other ideas do we have that we can come up with a my sick in with the books, giving a bookmark out, um, and then maybe seeds to go with some of the flower work of factual flower? I thought that might be kind of fun, like a stop and smell the roses here they are, um, or like I did love some flowers and pictures that I've been kind of fun if they have packet of some flowers that could grow now that I like that I like because if somebody likes a particular type of a flower, like I like work it's I like tulips. I like lilies are like roses, so if I were to buy a print fine art print from you with two lips and then you'd give me the tulip book and it tells and I would learn in the tulip book that the two live which is one of theirs electoral up so much is the only flower grows in the bars which is why the tulips when they grow they have this like you know, weird uh shape is because they refused to die so of course I'm naturally attracted to that uh it's like they don't give up even if they're cutting and a vase I like that so that I like so if it's in relationship to something that they bought because usually like if somebody buys a flower that's probably like an emotional component to it right or so I like that I think that that will get me talking where you say this is the rose is serious and it comes with the book you know and then you give them a book about roses and this I'm sure plenty of them out there or or you even make your own because you know publishing is so easy these days so you could even create your own serious off off ah flowers okay, so I like that I like that idea that's probably my favorite idea more so than I like the areas specific because I worry about the area specific idea there's only meaningful for people in the area because it's does somebody who lives in santiago care about bellevue right not sure no offense but but I don't think that that would be a good a good connection unless it's abroad a broader idea well in hanseong we've got these like thin phenomenal to lips you know there's tulip fields which is just to die for you know so there's certainly plenty to be photographed what else have you come up? Um sadly that's about it okay all right so how about shall we brainstorm a little bit together with john so if you get a fine art print what could on artist that does find art giveaway as something that will make people talk I did like the seats right? So I do like the idea to say that the brand is to have people get closer to nature which was giorgio keeps idea georgia said that people don't see the beauty they don't look closely enough so she got so close that you can't but notice how beautiful and perfect nature is so if you were to take that idea and take that idea step further and say we also busy so I'm bringing this to you so you can always be reminded that there is an outside that there's always a flower blooming somewhere but more than that with it I give you is my gift because it's really my my sincere intention to make you experience it here's the book and here's secedes and I want you to plant your own garden you know somewhere along those lines and make it in a nice little presentation jen be awesome to take it even a step further and put in a package of greeting cards so that they can share the beauty with their friends and really like just you know just actually share the image and we're gonna pack like in a package of five cards or so that's what they need and then uh oh so do like a postcard rendition off the peace oh I love it was a greeting card of the image that's on their wall and then they can actually we don't get we don't get messages in the mail anymore handwritten notes and stuff like really like you just created it so beautifully beyond today in the sense of like there's beauty everywhere and you know what I thought of you when I saw this and I wanted to share it with you so it's like almost a combination out of a referral and a word of him out that's very very good I'm going to keep you around because I think that would be brilliant and you already put the stamp on it so that they have to mail it that is an excellently generator you already put the stamp on the postcards give him five postcards off the piece that they just bought then you may not need you know and then you may not need to do all this other stuff but that would be a great one and um and then it just says at the bottom of the card I got this beautiful piece from from john yes of whatever the company name is and I think it made me think off you and then I'll get this piece with this beautiful flower and you just thought about me and you bet I'm going to go to your website because I'm going I wonder how much you pay for that and then you have definitely generation yeah one thing I've always been kind of nervous about is if you're selling like a fine our print and then you have it kind of in some ways elite but then yet you're having it on calendars or postcards or anything else doesn't that kind of value that in a way that I make so I'm so glad she asked mommy I'm so glad you asked that so are you in the business of making a living or in the business off worrying about what the people think way covered that so so at the end of the day there's only one thing that counts is the money in your bank account and can you do the things that you want to do and provide for your family the way you want to provide and whoever else is out there that I can't believe jon's doing that well you can be a broken anemia thank you very much but that's not you and that's I think what happened so many times out there is that we are afraid to take these chances off shifting it and changing it up what's there like a reputation police out there is that fine art police out there that says you can do that you can do whatever you want because every entrepreneur who changed the world broken at least one rule people that follow rules don't change the world right people that break the rules so you could be an inspiration for a whole other you know, for whoever kind of comes after you but I you know in any warhol really was was speak on that you know he wanted his stuff to be everywhere he wanted people to use that and so you know, depending on how the concept is developed so what I would do is I would develop the concept along those very lines of saying you know what my concepts are not just that I want that piece for you to have on the wall when you buy this for me you get it back you get the post carts you get the calendar you get the notebook because I want you to enjoy that piece that you just invested in to enrich your life everywhere the only wallet to get you all it's for the kids but the fbi you know, it depends on what your idea is behind your inspiration of doing that. So if it's about engineering something that's off high value in the fine art world and yes, you have to go through the through the path of how the fine art work world works but then I would come in the picture and I would say that's what I do, I would go so how is that working for you? Right? And if it's not working for you, then why would you continue to do this? Then you need to shift it, change it and you need to come up with something that's different you are in seattle, you're not in the world's largest art market. Were you in paris, in milan, in in in new york or, you know, some isn't even in los angeles I would say, you know what there's other things that are place but it also depends on where you are, what? Here in seattle and so this is how I think about this, right? Because it's like first called to order is first called to order is money in the bank create the freedom and take the pressure when the pressure is off you can do what ever you want, but if you have the pressure, you cannot do what you want when you have the pressure, you have to react to what comes toward you I won you get out of that I want to be in front of that so the first thing is like what can we do to get out of that what we can do to get out of that is build a platform based upon who is your buyer here who can we reach here who can you connect with and say listen you know are you busy do you are you suffering from you know especially in seattle with with your high suicide rate here you know, because of bloody rains so much is like do people need to be inspired do people need to get out of there? You know said uh winter disease where they suffer from depression could this you know, could it help people to get through these long rainy winters for having these beautiful flowers in their house sure it would of course it would that's why you did your your calendar to make people look at this every day and say I'm inspired you know it's a little bit of beauty every day so so I would work with that I would work with that and sort of take that because I think what happened with you and I have my coach head on is that you overthe over thinking that you're overthinking this fine art business and it's driving you crazy thank you need to just let that sort of fuzzy stuff go and get back to the basics and say I need to sell let's. Say your piece. The average piece goes, it did say five hundred dollars. I need to sell ten of these a month so I can provide the basics for my family. What's above that is, you know, a better lifestyle. I want a double triple whatever that is, but I need to start with that to take the pressure off, you know, on the photography side. Then I would say in order to get that, what would I need to do to get to that point? Right? Right. And that's, how you engineer you engineered with what you want to get out. So if it's ten thousand dollars, fifteen thousand dollars and the average is five hundred, then you do the math, and then your actions have to, you know, reverse engineer back down to how much you need to do to sell one to sell the prints. So if, right now you selling let's, say, hypothetically speaking, I would so one print a week for let's, say, five hundred dollars, and I make no phone calls and I'm exhibited in one gallery. Then I need to be picking up my telephone and making phone calls, and I need to be going out and more galleries, because if one galleries one print per week then two galleries might be to print for week three galleries might be three prints, but we you know so you just do the math and you just start you know, to pump up the numbers to get to that point. So does this help you a little bit? Yeah, I'm not buying it I you know, I am ok because you know, let's, take the pressure off from from this fine art stuff and really focus on what can we do to put money in the bank? Anyone has a common jen I know it, I feel it when you what you market online doesn't have to be any of the other stuff that's not fine art, but what? What she's creating with the you know, the possibility of the greeting cards in the you know, the back of seeds and all of that is just a bonus on that and that's not what's going to be how you market to the world of what you are you're going to continue to market is a fine art photographer and then when they get those types of things, they're just going to feel special. You say you're working in bellevue, I would be thinking about, you know, when you're in bellevue, where do you see art hung on balls and I would suspect you're going to see them in the hotels, hospitals condominiums, apartment buildings, those sorts of things because they're people where people are buying any large numbers of things so I'd probably go out and trying to figure out who the buyers are those areas find out what type of art they're looking at for and then sort of say how I'm going to adapt my style to put part on those walls and take that part of market. The other thing I would say that with the postcard stuff I wouldn't be worried about the collateral pieces every great artist you have a show with clr museum is always a printed catalog that goes along with it so there's precedent for that, so I wouldn't worry about that that's a smart marketing e wanted to add one more than from some folks at home for you, john and it's. What about publishing a story with every pretty with every piece he says nobody wants a mass print they want something that unique that has a story behind it that they can tell their friends about. For example, we asked the artist to paint photograph this while they were in hawaii because it's one of our favorite places to go and that sounds like that would be something that was more commission, but if there's a story behind how you created that piece, that was something that they could have for themselves. I don't know what you think about that idea ah, certain teeth but I you know again I want to put it serve in relationship to the value of what you selling if you have a ten thousand dollars piece balmy and sit down and write a story write a book haven't hand printed you know then it's really worth it but the you know I want to put it in relationship to what the value is. So if it's a five hundred dollars print than the action no, the follow up action of what makes people talk has to be different than on a ten thousand dollar five thousand dollars deal and it's always about what are you willing to what are you willing to give to somebody who spends that kind of money with you like what? What what what what what can it cost you and then you design what you willing to give away and I agree with the idea off being specific and being unique and being sort of the conversational piece but you know again it's sort of all that it's all it's all the relationship well, john, thank you so much. It was all right, so what do we got next? So this is a wonderful photographer by the name of michelle holden and she you can find her uh at michelle hold on dot com and what we did with her and I bring these in so you you know, again you hear and out there can see that these things really sort of happened and michelle is a fashion photographer and we had come up with the particular branding for her and she's made her a white paper available for everybody to download on michelle hold on dot com she her specialty is the a sort of the contemporary woman right? Because she is a powerful, sophisticated may I say gorgeous and very interesting woman from australia who now lives in new york on dh works in london works in australia, works in new york we had, you know, talked about sort of how she can stand out and she way found that advertising is really changing and this is, you know, sort of part of this authority platform day is that by now you all should have noticed that things are really changing out in the market, that advertising his change, that this is the relationship driven environment you have something to talk about. So we were thinking about what she can talk about. And so we found that advertising for women really had had a couple really big a bad flounders in the last couple of months, like think about the victoria secret campaign where they had the perfect body for everybody, and then the women went nuts and they said, how can victoria's secret determine what is the perfect body right, it was a disaster, then, you know, here, but in the comparison and we have dove who then goes out and says, for every a woman's body slide shift, huge change, everybody loves them millions and millions of hits on youtube in those beautiful videos that they're doing. So michelle did a white paper on the woman off now on why she doesn't want to be marketed to, in a certain way, how she wants to be marketed to that she's making the buying decisions in the first place because most women make buying decisions in all households and in her white paper it says, uh, in, you know, in a two person hold how household generally only one person does the shopping and it's still, I thought there was a brilliant, like leading into this white paper to make the point that it really is that in advertising, why are men advertising to women? Why can't we have women talk about what women like because women, you know, we like what we like, why do we have a man tell us what we need to like or look like? And I think that's really what's shifting in the advertising, especially if you're in the woman market, and so she has generously agreed that we are, you know, that everybody watches can download her white paper and it's on michelle, hold on, dot com all right, and we are almost threw for our authority platform day. Today, we have talked about how you why, why you authority matters and you know why? It is important that you really change and shift your mindset from the selling to the serving and the solving the problem. We've talked about how the selling the hard sell the, you know, one dimensional sale hears me here's my stuff, please buy it is shifting from the relationship to hey, we're all in this together. Let's be friends. Do you like what I'm doing? I'm liking what you're doing. What can we do together kind of thing? So the environment is really shifting. We've talked about, you know, in the wheel in the universe wheel off plaid from building all the different elements that there are in there, we've identified three that you want to start with, that you're comfortable with, so whatever that is, so continue to work on that it's all in the workbooks, the formulas are in the workbooks and take a moment to, you know, maybe tonight and just go over there and see all the other stuff that's in there that we have not talked about because did specifically put formulas in there that will say do this first through this second, do this third to just make it is easy intangibles that possibly could. And then finally, which is talking now about prefer a word of mouth marketing. And what I really liked about that is. I felt that when we were doing the life workshops at the hot seats on this that's sort of, the ideas kind of came together off what that really means. And how do you get talking? How do you get people talking? It is about leaving something behind that that when people go like, wow, I really like that. That was, that was really sweet, you know, it's, just like when you order something from the pet food, online places like a dog bone in it, and you go like, you know, and even so it's, so silly, but it's, just something that everybody really likes and appreciate. So sometimes it's that simple.